Cheap hollidays

[Amarillo]

I think that cheap foreign holidays will become a thing of the past as Governments use the drop in air travel during the pandemic to meet to meet climate goals and charge duty on leisure flights.

 

[WelshGas]

I think that cheap foreign holidays will become a thing of the past as Governments use the drop in air travel during the pandemic to meet to meet climate goals and charge duty on leisure flights.

That is very dependant on what the Public wants at the next election, also the recipient countries that depend on oversea tourists would have an impact.
Democratic Governments are dependent on the voting electorate.

 

[Amarillo]

That is very dependant on what the Public wants at the next election, also the recipient countries that depend on oversea tourists would have an impact.
Democratic Governments are dependent on the voting electorate.

A possible alternative for European travel?

The dream ticket: sleeper trains could soon run from London to Europe’s cities

An ambitious plan to take overnight services through the Channel tunnel reflects a growing interest in sustainable travel

amp.theguardian.com

 

[Joker 1299]

A possible alternative for European travel?

The dream ticket: sleeper trains could soon run from London to Europe’s cities

An ambitious plan to take overnight services through the Channel tunnel reflects a growing interest in sustainable travel

amp.theguardian.com

Presumably, the trains will have to offload all their ham and cheese sandwiches half way across the channel?

 

[Meoncoast]

as Governments use the drop in air travel during the pandemic to meet to meet climate goals and charge duty on leisure flights.

So that is why Borough Council (Eastleigh) has just voted to extend Southampton Airport's runway

 

[Amarillo]

So that is why Borough Council (Eastleigh) has just voted to extend Southampton Airport's runway

They continued to expand the canal network to compete with the railways. If I were a shareholder in Eastleigh Airport I’d be looking to sell.

And Boris Johnson has vowed to lie down in front of the bulldozers when they start to construct Heathrow’s third runway.

(Whatever I think of the rights and wrongs of airport expansion, I’d pay handsomely to drive that bulldozer.)

 

[Jay gas]

A possible alternative for European travel?

The dream ticket: sleeper trains could soon run from London to Europe’s cities

An ambitious plan to take overnight services through the Channel tunnel reflects a growing interest in sustainable travel

amp.theguardian.com

What has higher emissions and is more damaging to the environment the trains or the planes ?????

 

[WelshGas]

What has higher emissions and is more damaging to the environment the trains or the planes ?????

Royal Borough of Greenwich. All those chickens.

 

[Velma's Dad]

And Boris Johnson has vowed to lie down in front of the bulldozers when they start to construct Heathrow’s third runway.

We live in hope of seeing that. Will it be before or after the border in the Irish Sea has been implemented over his dead body? (13 Aug 2020)

But on the original question, it would presumably be economically advantageous to encourage more Brits to holiday within the UK (while aiming not to deter too much inbound tourism at the same time of course). I think that will be as much about improving 'pull' from UK destinations as on making flights more expensive.

More campervanning would be part of the answer, if we could only get our acts together to increase the supply of 'good' camping infrastructure - in a way that's sensitive to landscapes/environments. Eg make planning consents easier, even in national parks, for small-medium sized campsite/aires but only if they are judged to be well designed and sustainable. At the moment a high proportion of campsites are pretty crap, and only a small proportion are places I really want to stay at. Having spent a lot of money on a nice campervan, and driven it through gorgeous British landscapes, having to put up with a grungy campsite suggests to me we haven't got the balance right yet.

Maybe create more NC500-style routes in other parts of the UK, with plenty of designated stop-offs for recharging EV campervans.

 

[WelshGas]

We’ll need HS2, Heathrow 3rd runway, Irish Tunnel and local airport expansions for 2030 when the EV revolution fails to deliver for the Common Man .
We’ll need the extra capacity for public transport within the U.K. for people and merchandise as well as International Travel. People are not going to be corralled within the U.K. and National or International travel is not going to be provided by the EV revolution for the general public.

 

[westfalia]

I think that cheap foreign holidays will become a thing of the past as Governments use the drop in air travel during the pandemic to meet to meet climate goals and charge duty on leisure flights.

Air travel declined by 75.6 per cent last year. But climate change experts insist this had a negligible effect on global warming, which continued apace.
Previously we were told that hopping on a plane was an environmental crime.

 

[Joker 1299]

Air travel declined by 75.6 per cent last year. But climate change experts insist this had a negligible effect on global warming, which continued apace.
Previously we were told that hopping on a plane was an environmental crime.

Just goes to show, you can’t win. Still, it’s the taking part that counts!

 

[Amarillo]

Air travel declined by 75.6 per cent last year. But climate change experts insist this had a negligible effect on global warming, which continued apace.
Previously we were told that hopping on a plane was an environmental crime.

I’m surprised it didn’t decline by more than that. We live under one of the flight paths into Heathrow, and even in distant SE London I used to be woken at 5.50 every morning as the first big aircraft of the day rumbled over. It has been really peaceful these last 12 months.

I wouldn’t expect a big change in the rate of global heating in just 12 months of reduced flights. I expect it will take decades to reverse the trend.

 

[Velma's Dad]

Aviation only accounts for about 2.5% of global CO2 emissions (okay equivalent to 3.5% if you account for other carbon-forcing effects) so you wouldn't expect a substantial change on CC indicators from a short term reduction in flights.

(I'm not saying air travel isn't an issue, it's projected to become a much bigger share of emissions, as demand grows and emissions from other sources are decreased.)

 

[Amarillo]

What has higher emissions and is more damaging to the environment the trains or the planes ?????

Short-haul economy flight 156g CO2 per passenger Km

International train (Eurostar) 6g CO2 per passenger Km

Travelling to Barcelona by train would emit about 26 times less CO2 than flying.

Carbon footprint of travel per kilometer

The carbon footprint of travel is measured in grams of carbon dioxide-equivalents per passenger kilometer. This includes the impact of increased warming from aviation emissions at altitude.

ourworldindata.org

 

[willwander]

France moves to ban short-haul domestic flights

MPs vote to stop flights where the journey could be made by train in under 2.5 hours.

www.bbc.co.uk

Someone has to pay for those train contract kickbacks

 

[WelshGas]

Short-haul economy flight 156g CO2 per passenger Km

International train (Eurostar) 6g CO2 per passenger Km

Travelling to Barcelona by train would emit about 26 times less CO2 than flying.

Carbon footprint of travel per kilometer

The carbon footprint of travel is measured in grams of carbon dioxide-equivalents per passenger kilometer. This includes the impact of increased warming from aviation emissions at altitude.

ourworldindata.org

2 hrs by plane, 23 hrs by train.

Not many families would pick a 23 hr train trip with a young family.

 

[Amarillo]

I think that cheap foreign holidays will become a thing of the past as Governments use the drop in air travel during the pandemic to meet to meet climate goals and charge duty on leisure flights.

And it begins with domestic flights...

France moves to ban short-haul domestic flights - BBC News

MPs vote to stop flights where the journey could be made by train in under 2.5 hours.

www.bbc.co.uk

 

[Amarillo]

2 hrs by plane, 23 hrs by train.

Not many families would pick a 23 hr train trip with a young family.

It is probably more like 6 hours with travel to and from airports and having to arrive 1-2 hrs before departure. But I take you point. Direct rail routes like London to Paris make more sense. And it is that sort of direct route, but longer, they hope to expand with overnight sleepers.

 

[andyinluton]

2 hrs by plane, 23 hrs by train.

Not many families would pick a 23 hr train trip with a young family.

Its not 24 hours by train, you can go tomorrow in 13 hours, 4 of those are waiting in Paris for the second train.
So if sensible you could do London to Paris one day, have a day in Paris then catch the train to Spain the next day, having used the Eurostar to the South of France a few times its a very civilised way to travel.

Add on the minimum check ins etc at the airport & its not 2 hours.

Itinerary for tomorrows train below:



07:52 London St-Pancras 12h 56m
1 change. 21:48 Barcelona Sants
Duration 12h 56min, 1 change
07:52
London St-Pancras
2h 25m
ES 9008
WiFi
Power outlet
11:17
Paris Gare du Nord
3h 57m to change stations
15:14
Paris Gare de Lyon
6h 34m
TGV 9715
21:48
Barcelona Sants

 

[66tim99]

2 hrs by plane, 23 hrs by train.

Not many families would pick a 23 hr train trip with a young family.

Which might help the decision to holiday closer to home?

 

[Amarillo]

Its not 24 hours by train, you can go tomorrow in 13 hours, 4 of those are waiting in Paris for the second train.
So if sensible you could do London to Paris one day, have a day in Paris then catch the train to Spain the next day, having used the Eurostar to the South of France a few times its a very civilised way to travel.

Add on the minimum check ins etc at the airport & its not 2 hours.

Itinerary for tomorrows train below:



07:52 London St-Pancras 12h 56m
1 change. 21:48 Barcelona Sants
Duration 12h 56min, 1 change
07:52
London St-Pancras
2h 25m
ES 9008
WiFi
Power outlet
11:17
Paris Gare du Nord
3h 57m to change stations
15:14
Paris Gare de Lyon
6h 34m
TGV 9715
21:48
Barcelona Sants

So if a direct service was introduced, London to Barcelona could be as little as 9 hours?

 

[WelshGas]

Its not 24 hours by train, you can go tomorrow in 13 hours, 4 of those are waiting in Paris for the second train.
So if sensible you could do London to Paris one day, have a day in Paris then catch the train to Spain the next day, having used the Eurostar to the South of France a few times its a very civilised way to travel.

Add on the minimum check ins etc at the airport & its not 2 hours.

Itinerary for tomorrows train below:



07:52 London St-Pancras 12h 56m
1 change. 21:48 Barcelona Sants
Duration 12h 56min, 1 change
07:52
London St-Pancras
2h 25m
ES 9008
WiFi
Power outlet
11:17
Paris Gare du Nord
3h 57m to change stations
15:14
Paris Gare de Lyon
6h 34m
TGV 9715
21:48
Barcelona Sants

To be expected.

 

[WelshGas]

Which might help the decision to holiday closer to home?

Cuckoo land. Might work for some, but the majority , not in a month of Sundays.

 

[66tim99]

Cuckoo land. Might work for some, but the majority , not in a month of Sundays.

That's where leadership fails us currently. Prices should help people make the most sustainable decision.