2nd AGM leisure battery in the back of the Grand California

[Eber123]

Hello,

In many foren it is mentioned that users are not entirely happy with the battery capacity of the Grand California. 46 Ah useable electricity during an autumn, winter or spring weekend might be not enough.

Reading it up it seems that there are a few different groups 1.) happy with the existing battery capacity (or at least accept it), 2.) users wishing to install a Licitum battery, 3.) users try to connect an portable battery.

In "Caliboard.de" I found a post which explains to add a 2nd AGM battery. Advantages are:

Advantage:

• Minimal change of VW setup (warranty)
• Using all existing electric VW components
• Enough battery capacity for a (cooler) weekend
• Low cost

Disadvantage:

• More weight
• Camper Unit does not show everything correct (but this can be addressed)

I am not sure if I am allowed to point to the webpage with the information, but I do it anyway (@admins if there is a problem just take it out):

Verdopplung der Batteriekapazität im GC - Sparlösung / Einbau einer 2. AGM-Batterie im Stauschrank

Der GC hat insbesondere im Winter zu wenig Batteriekapazität an Bord. Die im Motorraum verbaute 92 Ah-Batterie sollte maximal zur Hälfte entladen werden, hat also eine nutzbare Kapazität von 46 Ah. Kühlschrank und Dieselheizung verbrauchen als Daumenwert im Mittel ca. jeweils 1A die Stunde, d.h. ...

www.caliboard.de

Also as you can (will) see the information is in German, but I am sure Google Translate can help.

Let me repeat, I am not a electric specialist. So, I don't know if this is a good way to address the battery capacity of the Grand California, but to me it looks good. After my LPG is installed I will load up my camper for "long distance" traveling and will weigh it to see if I run into weight problems. If not I will talk to the company who installed the LPG system what they think about this.

What do you think?

Kind regards,
Eberhard

 

[andyinluton]

That was the set up I mentioned in another thread, other than weight I cant see why you couldn't add 2 or 3 more batteries in the same way. It looks a cheap & sensible way of doubling the capacity.

Its basically a new master Big Red on off switch that has additional connections to allow a second battery to be connected & a further leisure battery. All easily reversible if there are warranty concerns. All the chargers & relays etc remain as standard.

 

[Mr T]

That was the set up I mentioned in another thread, other than weight I cant see why you couldn't add 2 or 3 more batteries in the same way. It looks a cheap & sensible way of doubling the capacity.

Its basically a new master Big Red on off switch that has additional connections to allow a second battery to be connected & a further leisure battery. All easily reversible if there are warranty concerns. All the chargers & relays etc remain as standard.

This could be the way to go then, had been considering various options but for obvious reason don't want to change the standard wiring etc. too much until the vehicle is proven to be functioning as it should from factory. I have the 3.88t 600 coming so additional weight is not a big problem.
Thanks @Eber123 for highlighting the thread.

 

[dominichayhoe]

Firstly, the battery is 95ah, not that it makes much difference.

His cost calculations are based on him fitting it, not a qualified electrician.

Finally, there is no inverter or other electronics added into this, so it won't make your 3 pin sockets live.

Add a decent inverter and you're looking at around £350ish which is still much cheaper than going down the lithium route or a separate battery generator like my Jackery.

However, my 1kwh 1kw Jackery cost £995. It takes the 47.5ah capacity of the AGM battery plus Jackery to 120ah usable plus of course adds the ability to use the 3 pin sockets, and no wiring to run or worry about and no warranty issues, and the Jackery is usable outside the motorhome.

I think that's a more comprehensive comparison.

It's definitely not apples and apples.

 

[andyinluton]

It's definitely not apples and apples.

For those of use that are only concerned with running the heating & fridge for longer & have no need for 240v its about £700 cheaper than the Jackery for 1 battery.

For £500 less I could put 2 additional batteries in getting me 142.5 usable.

No point comparing apples with apples if we really wanted bananas.

 

[dominichayhoe]

For those of use that are only concerned with running the heating & fridge for longer & have no need for 240v its about £700 cheaper than the Jackery for 1 battery.

For £500 less I could put 2 additional batteries in getting me 142.5 usable.

No point comparing apples with apples if we really wanted bananas.

Fair points

 

[Mr T]

All good info and comments.
My personal requirement is the ability to last a long weekend without hook-up, keep the beers cold in the fridge, have the some hot water on tap and maybe (diesel) heating on if chilly. I have no real need for 230v sockets when not using hook-up.
Oh and a desire to not modify the electrics too much from factory spec, for the first few months/year until things proven to be reliable.

So based on the above, am I better off with a "Jackery" or an additional 95ah AGM battery?
I have a GC600 with factory fitted solar.
(Ignoring any associated costs of purchase/install))

 

[andyinluton]

I would try with factory set up before doing anything. See how long that lasts & then work out what you need.

 

[WelshGas]

Just a thought. Wiring in an additional leisure battery on the GC is a little involved as the primary leisure battery is under the bonnet but I presume an additional battery would be inside the vehicle?
To avoid any warranty issues and camping off grid just for a long weekend, you could just attach a fully charged 2 nd leisure battery in parallel to the under bonnet battery via a long, high capacity and suitably fused lead and leave the 2nd battery under the van. You could use Anderson connectors and make up a lead attached to the engine leisure battery permenantly in place with the female socket and a lead on the 2nd battery with the male plug.
Just a thought.

 

[andyinluton]

To avoid any warranty issues and camping off grid just for a long weekend, you could just attach a fully charged 2 nd leisure battery in parallel to the under bonnet battery via a long, high capacity and suitably fused lead and leave the 2nd battery under the van.

You are making it too complicated. There is the "big Red switch" in the electrical cupboard at the back of the van, its the isolator for all habitation electrics. for a few quid there is an off the shelf replacement for the isolator that is designed to connect more than one supply, swap the switch & there is room in the cupboard for an additional battery so only short leads required.
Half hour to install & totally reversible.
Pics below original single battery switch V 2 battery switch.
Its top left of each picture

 

[T3Z-GB]

For anyone interested in the above post.

https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B08CZPZ562/?tag=eliteelect-21

 

[dominichayhoe]

You are making it too complicated. There is the "big Red switch" in the electrical cupboard at the back of the van, its the isolator for all habitation electrics. for a few quid there is an off the shelf replacement for the isolator that is designed to connect more than one supply, swap the switch & there is room in the cupboard for an additional battery so only short leads required.
Half hour to install & totally reversible.
Pics below original single battery switch V 2 battery switch.
Its top left of each picture

I'm guessing because the suggestion is to have both batteries running in parallel to double the ampage with no need to turn a switch to access the other batteries storage.

Whereas with this switch you'd have to manually switch between batteries.

 

[Mr T]

I'm guessing because the suggestion is to have both batteries running in parallel to double the ampage with no need to turn a switch to access the other batteries storage.

Whereas with this switch you'd have to manually switch between batteries.

The big red switch is 4 position, off, bat 1, bat 2 or both bat 1 & bat 2. No switching required if you have both batteries selected.

 

[andyinluton]

Whereas with this switch you'd have to manually switch between batteries.

No, there's positions on the switch to use both together or either battery alone.

 

[WelshGas]

Well that’s simple. But no one had mentioned this before.

 

[T3Z-GB]

There is 1 potential issue with the 1+2, if on 1+2 there is possibility it will charge through the 6awg cable, there is a potential issue it’s to small over that distance and may cause overheating.

 

[andyinluton]

Well that’s simple. But no one had mentioned this before.

Apart from the very first post in the thread…..

 

[Mr T]

There is 1 potential issue with the 1+2, if on 1+2 there is possibility it will charge through the 6awg cable, there is a potential issue it’s to small over that distance and may cause overheating.

What do you mean by 1+2?

 

[T3Z-GB]

1+2 would combine batteries through the isolator switch.

 

[Mr T]

1+2 would combine batteries through the isolator switch.

Sorry yes I see what you mean. Nothing is straight forward it would appear!

 

[WelshGas]

Apart from the very first post in the thread…..

Don’t read German and had no intention of spending time translating it all if the OP couldn’t be bothered either.

 

[T3Z-GB]

I think the reality is, the GC was really made for campsites and perhaps the occasional evening wild camping. However anything can be done/done properly with enough money spent.
I’d say a good percentage of people on this site should have custom built including myself, but I think we all bought into the comfort of a large dealer network supporting us, in hindsight, after my dealer experience I won’t make that mistake again. (Once bitten)
In saying all that, Iv learnt a lot and still love the van.

 

[Mr T]

I would try with factory set up before doing anything. See how long that lasts & then work out what you need.

Thanks Andy, I will obviously do that, but based on comments and feedback it is unlikely to last much more than 24hours unless in (UK) summer sun, so want to explore options.
It's also something to think about and plan whilst I'm waiting for delivery!

 

[dominichayhoe]

Has anyone looked at the electrical wiring diagram to be sure that adding the extra battery will mean it still runs to the van back through the intended route, i.e. consumer unit et al?

You can't see from the actual photo, but I would want to be sure that the 2nd battery is wired in correctly, as obviously they are in very different physical locations and this switch may not ensure the 2nd battery's current goes to the isolator area first.

Also as someone else mentioned, that 2nd battery wire from the switch looks a lot thinner than the main battery. It would be wise to replace that.

 

[andyinluton]

@dominichayhoe
As this is about the 12v side of things it has nothing to do with the consumer unit - that is for the 240v supply.

"this switch may not ensure the 2nd battery's current goes to the isolator area first." not sure what you mean, the switch is the isolator.

"that 2nd battery wire from the switch looks a lot thinner than the main battery". Thats not a photo of my van, so am not 100% sure, but to me it looks like the same size cables have been used for the 2nd battery as were used by the factory on the first.
I would suspect the thicker wire is to avoid a voltage drop over the long route from the engine bay to the isolator switch, whereas the thiner wire is going a matter of a few inches from the isolator to the distribution board.

If I was doing the installation I would be inclined to add cube fuses at each end in the same way the the Ocean does.