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Anyone else? Broken wires in ‘93 manual H roof bars

turtletime.dk

turtletime.dk

Messages
14
Location
Denmark & The World
Vehicle
T4 PopTop
So, I have searched to the end of the internet and back and not yet found a single entry of anyone else with the same T4 pop top roof problem as me. Can that really be...??

The problem is that the two wires running vertically inside each side of the H bar system have both broken within the last year.

It is the middle bar of the “H bars” that I use to manually push up/elevate my roof (and pull it back down). Inside each of the two vertical bars is a metal wire connected to some sort of spring that minimizes the weight of the roof significantly. Very clever and an almost unnoticeable feature. Until it breaks!
BUT Yesterday the second wire broke/snapped (the first broke about a year ago). Both due to 28 years of wear and tear I guess :)

Several questions rise from this...:
No. 1: Has anyone else experienced the same???
2: Can I get replacement wires? And where?
3: If not, where can I find a full replacement H frame system? I have search everywhere for that, too...

I really, REALLY hope you guys can help me. The roof has become super heavy now for one person, and I use my California “Turtle” everyday as my only home for the moment, loving each time I sleep “upstairs” even when it’s cold outside :)

C2C85CCA-3D24-4A4A-95B0-EE036FFE17D6.jpeg
The H frame (not my van)

E271EB77-9279-4185-B4BB-3DD509EF67A1.jpeg
The top end of the wire.
 
Calicampin

Calicampin

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T6 Ocean 150
Have you tried a Westfalia dealer like vw campersales to see if they can order spares or somewhere like just campers??
 
Calicampin

Calicampin

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1,016
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Both places are uk based but that shouldn’t be a problem vw campersales are pretty clued up on T4s
 
hotel california

hotel california

18 'till i die....
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Hi Morten , looks like a very specific part , maybe try and do a do it yourself repair?
There are some T4 guru's on this forum who maybe can give better advise then me doh ;)
Germany should have dealers with T4 background .
Also worth a try to give these guys in Holland a mail with your question.
They are the largest VW California dealer in Holland and Westfalia dealer also .

We were in Rømø last year and got to meet you briefly , sorry to hear your adventures not turned out as planned ....we got the word from Henrik&Iben when we were at a meet in Denmark just last september in Bornholm . Denmark is so nice !

EDIT: maby this can help to find parts
 
Last edited:
turtletime.dk

turtletime.dk

Messages
14
Location
Denmark & The World
Vehicle
T4 PopTop
Hi Morten , looks like a very specific part , maybe try and do a do it yourself repair?
There are some T4 guru's on this forum who maybe can give better advise then me doh ;)
Germany should have dealers with T4 background .
Also worth a try to give these guys in Holland a mail with your question.
They are the largest VW California dealer in Holland and Westfalia dealer also .

We were in Rømø last year and got to meet you briefly , sorry to hear your adventures not turned out as planned ....we got the word from Henrik&Iben when we were at a meet in Denmark just last september in Bornholm . Denmark is so nice !

EDIT: maby this can help to find parts
Yes, I recognize your alias, too :) The Rømø Meet was a great time. Did you have time to watch the kite festival on the nearby beach on departure day??
And thanks a lot! Well, my life didn’t turn out as hoped in that regard unfortunately... :/ Now, I just hope a new door opens when another closes! :)

Thanks for the Dutch link - and for the oem database. That was a great help:
Support frame” 701070723A and B seems to be the correct part. However, the wire must be hidden inside the frame I guess? Cant seem to find it in the diagramme.
 
mrcheesbrough

mrcheesbrough

Messages
776
Location
Wiltshire
Vehicle
T4 PopTop
So, I have searched to the end of the internet and back and not yet found a single entry of anyone else with the same T4 pop top roof problem as me. Can that really be...??

The problem is that the two wires running vertically inside each side of the H bar system have both broken within the last year.

It is the middle bar of the “H bars” that I use to manually push up/elevate my roof (and pull it back down). Inside each of the two vertical bars is a metal wire connected to some sort of spring that minimizes the weight of the roof significantly. Very clever and an almost unnoticeable feature. Until it breaks!
BUT Yesterday the second wire broke/snapped (the first broke about a year ago). Both due to 28 years of wear and tear I guess :)

Several questions rise from this...:
No. 1: Has anyone else experienced the same???
2: Can I get replacement wires? And where?
3: If not, where can I find a full replacement H frame system? I have search everywhere for that, too...

I really, REALLY hope you guys can help me. The roof has become super heavy now for one person, and I use my California “Turtle” everyday as my only home for the moment, loving each time I sleep “upstairs” even when it’s cold outside :)

View attachment 52805
The H frame (not my van)

View attachment 52806
The top end of the wire.
Hey there. It seems pretty rare for this to happen but I have read of a few people who’s roof has suffered the same problem. I don’t remember what the fix was,or if they ever actually resolved the problem. As an alternative you could consider retrofitting the later type gas strut lifter like the kit sold here - https://www.vwbusshop.de/epages/GuenzlClassicParts.sf/en_GB/?ObjectPath=/Shops/GuenzlClassicParts/Products/218010113025

It could be worth dropping them an email to check how easy it would be to swap. Let us know how you get on.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
 
Beeechke1

Beeechke1

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Messages
88
Location
Redhill Surrey
Vehicle
T5 SE 180
So, I have searched to the end of the internet and back and not yet found a single entry of anyone else with the same T4 pop top roof problem as me. Can that really be...??

The problem is that the two wires running vertically inside each side of the H bar system have both broken within the last year.

It is the middle bar of the “H bars” that I use to manually push up/elevate my roof (and pull it back down). Inside each of the two vertical bars is a metal wire connected to some sort of spring that minimizes the weight of the roof significantly. Very clever and an almost unnoticeable feature. Until it breaks!
BUT Yesterday the second wire broke/snapped (the first broke about a year ago). Both due to 28 years of wear and tear I guess :)

Several questions rise from this...:
No. 1: Has anyone else experienced the same???
2: Can I get replacement wires? And where?
3: If not, where can I find a full replacement H frame system? I have search everywhere for that, too...

I really, REALLY hope you guys can help me. The roof has become super heavy now for one person, and I use my California “Turtle” everyday as my only home for the moment, loving each time I sleep “upstairs” even when it’s cold outside :)

View attachment 52805
The H frame (not my van)

View attachment 52806
The top end of the wire.
Hi If you are unable to find the right part you may be able to make one using one of these or other similar cable? If you google "lawn mower cables" you should find a supplier.
1574239561941.png
 
sidepod

sidepod

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T4 PopTop
Blimey, never even knew there were wires in there? Springs also?

Workshop manual doesn't show them.

1574255338585.png
 
sidepod

sidepod

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My previous van had this system. The roof was a firm push but I'd never describe it as "heavy"?
If there are no springs on the end of the wire (garage door style) then I can't see what their purpose is?
 
sidepod

sidepod

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Sound like a creative solution with either bicycle brake cables and some small clamps is required.
30 mins max.:)
 
turtletime.dk

turtletime.dk

Messages
14
Location
Denmark & The World
Vehicle
T4 PopTop
Sound like a creative solution with either bicycle brake cables and some small clamps is required.
30 mins max.:)
30 min.?.?.? Noooo, no way!!!
Because in order to get “in there”, inside the vertical tube, I must remove the H-frame completely first ;)

If there is a spring inside? I’m not 100% sure, because I have put up with the heavy roof for now and not taken anything apart yet; but I’m almost certain there are springs in there:
1: The roof is much heavier now
2: what other pupose could there be of putting wires inside? (if you look closely on a not-broken pop top H frame, you can actually see the wire in the joint between the upper and lower vertical pole.

I’ll share that info and which solution end I end up with once spring returns to Denmark and I can begin the operation. For now I need the van - heavy roof or not
 
Chriswoody

Chriswoody

Messages
83
Location
Northern Germany
Vehicle
T4 PopTop
Like Sidepod, I never knew there was a wire hidden in there. My roof has always been a heavy b**er to lift, but I just thought that was normal. I love the H frame though, it gives me an extra place to hang things, like towels, to dry.

Next time I drag the van out of the garage I'm going to have a nose and see if I have one in there. Sorry I can't help you with your problem though.
 
pureinla

pureinla

Messages
28
Location
Prince George, British Columbia, Canada
Vehicle
T4 Hightop
Gowesty in the states sells a kit to add the gas struts to assist lifting the roof with (or without) the H bar. I did it on my last poptop and it was an excellent upgrade. Lift the top about 6" and the gas struts take it the rest of the way. You can then lock it by extending the H bar like you'd normally do. Could be an alternative fix.
 
sidepod

sidepod

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The later versions have gas struts. Big step backwards in my op. The use of individual struts allows the roof to twist when you lower it. Not ideal. The H frame keeps everything square and straight, as well as providing somewhere to hang stuff.
I’m considering making my own H frame to replace my struts.
 
WelshGas

WelshGas

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T5 SE 180 4Motion
The later versions have gas struts. Big step backwards in my op. The use of individual struts allows the roof to twist when you lower it. Not ideal. The H frame keeps everything square and straight, as well as providing somewhere to hang stuff.
I’m considering making my own H frame to replace my struts.
Surely fitting the Gas Struts as @pureinla has done, while keeping the H frame, is the best of both worlds.
 
sidepod

sidepod

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Ah i missed that bit. Use both? Nice.
 

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