New summer tyres (AT, for Iceland)

[bvddobb]

We took another small step preparing our Cali for the rougher work, triggered by our upcoming trip to Iceland: we needed new summer tyres and this week they were fitted: new Michelin Lattitude Cross AT tyres!

They are bigger than our regular size, so our Cali is raised another few cm. We have now another reason to be very happy with our air suspension: with these tyres our Cali is just a bit too high for our garage. But with the 'sports' setting of he air suspension (2 cm lower) it all just fits!
As an alternative we would have had the 'parking garage' setting (7 cm lower) still, but that is slower and so we're happy the 'sports' setting does it for us!

A funny by-effect is that, with the slightly larger circumference of our wheels, the speedometer is now exact (cf. our GPS) and no longer 'exaggerating' by approx. 5%. We had calculated this beforehand, but always nice when a calculation turns out to have been right!

Also the spare doesn't fit well underneath anymore. But when we let the air out it fits again, an old trick! And we were already carrying a 12V air compressor, so when we need to change the wheel, it is inflated in no time (well, in about 4 minutes, actually...)

 

[zeratul]

That's great, I also have Iceland plans, how much did you pay for those?
And how much for you air suspension.. It's soo expensive.. is it really worth it?

 

[bvddobb]

That's great, I also have Iceland plans, how much did you pay for those?
And how much for you air suspension.. It's soo expensive.. is it really worth it?

Hi Zeratul,

The tyres cost us € 130 a piece, including changing and everything.

We have the VB full air suspension. Including everything that would cost about € 5,000. A lot has been said about it on this forum already, also by us. Just look it up with the search function.
We are very happy with it because of the comfort, the stability (no matter how you load your van, it is always level) and the flexibility (raise/lower at will, pre-sets for sport, parking garage and off road, auto-level). But it is expensive.

Mind you, we didn't invest in all of this (4Motion, raised air intakes, extra sturdy tow rings, etc) just for one Iceland trip! That would have been a bit costly!
That we changed to AT tyres now is triggered by our upcoming Iceland trip, yes, but they would have come anyway, at some point, when our summer tyres need changing.
We do not do off-road trials or the like with our Cali, of course (although we will be going to the VW Transporter 4Motion Off-road Festival). But we do like to travel to remote and distant places, of the beaten track, and we don't want to be limited by bad roads or bad terrain, or as little as possible at least!

 

[zeratul]

Thank you. I've been to Iceland 3 times now, the fourth time is summer 2017 (first time in Cali) and I'm sure many more will follow (just so in love with the country). Still considering air suspension.
Our children are very sensitive to car sickness (something which will get better with age, I'm sure), do you think air suspension could help with that? Because of the smoother ride.
At the same time, having been in super jeep excursions and having driven a Landcruiser on one of the tougher inland roads, having seen people wait by the side of the road for several days for spare parts, ...
I know how easy it is to damage the bottom of your car, not sure I want to risk my Cali's health too hard.
Tough choices... 5K over 10+ years of cali ownership is probably acceptable.

 

[bvddobb]

Still considering air suspension.
Our children are very sensitive to car sickness (something which will get better with age, I'm sure), do you think air suspension could help with that? Because of the smoother ride.
At the same time, having been in super jeep excursions and having driven a Landcruiser on one of the tougher inland roads, having seen people wait by the side of the road for several days for spare parts, ...

Don't know about the smoother ride/car sickness. Our experience with our kids was contrary: how tougher the ride, the less car sickness, how smoother (V6 automatic), the more car sickness...

If it's any comfort: VB air suspension DO have an Icelandic dealer...

 

[HugoFar]

Which size A/T tyres did you fit? Btw The Seikel website now has a very useful spread sheet type page showing lot's of tyre size and suspension lift options and the resultant lift in mm
. We're about to go for the Desert HD 4 motion one. 30-35mm lift at each corner on existing 235/60R16 tyres.

 

[bvddobb]

Which size A/T tyres did you fit?

Our AT/summers are 225/70/R16. They give approx 2 cm extra height cf our winter 'regulars' of 215/65/R16. The off road setting of our suspension adds another extra 3 cm.

 

[HugoFar]

Thanks for the tyre size info. It looks like a good choice. That size has only recently become available in New Zealand and looks like a good option for us when the time comes to replace our A/T tyres. Seikel claim it gives an extra (theoretical and unladen !?) 17mm lift to their 30mm lift kit. Together giving us approx 47mm lift (from 180 to 227mm) and with no need for speedo,steering or wheel arch modifications. http://www.seikel.de/shop/lift-figures-t5t6/?lang=eh
BTW,it looks like the rear inside wheel arch may start to get quite close at the back edge of the tyre as the tyre circumference increases. Has this happened with yours bvdbodd?

 

[bvddobb]

We are now on the Quai in Hirtshals, waiting to board for Iceland. Currently with 10 (!) other Cali's...


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[briwy]

Hope you have a good time.
We'll be there next year so look forward to seeing your experiences.

 

[zeratul]

Hi bvddob,

When you get back from Iceland, I'd love to know what highland roads you've traveled, and how they were in your Cali. We will be going in August 2017. My current plan is to do all three Highland tracks (Kjolur, Sprengisandur and Kaldidalur) as well as Landmannalaugar and Laki .. if possible of course.

Please share your experiences, I'd really love to hear it.

 

[bvddobb]

Thus far we have done one complete run from South to North following the F208 from Kirjubaer to Landmannalaugur and the F26 from there to the North. We took 4 days, overnighting at the campsites at Holaskol cabin, Landmannalaugar and Nyidalur cabin.
This was all very doable. The F208 more of a real moutain road, needing a skilled driver. The fords were many, but only two neede some consideration how best to cross before going in, the others were pretty straightforward. Depths were mostly 30-50 cm, so you really need your air intake and drive train vents raised. No issues with the heaters.
The driving is slow. Specially on the F208 but also the southern half of the F26 had stretches where we couldn't do more than 15 km/h.
We'll be on the Kjolur and Kandidalur and perhaps some others later these weeks.


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[bvddobb]

We just made our plans for the coming week, we will probably do:
F756, F35, F338, unnumbered road south from F338, F578, hoping all these stay open the next weeks.


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[HugoFar]

I hope the smoking volcano that's been dormant for 100 years doesn't amount to much. Guessing you know about it. Apparently 10 times the size of the one a few years ago that interrupted air travel. A local Icelandic guy just told us about it.

 

[zeratul]

We just made our plans for the coming week, we will probably do:
F756, F35, F338, unnumbered road south from F338, F578, hoping all these stay open the next weeks.


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Yes, you're a little late on the season so I hope with you.

I haven't decided if I will raise vents, engine air intake and underplate protection... the total cost of the trip will really become expensive (3.7K euro to get the car and us there + 2K modifications ...) For that price we can rent a 4x4 Camper ... not our cali though.. tough decision.

As for air suspension, it's an investment that will also benefit many other aspects, just need to decide if we will keep this Cali forever (20years) or upgrade to a newer one every 5-10 years..

 

[bvddobb]

Well, if the trip and the modifications have the same out-of-pocket costs as renting a 4x4 camper (which sounds about right). I' d go for the modifications, even if it were for this trip alone (which I trust it wouldn't be ). Renting is pure sunk costs, modifying your own van is an investment of a sort. You will have your own van on holiday, can make more such trips, an probably have a higher resale value.

We have made the investment planning to run our Cali to its grave, some 600.000 km from now...


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[zeratul]

Agree. Really hope you'll get those extra 600.000 kms
Do you know what is the height of the vehicle in the most extreme lowered setting (parking garage or even lower?) Because for Smyril Line, if you can get < 1.9m it makes a significant difference in price.

Price difference is about 10% the price of air suspension, so if we're going to iceland a couple of times.. it matters

 

[Loz]

Agree. Really hope you'll get those extra 600.000 kms
Do you know what is the height of the vehicle in the most extreme lowered setting (parking garage or even lower?) Because for Smyril Line, if you can get < 1.9m it makes a significant difference in price.

Price difference is about 10% the price of air suspension, so if we're going to iceland a couple of times.. it matters

We let the tyres down to 12psi on friends Discovery and saved him £120 on the Sardinia ferry in June.

 

[bvddobb]

[QUOTE="zeratul, post:
Do you know what is the height of the vehicle in the most extreme lowered setting [/QUOTE]
Our VB air suspension lowers 7 cm in parking garage setting (max speed then 35 km/h) and 15 cm in lowest setting (max speed then 5 km/h).

Don't know about the <1.9 m at Smyrill Line, our booking process was about <2.0 m.


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[zeratul]

Interesting. when booking through the Smyril Line site, it says 1.9m max. Did you book through a travel agency?
Either way, if -15cm is the lowest VB Air suspension, then even with increased tyres (+3cm) the cali will be < 1.9m - nice!
Did you consider shipping the cali with Samskip? Price is comparable.. but you win a couple of days (=more days in iceland)

 

[bvddobb]

[QUOTE="zeratul, post:]
Did you consider shipping the cali with Samskip? Price is comparable.. but you win a couple of days (=more days in iceland)[/QUOTE]
We booked through a travel agency that specialises in Iceland and Groenland travel, here in NL. We did look at the other options of shipping from Rotterdam and renting in Iceland. Together with the flights, for 4 weeks each option was roughly equally insanely expensive. So, we liked the idea of travelling in our own roughed up Cali and the possibility to visit the Faroe Islands on the way, and therefore chose the ferry. Also didn't like that with shipping we would miss the car 2x 1 week: our Cali is our only car.


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[zeratul]

Ah your only car, then it's the obvious choice of course.
What travel agency.. ? will consider booking there.

 

[briwy]

Interesting. when booking through the Smyril Line site, it says 1.9m max. Did you book through a travel agency?
Either way, if -15cm is the lowest VB Air suspension, then even with increased tyres (+3cm) the cali will be < 1.9m - nice!
Did you consider shipping the cali with Samskip? Price is comparable.. but you win a couple of days (=more days in iceland)

We have VB susupension and I definitely wouldn't chance driving onto a ferry with it in the lowest position. The ferry ramps vary a lot in the angle and I reckon there is a very good chance it would ground on the low setting.
In theory I suppose you could drive on at the standard height and then lower it but it takes a few minutes to change so you wouldn't be popular holding everything up.
Saw a guy in a Ferrari a few years ago nearly in tears after crumpling the front spoiler driving off a ferry.

 

[zeratul]

Our AT/summers are 225/70/R16. They give approx 2 cm extra height cf our winter 'regulars' of 215/65/R16. The off road setting of our suspension adds another extra 3 cm.

Some questions on the sizes of these tyres.
I thought T5.2 4motion always comes with 17 inch wheels, due to larger brakes (4 motion). Do you have a T5.0 of .1? Or can 16 inch alloys be fitted?

Can these tyres be fitted with the standard suspension or only with VB air or Seikel lift kit? According to Seikel , there is "minor conversion work" to be done on the 17 inch version, for steering stop limit
http://www.seikel.de/wp-content/uploads/2016/07/Höherlegungswerte_T5-T6_2016-07_engl.pdf

They also state:
CAUTION: A SEIKEL lift kit is a precondition for a change of tires!
http://www.seikel.de/4x4-knowledge/reifenumruestung/?lang=eh
For the 17 inch alloys these are the options according to them:
Suitable tyre dimensions for rim 7J x 17 H2
215/65 R17
235/55 R17 (standard)
235/65 R17
245/65 R17

Can anyone clear this out? Is 16 inch alloys possible on T5.2 4motion? If not, do I really need lift kit and stop limit change if I increase tyre size?
Or is the standard 235/55/R17 the only option.. ?

 

[briwy]

I've just had a look at our 4 Motion brakes and I can't see how a 16 inch wheel would fit. There's about 6/8mm clearance between the calliper and the inside of the wheel. However, this is with alloys so perhaps the inner diameter of steels is Ok due to the steel being thinner than the alloy. I've got some 16s that we use in the Yeti in winter so I'll try one when we get home from France.