4motion and winter tyres Versus 2 wheel drive and winter tyr

[Confuserated]

Hi all,

Just wondering what you think about the post topic, do you think a normal Cali with a set of steels and winter tyres will be good enough for a wet n muddy campsite or do you think the only way to go is 4motion and winters?

I'm just a bit concerned about the extra cost/complication/running costs off the 4motion over a normal jobbie. I'm not thinking of doing the Paris-Dhakar or anything more adventurous than normal camping.

Thanks

 

[GrannyJen]

Re: 4motion and winter tyres Versus 2 wheel drive and winter

I used to do a lot of winter caravanning, towing my little white box with either Disco or range rover, and I lost count of the number of times I would be the most popular person on the camp site because of my vehicle. A sudden downpour on an already soaked field and I would end up winching or towing half the "residents" off.

When I migrated to motor homes, and still did a lot of winter camping, I became incredibly frustrated with the places I couldn't get to.

horses for courses but I am buying a Cali to get me to places that towed vehicles or larger motor homes can't get to and for that reason alone I've gone for 4WD.

 

[briwy]

Re: 4motion and winter tyres Versus 2 wheel drive and winter

We were away a couple of weeks ago with our cousins who have a converted 2wd T5 camping on a wet & muddy field.
They got stuck, we didn't in 4wd. Ordinary tyres on both. Cold weather tyres going on this weekend.
Personal preference really but obviously 4wd will give better traction in bad conditions.

 

[Confuserated]

Re: 4motion and winter tyres Versus 2 wheel drive and winter

I'm intrigued because we know that a 2 wheel drive car on winters will best a 4 wheel drive on all season tyres, so especially interested in anyone who has used winters on 2 wheel drive to get them out of trouble.

I guess it's only really 1 wheel drive in reality, as at least you have the option of a diff lock on the 4 motion...

Thanks for the responses, I prefer the idea of a go anywhere vehicle, just wondering of the reality is anything like the expectation.

 

[Barryjm]

Re: 4motion and winter tyres Versus 2 wheel drive and winter

Use winter tyres all year on my Cali, had them fitted in April, but as the summer has been pretty good they have not really been tested yet. Normal tyres were completely useless on anything but tarmac! Not much use for a campervan, in my opinion.

BTW mine is 2 wheel drive.

Sent from my HTC One X using Tapatalk

 

[KernowLad]

Re: 4motion and winter tyres Versus 2 wheel drive and winter

We've also been fine in mud where many others (including FWD T5s) have been stuck with Summers and 4Motion.

We've just stuck (today) Winters on the car as that's our distance machine for work trips. It rarely snows in Cornwall and we aren't likely to take the Cali far over the Winter.

 

[Goldie]

Re: 4motion and winter tyres Versus 2 wheel drive and winter

Having the right tyres is the key thing. My wife's front wheel drive Golf on Winter tyres is far superior to my 4x4 Yeti on Summer tyres once the snow comes.

No doubt the 4 motion will be better, but how often you venture into that wet and muddy field is a risk you have to take weighed against the cost and fuel consumption of 4x4!

I've seen the situation at Silverstone that once a few cars get bogged down near the entrance everyone is stuck, even in 4x4 Discos etc. The same thing happens in the winter snow the first things to get stuck are the BMWs with their rear wheel drive.

Didn't they do a camping trip or similar on top gear where the Golf gets out of a wet field and the Volvo was stuck on wet and greasy slope?

Andy

 

[bvddobb]

Re: 4motion and winter tyres Versus 2 wheel drive and winter

Thanks for the responses, I prefer the idea of a go anywhere vehicle, just wondering of the reality is anything like the expectation.

If you want to get an idea of how much 'reality' there is in the 4Motion as a 'go-anywhere' vehicle, there are many very impressive movies on Youtube.

Just some examples:

• 4Motion off road in Iceland
• 4Motion in the Sahara
• 4Motion in fresh snow

But you will find many more! It helped us choose the 4Motion. With previous campers we have been stuck on muddy campsites before...

We haven't been off roading in Iceland or the Sahara ourselves yet , but we will! We have our first 4WD course with it on Dec 7. We discussed with the instructors beforehand, because they only feature Landrovers etc. on their site and brochures, but they said we were most welcome with the 4Motion, and in their experience the car can do everything they have on their course. So, we will see! :cool

 

[Confuserated]

Re: 4motion and winter tyres Versus 2 wheel drive and winter

What a hoot! They clearly didn't give a monkey's about scratching their t5s! Not sure I would be the same though!

 

[robo]

Re: 4motion and winter tyres Versus 2 wheel drive and winter

Offroad training sounds like fun Bart.

rob

 

[sidepod]

Re: 4motion and winter tyres Versus 2 wheel drive and winter

I'm intrigued because we know that a 2 wheel drive car on winters will best a 4 wheel drive on all season tyres

?? Really? That I'd like to see.

 

[Confuserated]

Re: 4motion and winter tyres Versus 2 wheel drive and winter

There are lots of tests around the web showing 2 wheel drive with winter tyres beating the traction of 4 wheel drive with normal tyres. Autocar even had a video up last winter, not sure what would be different on the t5 compared to a car though.

 

[andys495]

Re: 4motion and winter tyres Versus 2 wheel drive and winter

Having driven a 4x4 on normal tyres and now my two wheel drive Cali on winter tyres in the snow I tend to agree with the above.

 

[sidepod]

Re: 4motion and winter tyres Versus 2 wheel drive and winter

Shame Audi didn't know that. Could have saved themselves millions developing the Quattro.

Perhaps VW should remove the 4Mo from their line up and just offer a couple of winter tyres as an option?

I'm well aware of the huge benefits of winter tyres and their different compounds but seriously,better than 4x4?


S.

 

[teeboy]

Re: 4motion and winter tyres Versus 2 wheel drive and winter

Logic would suggest that:

2WD on Normal v's 4WD on Normal = 4WD Win
2WD on Winter v's 4WD on Winter = 4WD Win

And in my mind I would have assumed that:

2WD on Winter v's 4WD on Normal would still be a 4WD Win

But this is from a person who has not had winter tyres before - I have just put a set on my BMW. Is it wrong that I am looking forward to some bad weather to give them ago.

I am even more excited that I might be better off than a 4WD car with normal tyres on (although I appreciate that a BMW will always be a bit scary in the snow!!!)

T

 

[Californiaman]

Re: 4motion and winter tyres Versus 2 wheel drive and winter

There has got to be a tipping point where even with 4x4 normal tyres provide less grip that tyres designed to provide grip at lower temperatures.

I would have thought that at normal temperatures on mud/grass 4x4 would beat a FWD with snow tyres every time.

I've always had 4x4's of some description - we have two in addition to the Cali; a Navara and a Jimny that are daily drivers. I deliberately didn't get 4x4 on the Cali as I would have lost my self control at some point and ended up driving down a track into a bottomless pit of despair. I always manage it. 4x4 seems like a great idea until you are upside down in a ditch. It doesn't help much then...

I also don't want to camp in muddy, boggy campsites...

I think the FWD Cali is brilliant in the snow. I also have some snow socks - which are apparently very good (but which I haven't tried yet).

I also have a set of snow chains that I brought back from Canada after a long road trip in a rental. I never want to use them though!

You can also drop your tyre pressures to get a little more grip if you really need it...

I also like the idea of being snow bound in my Cali, provided I have diesel for heat, beer and tea.

A friend of mine had winter tyres for teh first time last year on a Mondeo - he was amazed by the difference. He was very smug until the punctures started. It may have been a coincidence or it may have been because the low temp tyres are softer... who knows..

I don't think any of that helps? :lol:

 

[Confuserated]

Re: 4motion and winter tyres Versus 2 wheel drive and winter

Nope, really confused now [SMILING FACE WITH SMILING EYES]

I guess my question is about the tipping point and is there one on normal muddy fields, I thought the tread pattern on winters was more coarse as well.

Just trying to see if I can get away with a more aggressive tyre pattern (winters) only or whether I need 4motion as well really. I think I may be being swayed by the reports on here about 4wd transmission problems, if nobody had mentioned any problems I doubt I would even be thinking about this...

 

[sidepod]

Re: 4motion and winter tyres Versus 2 wheel drive and winter

I've just watched the Autocar test, back-to-back Skoda Yetis, one with 2wd/winter tyres, the other with 4x4 and standard tyres.

The 4x4 is a clear winner in a straight line traction based acceleration test.

The 2wd/winter tyre wins in cornering and braking.

The thing is, no body buys a 4x4 for cornering or braking. A 4x4 will get you out of a tight spot when traction is all that matters.

It's ironic perhaps that if you fit winter tyres, the day you use them in anger is the day you get hit from behind !!

http://www.autocar.co.uk/car-video/winter-tyres-vs-4x4


S.

 

[Californiaman]

Re: 4motion and winter tyres Versus 2 wheel drive and winter

Absolutely spot on! I've found various 4x4s have been great in the deep snow on the back roads etc but not so clever when some arse is coming at you sideways or backwards or when the main roads are totally blocked with muppets.

Thta said, if I had more self control, I would have 4motion on a Cali like a shot - I believe it to be very good. :lol:

 

[Confuserated]

Re: 4motion and winter tyres Versus 2 wheel drive and winter

Oh well, in guess I'm back to staring at the reliability aspect again then

 

[Californiaman]

Re: 4motion and winter tyres Versus 2 wheel drive and winter

VW have sold thousands amd thousands and I've only ever heard a handful of complaints. I've a mate with an early T5 Cali 4motion - he does a lot of sometimes quite serious off-road getting to and from Enduros, rallies and trials events and he absolutely swears by it.

 

[sidepod]

Re: 4motion and winter tyres Versus 2 wheel drive and winter

If it's pure grip on a muddy campsite you're after then just go for a town and country tyre.
It'll wear quicker and probably be noisier. No free lunches here I'm affraid.

Most campsites have a resident old Landy or tractor to pull you out.

I almost got stuck on a site a few weeks ago. You could've played snooker on it, it was so flat.
A torrential downpour a few hours earlier had turned the grass into ice. I couldn't work out what was going on? Foot off the clutch in first and going nowhere. I thought something had broken until I stuck my head out of the window. Wheels gently turning on tick over.

S.

 

[Confuserated]

Re: 4motion and winter tyres Versus 2 wheel drive and winter

Blimey!

What I would really like, of course, is a button on the dash I can press to extend the spikes out of the tyres

I saw a YouTube vid of a range rover in much the same circumstances, totally flat ground,, but muddy, just going nowhere!

 

[Confuserated]

Re: 4motion and winter tyres Versus 2 wheel drive and winter

I've just watched the Autocar test, back-to-back Skoda Yetis, one with 2wd/winter tyres, the other with 4x4 and standard tyres.

The 4x4 is a clear winner in a straight line traction based acceleration test.

The 2wd/winter tyre wins in cornering and braking.

The thing is, no body buys a 4x4 for cornering or braking. A 4x4 will get you out of a tight spot when traction is all that matters.

It's ironic perhaps that if you fit winter tyres, the day you use them in anger is the day you get hit from behind !!

http://www.autocar.co.uk/car-video/winter-tyres-vs-4x4


S.

It looked to me like the normal tyred yeti hit on the camera on the brake test

Grunted, cornering ability wasn't much what I was after.

 

[TwentyOneThirtyFive]

Re: 4motion and winter tyres Versus 2 wheel drive and winter

Wheels gently turning on tick over.

Generally the problem on wet grass is getting traction in the first place. Once moving things tend to be okay, although I did have to hoof it up the hill out of the Gordale Scar campsite in the wet...

We carry 2 cheap rubber door mats and park up with them under the front wheels if it looks problematic, that's always been enough to get us moving so far. Also, our vans go backwards better than forwards in those conditions

Winter tyres are not the same thing as mud or AT tyres. "Mud and Snow" look interesting though, will investigate those when I need new tyres.

dan.