lorax
VIP Member
Having just seen mention of a possible ringed van on this thread I thought the time had come to post my story! Apologies that it's a bit of a long one, but it may be of interest...
I bought a 1997 150PS T4 California Freestyle TDI off eBay at the end of 2013, in excellent condition, with 145,000km on the clock, for a good but not suspiciously low price. It was a recent import from Poland, but I checked it out thoroughly - the VINs matched the V5, the HPI check was clear, and the guy I bought it from had excellent eBay feedback. I paid cash (which was stupid of me) and picked it up from his house in north London. I thought I had done everything I could do to check it out.
The next day I spoke to a VW campervan dealer I knew - I'd been keeping an eye on his stock list for ages but could never afford any of his vans. He'd always been very helpful so I wanted to give him some business - RHD headlights, an MPH speedo, habitation check, etc. However, the first thing he asked when I mentioned the van was whether it was 'that black one off eBay', because if so it was almost certainly ringed. It turned out that he had already seen it on eBay and had spotted immediately that the spec was that of a 2003, not a 1997 - as I now know the Freestyle was only made in 2003-2004, so it couldn't have been a 1997 vehicle. With heavy heart I drove down there a few days later, and it turned out my van had two VINs in different places: one from a blue 1997 Transporter, and one from a 2003 California.
I had a vague idea what a ringer was, but I now know all about it! They get hold of a legitimate van that's been a write-off or something like that, then fit its VIN plates to a stolen vehicle, thus giving the stolen vehicle a legitimate identity.
I spoke to the police the next day. I had to cancel my insurance as it was a stolen van, and I was thus not the owner, so I also had to declare SORN and leave it on my driveway. The police contacted Interpol, through whom I was contacted by the UK agents for a German insurance company: it turned out that it had been stolen from a German family over the summer, then taken to Poland which is presumably where it was ringed, then driven over here. The true owners were the German insurers, and in the end, after a lot of to-ing and fro-ing, I had to pay them a large chunk of money to secure title to it and become the legal owner of the van I thought had bought 7 months earlier!
Once I paid the German insurers I was sent the original German registration documents, and the original keys - the key blades didn't work but the central locking remotes worked fine. I had the details of the previous owners so I contacted them and found out more about the story. They had bought the van from new, picking it up from the VW factory, and had used it for their family holidays for 10 years. The 145,000km mileage was genuine, and it had clearly been well looked after. I actually ended up driving to see them in Germany, and picked up a few bits and pieces from them, as well as buying their winter tyres on steel wheels for a good price. They had a new T5 California in the drive...
I found out from the dealer who had spotted the problem that he knew of someone else who had bought from the same man on eBay, and had also ended up with a ringed vehicle. But unlike mine, which was newer and better than I had thought, his was a disaster, and had caused endless problems. Despite all this the police did nothing to prosecute (they never even inspected my van), and as far as I'm aware the man is still trading, but under a different identity. The most helpful person was the local trading standards officer, who was absolutely fantastic, and my main ally throughout. Thanks to prompting from him, almost a year after buying the van I contacted the original seller who, despite protesting his innocence and denying any liability, refunded me a decent chunk of money, which went some way to me recovering the money I had paid the German insurance company.
I went through a lot of hassle - it took me almost a year to get everything sorted. But I ended up with one of the last T4 Californias, with the 150PS engine, that had been owned from new by a very careful German family, at a fair price. It may be that no one will ever want to buy it from me given this background (not that I've got any plans to sell!), but if so I'll just keep it until it gives up - it's still under 100,000 miles so that will probably be quite a while...
I bought a 1997 150PS T4 California Freestyle TDI off eBay at the end of 2013, in excellent condition, with 145,000km on the clock, for a good but not suspiciously low price. It was a recent import from Poland, but I checked it out thoroughly - the VINs matched the V5, the HPI check was clear, and the guy I bought it from had excellent eBay feedback. I paid cash (which was stupid of me) and picked it up from his house in north London. I thought I had done everything I could do to check it out.
The next day I spoke to a VW campervan dealer I knew - I'd been keeping an eye on his stock list for ages but could never afford any of his vans. He'd always been very helpful so I wanted to give him some business - RHD headlights, an MPH speedo, habitation check, etc. However, the first thing he asked when I mentioned the van was whether it was 'that black one off eBay', because if so it was almost certainly ringed. It turned out that he had already seen it on eBay and had spotted immediately that the spec was that of a 2003, not a 1997 - as I now know the Freestyle was only made in 2003-2004, so it couldn't have been a 1997 vehicle. With heavy heart I drove down there a few days later, and it turned out my van had two VINs in different places: one from a blue 1997 Transporter, and one from a 2003 California.
I had a vague idea what a ringer was, but I now know all about it! They get hold of a legitimate van that's been a write-off or something like that, then fit its VIN plates to a stolen vehicle, thus giving the stolen vehicle a legitimate identity.
I spoke to the police the next day. I had to cancel my insurance as it was a stolen van, and I was thus not the owner, so I also had to declare SORN and leave it on my driveway. The police contacted Interpol, through whom I was contacted by the UK agents for a German insurance company: it turned out that it had been stolen from a German family over the summer, then taken to Poland which is presumably where it was ringed, then driven over here. The true owners were the German insurers, and in the end, after a lot of to-ing and fro-ing, I had to pay them a large chunk of money to secure title to it and become the legal owner of the van I thought had bought 7 months earlier!
Once I paid the German insurers I was sent the original German registration documents, and the original keys - the key blades didn't work but the central locking remotes worked fine. I had the details of the previous owners so I contacted them and found out more about the story. They had bought the van from new, picking it up from the VW factory, and had used it for their family holidays for 10 years. The 145,000km mileage was genuine, and it had clearly been well looked after. I actually ended up driving to see them in Germany, and picked up a few bits and pieces from them, as well as buying their winter tyres on steel wheels for a good price. They had a new T5 California in the drive...
I found out from the dealer who had spotted the problem that he knew of someone else who had bought from the same man on eBay, and had also ended up with a ringed vehicle. But unlike mine, which was newer and better than I had thought, his was a disaster, and had caused endless problems. Despite all this the police did nothing to prosecute (they never even inspected my van), and as far as I'm aware the man is still trading, but under a different identity. The most helpful person was the local trading standards officer, who was absolutely fantastic, and my main ally throughout. Thanks to prompting from him, almost a year after buying the van I contacted the original seller who, despite protesting his innocence and denying any liability, refunded me a decent chunk of money, which went some way to me recovering the money I had paid the German insurance company.
I went through a lot of hassle - it took me almost a year to get everything sorted. But I ended up with one of the last T4 Californias, with the 150PS engine, that had been owned from new by a very careful German family, at a fair price. It may be that no one will ever want to buy it from me given this background (not that I've got any plans to sell!), but if so I'll just keep it until it gives up - it's still under 100,000 miles so that will probably be quite a while...
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