4Motion w/ M+S tires: should I also get snow chains?

[zisdorf]

Hello,

We got a 4Motion in anticipation of snowy adventures this winter in the Alps. We have good quality M+S snow tires, but they're more all-season than purely dedicated winter tires.

Do you recommend getting snow chains as well?

In Austria and Switzerland, legally supposed to carry them and some signs will tell us to put them on -- but we've seen plenty of cars WITHOUT chains even when these signs are present. So, how legally required are they??

Thanks for the mountain advice

 

[ferret99]

I plan to get some winter tyres for Alps trips, but rather than snow chains I've bought snow socks in the past with 4wds, as they are now approved for use past the chain symbols on the signs, although I've never actually had to use them.

 

[briwy]

Snow socks work OK for a while but are prone to wearing and getting torn especially if you have to drive a short distance on tarmac before removing them. Chains are a better long term bet and work better in my experience and don't cost a lot more.

I would think decent M & S tyres would be OK especially with chains but make sure they have the snowflake symbol otherwise they won't be approved for winter use in some countries.

 

[Michael G]

I would go for winter tyres. I use nokian hakkapeliitta c3 215/60r17, you can also get these non-studded *CR3. With these you can drive in very snowy conditions, backup with snows socks, but would hardly be needed .

 

[zisdorf]

Thanks for the responses.

Good news for me: we bought the car used 6 months ago, and I hadn't researched the tires yet - but it turns out we have the pretty highly rated Nokian WR SUV 3 (e.g., http://www.tyrereviews.co.uk/Tyre/Nokian/WR-SUV-3.htm) which have the snowflake.

I looked up a number of reviews of snow socks, and it seems the majority of analysis is that they are no better than a good pair of winter tires. My tires may not be the best winter tires out there, but I wonder how much improvement snow socks would actually give...maybe no meaningful difference?

So: maybe just get socks to ensure we are not driving illegally if the snowchains signs are up in the Alps without planning on actually using them?? (in which case, I can just buy the cheapest socks?? - what do you think?)

 

[bvddobb]

We would never take the risk of not carrying chains, winter tyres or not. You can easily get into circumstances where you really need them, so why not take a € 200 set of chains with you in a € 60,000 car ???

 

[GrannyJen]

As above.

Getting stuck in deep snow and looking around with a bright red face as someone asks "where are your chains"? is an uncomfortable place to be. As with the french, last year I believe, you may also find yourself on the "last to get out" rescue list if stuck in deep snow with others.

I actually carry socks, on the basis that they are a one-time use only in, for me, what would be exceptional circumstances, so depends how often you foresee the use.

 

[panadero]

The Cali is a heavy car. You really know the value of chains while breaking on a snowy way down.....The 4 Motion won't help then....

 

[A1RGG]

Interesting topic of conversation, I'm about to order a set of Nokian WRC 3 to go on an Ocean 2016. It's been a struggle to find a winter tyre due to the 107/109 load rating that's shown on my "standard tyres" 215/60/17 T 107/109. Nokian seems to have great reviews and will see me through the winter months both in the Uk and the Alps and then I'll swap back in March/April time when the weather warms up a bit (hopefully)

 

[bigmac77]

Interesting topic of conversation, I'm about to order a set of Nokian WRC 3 to go on an Ocean 2016. It's been a struggle to find a winter tyre due to the 107/109 load rating that's shown on my "standard tyres" 215/60/17 T 107/109. Nokian seems to have great reviews and will see me through the winter months both in the Uk and the Alps and then I'll swap back in March/April time when the weather warms up a bit (hopefully)

Look at the sticker on the drivers door pillar it will state tyre load bearing requirements probably be more like 103, 107/109 is a bit of overkill.

 

[A1RGG]

Look at the sticker on the drivers door pillar it will state tyre load bearing requirements probably be more like 103, 107/109 is a bit of overkill.

Thanks for that tip, I'll check in the morning....

 

[kave]

Well, the alps might have different requirements, but a vehicle with such high ground clearance and winter tires as well as 4 motion should be nearly unstoppable. I have never owned or used snow chains previously with more normal 2wd cars. I would say in reality what might stop it is the van lying on snow with wheels in the air, then only a showel will help.

 

[Alibee]

If it's just for one short trip then you could buy either chains or socks out there, dependent on the weather.

I've taken both two and four wheel drive cars to the Alps many times in winter and only ever needed socks once in the last 7-8 trips. The roads from the resorts are cleared so quickly that the chances of you getting stuck are slim if you're not somewhere remote.

That said, if you're going regularly then I would get chains as the cost/hassle is very low compared to the outcome of sliding off the side of the road in your fully loaded 3 ton van. As mentioned above, it's going downhill that's the real issue, especially on the twisties.

 

[Ciki62]

For example in Austria winter chains are mandatory on some roads. In case off Policia control they need to be in your car. Btw 4 motion is great to go up but useless to slide down


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[greenfintry]

Our experience with gendarmes in the French alps is carry chains even if in 4x4 with winter tyres.... the rules are applied that you have to have chains on board and ready to fit. If not 400 euro fine. Applied especially to foreign plated cars going to posh resorts just before Xmas, often in lay by near cash machine... we had chains but have only once needed to use them ( up a small road in Norway), but have saved the cost of no fine many times over...

 

[itscalledbob]

After a long search I have just picked up a set of Dunlop sp60 for my 4 motion as they are recommended by VW for the Cali. I would also recommend carrying a set of chains not just to keep you on the right side of the law but also emagine you finding yourself needing them, it only needs to happen once! A further point is the manual recommends the 4 motion requires one set of chains and not two.

 

[itscalledbob]

More info on vw winter tyre recommendations can be found here/

http://www.volkswagen-accessories.c...tion.download_attachment.file/wkr_2016_en.pdf

 

[Tomatoman65]

We're living in the Pyrenees nowadays and run Goodyear Vector All Season Gen 2's year round but carry Pewag Snox SUV chains to fit as required. It snowed last night above 1000m and heading up to the Col de Portalet (1750m) later this afternoon for a drive. The road is cleared regularly but its good to have them just in case. We've used them twice in the past year while it was snowing and the signs indicated they were compulsory above 1000m.

If anyone's interested I got them from Tyre leader before we left the UK at what i thought was a very fair price for German quality.. They are incredibly easy to fit and dismount after.

https://www.tyreleader.co.uk/snow-chain/pewag/snox-suv/

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[Tomatoman65]

BTW only fit them to the front, never all 4 tyres.

 

[Ciki62]

We're living in the Pyrenees nowadays and run Goodyear Vector All Season Gen 2's year round but carry Pewag Snox SUV chains to fit as required. It snowed last night above 1000m and heading up to the Col de Portalet (1750m) later this afternoon for a drive. The road is cleared regularly but its good to have them just in case. We've used them twice in the past year while it was snowing and the signs indicated they were compulsory above 1000m.

If anyone's interested I got them from Tyre leader before we left the UK at what i thought was a very fair price for German quality.. They are incredibly easy to fit and dismount

What is your tyre size. I can't fin suitable chains for my winter 215/60 R17


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[itscalledbob]

What is your tyre size. I can't fin suitable chains for my winter 215/60 R17


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eBay?

 

[briwy]

I've had a few chains from these people.
http://www.roofbox.co.uk/scripts/rb_tyre_size_snow_chain.php?p3=true
I realise they may not be much use to you living in Slovakia but at least it shows that chains are available for your tyre size and lists the makes.

 

[briwy]

Just a point to remember. Whatever chains/socks you get make sure you practice putting them on BEFORE you go. Preferably in the dark. Actually the Cali is pretty easy to get chains on because there is plenty of clearance round the wheel. Decent old gloves and a bit of tarp or something to kneel/lie on helps as well.

 

[Trebor]

The Club shop has them .