High Top California / Club Joker

[Wannabecamperman]

Hello all,

Long time lurker here. I've been researching campervans since COVID hit, and trialled / looked closely at the Marco Polo, Jules Verne, Nugget and Nugget Plus, Joker City, Club Joker high-top and all forms of the California (including the absurd! in my view, Caddy Cali).

I have decided I definitely need a length no longer than 5m, to allow on-street parking as a daily driver, etc, and also adore the LED DRLs and lights, digi dash, in-built blinds, DSG box and not least this enormously helpful community that comes with the T6.1 Cali Ocean. I am now very close to having sufficient pennies to acquire a said T6.1 Ocean, with the prices finally dropping below my upper limit of £60k for the MY 20/21 with @20 - 30k miles and full VWSH.

However... Having concluded that the Cali Ocean was the way to go, I have recently read a LOT of threads here and elsewhere with issues surrounding the electric roof and rain leaking into the van. Having also looked at a pal's 240 cms slimline high top Auto Campers Transit and the great Heki roof light and extra storage, plus his tales of warmth and leak-free camping, plus the ability to stand up at all times, I find myself wondering if this would not be a better option for me personally and am hoping that some of you here that have experience of both pop-top and high top will give me the benefit of your experience, please?

In an ideal world, I'd be able to afford a high top Club Joker but there seem to be so few of these imported by VW to the UK and the resale prices I have seen are just crazy and you don't even get the LEDs on the one I saw for sale!

When I looked away from VW for good quality high top conversions on a Transporter, apart from the Leisuredrive Vivante conversions which have nasty folding driver and passenger seats and awful interior trim and curtains, there isn't much available. Hence my mention of the Auto Campers slimline L1H2 at just 240cms and though this is on a Transit, it seems to be the only one with decent build quality and trim, other than Jerba and theirs cost more than new Oceans!

I had to make quite a few sacrifices to achieve the £60k budget to be able to buy and enjoy a Cali Ocean, and suspect that I am just getting cold feet before pulling the trigger - any advice, tips, suggestions of how I might acquire a high top DSG VW Transporter via any other converters that I have missed, or should I just take the plunge and go with an Ocean which is certainly very close to my heart? Is £60k enough to acquire a quality high top WV Transporter with 150 DSG - and if so which converter or model should I seek?

Many thanks in advance. All and any advice or suggestions very welcome.

 

[California Dreamer]

Hi sounds like you have given it lots of careful thought- it is a lot of money so important to get something you love. We have a Cali coast so can’t comment on electric aspect of roof but we’ve had no issues whatsoever with the poptop. It’s our main family car so big advantage is being under height of most car park barriers. Obviously a function of forums is to report and help with problems so can skew the impression of how common these are. Don’t want to confuse you more but I wondered if you had tried speccing a brand new vw surf via autoebid or drive the deal, you may get it around the same cost and then all covered by warranty. Whatever you choose I’m sure you’ll love it


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[ArunAlec]

Hello all,

Long time lurker here. I've been researching campervans since COVID hit, and trialled / looked closely at the Marco Polo, Jules Verne, Nugget and Nugget Plus, Joker City, Club Joker high-top and all forms of the California (including the absurd! in my view, Caddy Cali).

I have decided I definitely need a length no longer than 5m, to allow on-street parking as a daily driver, etc, and also adore the LED DRLs and lights, digi dash, in-built blinds, DSG box and not least this enormously helpful community that comes with the T6.1 Cali Ocean. I am now very close to having sufficient pennies to acquire a said T6.1 Ocean, with the prices finally dropping below my upper limit of £60k for the MY 20/21 with @20 - 30k miles and full VWSH.

However... Having concluded that the Cali Ocean was the way to go, I have recently read a LOT of threads here and elsewhere with issues surrounding the electric roof and rain leaking into the van. Having also looked at a pal's 240 cms slimline high top Auto Campers Transit and the great Heki roof light and extra storage, plus his tales of warmth and leak-free camping, plus the ability to stand up at all times, I find myself wondering if this would not be a better option for me personally and am hoping that some of you here that have experience of both pop-top and high top will give me the benefit of your experience, please?

In an ideal world, I'd be able to afford a high top Club Joker but there seem to be so few of these imported by VW to the UK and the resale prices I have seen are just crazy and you don't even get the LEDs on the one I saw for sale!

When I looked away from VW for good quality high top conversions on a Transporter, apart from the Leisuredrive Vivante conversions which have nasty folding driver and passenger seats and awful interior trim and curtains, there isn't much available. Hence my mention of the Auto Campers slimline L1H2 at just 240cms and though this is on a Transit, it seems to be the only one with decent build quality and trim, other than Jerba and theirs cost more than new Oceans!

I had to make quite a few sacrifices to achieve the £60k budget to be able to buy and enjoy a Cali Ocean, and suspect that I am just getting cold feet before pulling the trigger - any advice, tips, suggestions of how I might acquire a high top DSG VW Transporter via any other converters that I have missed, or should I just take the plunge and go with an Ocean which is certainly very close to my heart? Is £60k enough to acquire a quality high top WV Transporter with 150 DSG - and if so which converter or model should I seek?

Many thanks in advance. All and any advice or suggestions very welcome.

Have you seen the Joker Campersales have? Not DSG though.

The Campervan & Motorhome Specialists

Campersales are official Westfalia, Autohaus and Hymer campervan partners with a wide selection of new and used campers for sale from our dealership in Burgess Hill, West Sussex.

www.campersales.co.uk

Jerba are worth a look .Their high top LWB looks good.

 

[2into1]

It sounds like you are stuck between the desirability of leds / digital dash etc (perhaps more important as a daily driver) and the desirability of a good and reliable camping experience (standing room, warm / leak proof). Only you can decide which is the priority.
If it's to be your daily, then you can't beat a Cali (which will have much better resale price if you decide you got your priority wrong). From a camping perspective, particularly in UK weather, you can get a much more comfortable camping experience but you trip over your 5m limit.
I'm currently have my Cali (my daily and for bike adventures) and a Motorhome for proper holidays with company!

 

[Wannabecamperman]

Hi sounds like you have given it lots of careful thought- it is a lot of money so important to get something you love. We have a Cali coast so can’t comment on electric aspect of roof but we’ve had no issues whatsoever with the poptop. It’s our main family car so big advantage is being under height of most car park barriers. Obviously a function of forums is to report and help with problems so can skew the impression of how common these are. Don’t want to confuse you more but I wondered if you had tried speccing a brand new vw surf via autoebid or drive the deal, you may get it around the same cost and then all covered by warranty. Whatever you choose I’m sure you’ll love it


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Hi thanks for the suggestion. I haven't looked at the Surf as I didn't think it would be sub £60k which is my absolute maximum budget. I'll take a peek. Cheers

 

[Wannabecamperman]

Have you seen the Joker Campersales have? Not DSG though.

The Campervan & Motorhome Specialists

Campersales are official Westfalia, Autohaus and Hymer campervan partners with a wide selection of new and used campers for sale from our dealership in Burgess Hill, West Sussex.

www.campersales.co.uk

Jerba are worth a look .Their high top LWB looks good.

https://www.campersales.co.uk/cs/795/

Thanks for the heads-up though it's a 5 year old, 30k+ miles T6 manual which I wouldn't forgive myself paying the asking price of £60k for. That seems absurdly expensive for a non-warrantied 5 year old manual vehicle without even LEDs or DSG box.

The Jerba high-top which also has the extra windows that I love on the Club Joker, is also rather north of £60k and there seem very few for sale. I particularly love their Wallas hob / diesel-powered heater too as I won't carry gas.

 

[Ch1pbutty]

https://www.campersales.co.uk/cs/795/

Thanks for the heads-up though it's a 5 year old, 30k+ miles T6 manual which I wouldn't forgive myself paying the asking price of £60k for. That seems absurdly expensive for a non-warrantied 5 year old manual vehicle without even LEDs or DSG box.

Don’t forget they are approx £85k new.

 

[Camperfamily]

I like the look and layout of the Ford Nugget Hightop (available in long wheel base too, with dedicated on-board toilet), but unfortunately not available in UK so would have to be a left hand drive import from the continent. If you would be willing to have a left hand drive, then worth considering.

 

[Wannabecamperman]

I like the look and layout of the Ford Nugget Hightop (available in long wheel base too, with dedicated on-board toilet), but unfortunately not available in UK so would have to be a left hand drive import from the continent. If you would be willing to have a left hand drive, then worth considering.

Actually I have been in touch with a Dutch dealership about precisely this as it's so much cheaper than the Club Joker, with very similar Westfalia layout and equipment. The Plus even gets a hot shower attachment by the second sink, with a similar diesel water heater to the Joker.

The import taxes turned out to be prohibitive though, when I added it all up. Thanks for the suggestion, though.

 

[The Merle]

Actually I have been in touch with a Dutch dealership about precisely this as it's so much cheaper than the Club Joker, with very similar Westfalia layout and equipment. The Plus even gets a hot shower attachment by the second sink, with a similar diesel water heater to the Joker.

The import taxes turned out to be prohibitive though, when I added it all up. Thanks for the suggestion, though.

Whatever you decide my advice is the longer you leave it the more expensive they get!
Ive had 2xcali and 2xjokers in the last 10yrs never really lost any money on any of them.
With diesel vans being fazed out that may change or could push the prices even higher.

 

[Wildcamper]

https://www.campersales.co.uk/cs/795/

Thanks for the heads-up though it's a 5 year old, 30k+ miles T6 manual which I wouldn't forgive myself paying the asking price of £60k for. That seems absurdly expensive for a non-warrantied 5 year old manual vehicle without even LEDs or DSG box.

The Jerba high-top which also has the extra windows that I love on the Club Joker, is also rather north of £60k and there seem very few for sale. I particularly love their Wallas hob / diesel-powered heater too as I won't carry gas.

We have a LWB High Top conversion from Autohaus in Minehead. Very very happy and would buy again, thinking about an upgrade. The California was never for us, we wanted hot water, on-board toilet, underslung LPG tank, to be able to stand up, not worry about water leaks, good insulation for the winter. We have it all. The compromise is the hight of the vehicle which does restrict some car parks. We have not been disappointed and Autohaus give excellent customer service. A new van has the full VW warranty and the conversion comes with a 3 year warranty.

 

[The Merle]

We have a LWB High Top conversion from Autohaus in Minehead. Very very happy and would buy again, thinking about an upgrade. The California was never for us, we wanted hot water, on-board toilet, underslung LPG tank, to be able to stand up, not worry about water leaks, good insulation for the winter. We have it all. The compromise is the hight of the vehicle which does restrict some car parks. We have not been disappointed and Autohaus give excellent customer service. A new van has the full VW warranty and the conversion comes with a 3 year warranty.

May struggle to get base vans now as no more t6.1 being made

 

[ic_b _________________]

May struggle to get base vans now as no more t6.1 being made

Coincidentally, I was at Autohaus two weeks ago (for some warranty work) and was chatting to the MD - they have orders for T6 vans that will see them through to whatever is coming next year.

 

[Wildcamper]

Coincidentally, I was at Autohaus two weeks ago (for some warranty work) and was chatting to the MD - they have orders for T6 vans that will see them through to whatever is coming next year.

They told me the same.

 

[Wannabecamperman]

We have a LWB High Top conversion from Autohaus in Minehead. Very very happy and would buy again, thinking about an upgrade. The California was never for us, we wanted hot water, on-board toilet, underslung LPG tank, to be able to stand up, not worry about water leaks, good insulation for the winter. We have it all. The compromise is the hight of the vehicle which does restrict some car parks. We have not been disappointed and Autohaus give excellent customer service. A new van has the full VW warranty and the conversion comes with a 3 year warranty.

Yes - they do look a high quality converter. I did have a look at

Auto Trader Motorhomes - New and Used Motorhomes For Sale

Find your next motorhome with Auto Trader UK, the official #1 site to buy and sell new and used motorhomes. Over 7,000 motorhomes online. Simple, easy, quick!

www.autotrader.co.uk

which is all my £60k budget will allow, but the lack of windows in the roof when compared to the lovely Westfalia that has the white modern storage colours also, means that I'm probably having to look again at the Club Joker, despite it's age and lack of warranty (eek!).

Thanks for the suggestion.

Decisions, decisions...

 

[wildslammer22]

Not sure if this helps but I took the plunge a year ago and bought a T6 Ocean which is also my daily driver. Absolutely no regrets, using a pucer pop top cover I have slept in the pop top dry and warm in -7 and 50mph gusting wind. I figured that buying a high spec, used, 20k+ mileage, VW serviced Ocean that any teething problems with roof etc will have been already sorted under warranty. So far I’m pleased to report that’s been the case, 10k driven - numerous adventures in all weathers and still loving it.

 

[Wildcamper]

Yes - they do look a high quality converter. I did have a look at

Auto Trader Motorhomes - New and Used Motorhomes For Sale

Find your next motorhome with Auto Trader UK, the official #1 site to buy and sell new and used motorhomes. Over 7,000 motorhomes online. Simple, easy, quick!

www.autotrader.co.uk

which is all my £60k budget will allow, but the lack of windows in the roof when compared to the lovely Westfalia that has the white modern storage colours also, means that I'm probably having to look again at the Club Joker, despite it's age and lack of warranty (eek!).

Thanks for the suggestion.

Decisions, decisions...

In our experience with Autohaus if you want a window in the High Top they will put one in. They made a lot of changes for us when we ordered.

 

[The Merle]

Yes - they do look a high quality converter. I did have a look at

Auto Trader Motorhomes - New and Used Motorhomes For Sale

Find your next motorhome with Auto Trader UK, the official #1 site to buy and sell new and used motorhomes. Over 7,000 motorhomes online. Simple, easy, quick!

www.autotrader.co.uk

which is all my £60k budget will allow, but the lack of windows in the roof when compared to the lovely Westfalia that has the white modern storage colours also, means that I'm probably having to look again at the Club Joker, despite it's age and lack of warranty (eek!).

Thanks for the suggestion.

Decisions, decisions...

The t6 joker beats that hands down! Don’t wait to longer if you want that one at campersales as they don’t hang around long or come up 2nd hand that much. The last new ones coming are £104k for 2wd!!!!

 

[Wannabecamperman]

The t6 joker beats that hands down! Don’t wait to longer if you want that one at campersales as they don’t hang around long or come up 2nd hand that much. The last new ones coming are £104k for 2wd!!!!

GULP! Six figures for a 5.3m VW van? What has happened to our economy of late? You used to be able to buy proper bricks and mortar for those prices!

I think if the Campersales 2018 Club Joker had the DSG I'd bite the bullet and go for it as the interior is literally as new looking at the photos. Given the fact it's manual and I feel that general prices might drop further after the summer season is over, and that I don't really need the camper until then, I'll continue to wait and watch.

https://www.campersales.co.uk/cs/795/

Thanks to everyone for the great advice and insights - much appreciated. I'll report back for those interested, if and when I finally 'pull the trigger'...

 

[Anthony1]

https://www.campersales.co.uk/cs/795/

Thanks for the heads-up though it's a 5 year old, 30k+ miles T6 manual which I wouldn't forgive myself paying the asking price of £60k for. That seems absurdly expensive for a non-warrantied 5 year old manual vehicle without even LEDs or DSG box.

The Jerba high-top which also has the extra windows that I love on the Club Joker, is also rather north of £60k and there seem very few for sale. I particularly love their Wallas hob / diesel-powered heater too as I won't carry gas.

Campersales are expensive. Nice people but expensive.

 

[The Merle]

Campersales are expensive. Nice people but expensive.

I disagree ordered a new joker back in 2020 and even had discount on 2020 book price (unheard of normally on westy).
They honoured original price as it took 18mths to arrive and campersales had to pay westfalia more due to manufacturing increases.
There aftersales/warranty work is where they outshine any other dealers

 

[Mehdime]

Looks like you've done plenty of research already and you're making some great points. Some experience from a year in an Ocean:

Things that are good or not actually issues in practice with the pop-roof / Ocean:

• No roof leaks that I know of. And while I'm sure leaks do happen sometime, it doesn't strike me to be a common enough issue to be a main factor here.
• Roof bed does get freezing in winter as the heater doesn't reach there. Not found it to be an issue in practice - we just carry an extra double feather duvet for people sleeping upstairs so they're nice and toasty. It would be nice of course if it wasn't cold in the first place but not much of an issue. And only a problem when camping in the cold season.
• Blinds, DLR box, LED headlights are brilliant.

Things that are issues in practice:

• Not being able to stand up without popping the roof is defo very frustrating. It's quick and easy enough to pop the roof but enough of a hassle that you won't do it at every short break. Plus it makes it obvious you're camping, which is not appropriate in many places.
• You haven't mentioned it but wind is also a big issue with pop-up roofs. It gets extremely noisy in there when windy. And in case of strong enough wind, you may have to close (or not open) the roof. Since there's no way to know when you've hit that point, it can get quite stressful camping in windy places. That's actually the main issue I have with having a pop-up roof (probably because I live and spend a lot of time camping in Ireland all year round where it's often windy). There again, that's only an issue if you camp in very windy places, which is usually an autumn/winter problem.

Things that don't matter:

• As a big geek, I was really excited to get the digital dash. In practice, it's just meh. Defo wouldn't be a loss if it was gone tomorrow. The VW satnav is rubbish so in practice, you'll use Google Maps / Waze / Apple Maps and won't use the map on the dash. Means the digital dash doesn't really give you anything useful or better than the traditional dash. It doesn't even have the fancy themes you'll find on other cars - just plain and boring.

The one deciding factor between pop-up roof and high-top:

• For us being able to fit under 2m barriers easily makes up for all the compromises above and then some. There's almost not a day when I'm not thankful we have a van that can fit under 2m barriers. A high-top would make our van a lot less useful and travel a lot more frustrating. But that's because we live and travel in places where 2m and 2.2m barriers are the norm (especially around touristic and coastal places, which is where we want to go). And our van is our only car.

If I were you, I'd really look at where and how you'll use your van and if being able to fit in height-limited car parks will be important (it might not be, in which case, high-top all the way). Because that's really the key point.

 

[Multi1100]

@Wannabecamperman
I have a 2018 T6 Cali Ocean as a daily drive. Very satisfied with it. It is almost 5 years old now and never experienced roof problems, or leaking problems. Especially to prevent leaking good maintenance of the drains is crucial! (as is all other maintenance and cleaning). Currently I do not drive it daily thanks to the COVID period. (50% at home working is still possible for my job)
Camped in Norway, near Preikestole we even had the poptop up with WF8-9, the van shaked a lot but further no problems.
As mentioned by me in other posts; the Ocean has double glazing in the camper part and very good driving noise and temp insulation. (often this is a forgotten feature in relation to campervans based on the Transporter). I know from this forum that the T6.1 has some electric/electronic issues. To my opinion the Q control of the T6.1 is (or has been) a bit less due to high demand during the COVID period, the demand of the Cali's were huge with great price increases and long lead times. Personally I think the T6 drivers cabin lay-out is more luxurious that that of the T6.1.
But as also mentioned before I would like to own a T6 Club Joker, it is a great campervan with more stand alone features on board like heated water, shower and toilet. Unfortunately also in The Netherlands very hard to come by, and if so really expensive. Another very comparable to the ClubJoker option is the Ford Nugget Plus High Top.
But for now I stick to the T6 Ocean, and go on planed 4 weeks holiday to Italy via Germany, Switzerland and Austria. After that I will be (bit early) pensioned and it may be that I will going to spend some serious time on looking to the FN+HighTop / Westfalia ClubJoker.
Good luck with your choice, I would personally look for a low milage T6 Ocean if I were you

 

[Anthony1]

I disagree ordered a new joker back in 2020 and even had discount on 2020 book price (unheard of normally on westy).
They honoured original price as it took 18mths to arrive and campersales had to pay westfalia more due to manufacturing increases.
There aftersales/warranty work is where they outshine any other dealers

Fair enough.

 

[Wildcamper]

Campersales are expensive. Nice people but expensive.

True. But these days one gets what one pays for. Our conversion was low cost, not far off a California. We could have gone £6k cheaper, maybe £10k ,but when we looked at the quality of the lower cost products we were not impressed. The resale value of ours has stayed high, £5k depreciation in 5years. This would be the case on a low cost conversion.