Quick leisure battery charge time question

[bob_summers]

Maybe a bit "How long is a piece of string" - With a new Ocean on the way I'm starting to think of specifics. There's a site we use without EHU. If staying for, say, a week, I gather the leisure batts would power the fridge and lights for around 4 days.

Would they recharge during a run out to the shops or something, enough to get another 3 or 4 days? Or am I underestimating the time to charge? I roughty worked it out as needing 4.5 hours which is a very long run to the shops! And I guess it charges the starter battery as priority. Real world experience?

 

[Dr-Snickers]

Maybe a bit "How long is a piece of string" - With a new Ocean on the way I'm starting to think of specifics. There's a site we use without EHU. If staying for, say, a week, I gather the leisure batts would power the fridge and lights for around 4 days.

Would they recharge during a run out to the shops or something, enough to get another 3 or 4 days? Or am I underestimating the time to charge? I roughty worked it out as needing 4.5 hours which is a very long run to the shops! And I guess it charges the starter battery as priority. Real world experience?

We went to the Isle of Wight for a quick 3 day break last summer and camped at a lovely site without EHU. We were fully charged before leaving. Ran the fridge on level 4/5, keeping an eye on our fridge thermometer so it didn't get too warm. I think we decided to take our portable chargers for the phones. Didn't use much internal LED lighting because it was high summer, the weather was great and we spent each evening drinking wine around the fire, looking at the sunset and stars. We drove out each day but the IoW is so small, the longest journey was an hour and that's because we had to change destination and head to the other side of the island! The battery didn't drop below 70% from memory, so I would definitely expect 4-5 days would be fine.

However, I'm planning to get a solar panel when funds allow for those holidays where we aren't planning to drive much and our beloved Glastonbury Festival.

 

[AlanC]

The quick answer is no.

A short run the the shops after 4 days of current draw will not fully charge the leisure batteries to enable another 4 days. This charge will be compounded by the Blue Motion charge cycle which only brings the batteries up to 80% on newer vans.

Alan

 

[Dr-Snickers]

... obviously IoW temperatures may be no-where near what you experience where you are though.

 

[B J G]

Solar charging may be the best option, either fixed or a portable version (might be a security issue).

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[bob_summers]

Sounds like an amazing holiday @Dr-Snickers !
Thanks for the confirmation @AlanC
I think I'll need to consider solar anyway. Currently (no pun intended) looking at the no-drill solution mentioned on here. I did not know (nor did the VW sales guy tell me) the manual says the batteries need EHU every month. It will be kept on a rented space in a city centre parking garage, no EHU possible.

 

[Dr-Snickers]

Sorry didn't mean to waffle on...was just trying to paint a picture of how we were using the van, so you could equate power levels with our 'real world experience' as requested.

Thanks @bob_summers, it was a lovely mini break and our first trip with the van that wasn't to friend's (NYE) or down to our static caravan on the south coast. We had so many trips planned for last year but they will keep

 

[andyinluton]

I did not know (nor did the VW sales guy tell me) the manual says the batteries need EHU every month. It will be kept on a rented space in a city centre parking garage, no EHU possible.

Thats not what the T6.1 manual says:

"If the additional battery is not charged by the alternator while the engine is running, it must be charged on the 230-volt feed at regular intervals - a minimum of every four weeks"

Using the new maximum charge feature you can get them up to 100% using just the engine.
I assume you would need to drive it anyway as solar isn't going to do a lot for you in a garage.

 

[WelshGas]

Sounds like an amazing holiday @Dr-Snickers !
Thanks for the confirmation @AlanC
I think I'll need to consider solar anyway. Currently (no pun intended) looking at the no-drill solution mentioned on here. I did not know (nor did the VW sales guy tell me) the manual says the batteries need EHU every month. It will be kept on a rented space in a city centre parking garage, no EHU possible.

Welcome to the world of VW Dealerships and their in-depth knowledge of the California.

 

[Calimili]

Sounds like an amazing holiday @Dr-Snickers !
Thanks for the confirmation @AlanC
I think I'll need to consider solar anyway. Currently (no pun intended) looking at the no-drill solution mentioned on here. I did not know (nor did the VW sales guy tell me) the manual says the batteries need EHU every month. It will be kept on a rented space in a city centre parking garage, no EHU possible.

Not good, how long will you be keeping it in the garage for?

 

[bob_summers]

I haven’t actually read the manual, just skimmed some threads on here - didn’t know about the new maximum charge feature mentioned by @andyinluton

it’ll be our only vehicle although not a daily driver. Based on current* use, it would get a decent run out most weekends up to the mountains but not touched midweek. Would it get a full charge that way?

* pre covid!

 

[Calimili]

I haven’t actually read the manual, just skimmed some threads on here - didn’t know about the new maximum charge feature mentioned by @andyinluton

it’ll be our only vehicle although not a daily driver. Based on current* use, it would get a decent run out most weekends up to the mountains but not touched midweek. Would it get a full charge that way?

* pre covid!

Again it depends how many km you‘ll drive or how many hours. It looks like you’ll have to start figuring out how to charge the Leisure batteries. I would definitely supplement the driving charge with solar.
In winter it may be difficult. You may need more than a single panel. Or at least a system that will allow you to add a second panel after if needed.

 

[andyinluton]

The solar would be a complete waste of money if the vans stored in a garage.

You could replace the leisure batteries a couple of times for the cost of a panel. Even if not looked after you would probably get 5 years or so out of them. Just make sure everything is turned off when parking up.

 

[flying banana]

You could just pay a fiver extra and hook up somewhere for 24r hours

 

[WelshGas]

I haven’t actually read the manual, just skimmed some threads on here - didn’t know about the new maximum charge feature mentioned by @andyinluton

it’ll be our only vehicle although not a daily driver. Based on current* use, it would get a decent run out most weekends up to the mountains but not touched midweek. Would it get a full charge that way?

* pre covid!

The likelihood is Yes, if that is done on a reasonably regular basis throughout the year.

 

[Calimili]

The solar would be a complete waste of money if the vans stored in a garage.

You could replace the leisure batteries a couple of times for the cost of a panel. Even if not looked after you would probably get 5 years or so out of them. Just make sure everything is turned off when parking up.

I think solar would be his only option if he can’t charge during the week. The van will not be used on a daily basis, so it can’t be relied on the alternator to keep LBs charged.
He needs to make out the most of a weekend trip in terms of charging too. Is he , realistically, going to drive enough in a winter weekend to charge the batteries whilst using them for his camping needs without ehu ?
That’s why i think he needs a good top up via solar on weekends.

 

[LRGS253]

I'm going away the first May bank holiday with no EHU and expect mine to last 3 days no problem. Worst case would surely to run the engine to put a bit of charge back in?

 

[bob_summers]

The solar option does look useful, been checking out some install/review threads here.

Despite being underground all week, typical weekend use is a 2h round trip to the mountains (in itself not enough to charge the leisure batts if I understand right), but the van is then parked up most of the day outside.

Some good options to weigh up (and plenty of time to do so, with a predicted Oct delivery!).
-Replacement leisure batts cost less than a solar install.
-I’ve managed for decades without a fridge in the vehicle so losing it after four days not the end of the world
-Can see the attraction of fitting solar - I can think of various sites we use for a week/10 days where there is either no EHU or it doesn’t reach to the best part of the site…

 

[ThomasHJ]

Have you considered finding a different parking space to rent? One with EHU? Don't know your exact situation so maybe that's not an option. But comparing the price of solar vs the price of letting your batteries slowly and then replace die doesn't sound very logical to me.

Perhaps friends or family with a driveway or public parking in front of the house, which will allow you to charge the batteries once a month? Or maybe you can take the van to work once a month and hookup there? It won't get you up to 12-24h but it'll help.

 

[Calimili]

Have you considered finding a different parking space to rent? One with EHU? Don't know your exact situation so maybe that's not an option. But comparing the price of solar vs the price of letting your batteries slowly and then replace die doesn't sound very logical to me.

Perhaps friends or family with a driveway or public parking in front of the house, which will allow you to charge the batteries once a month? Or maybe you can take the van to work once a month and hookup there? It won't get you up to 12-24h but it'll help.

Agreed, while the battery slowly die, their performance will deteriorate day by day..... Not really sure on the math involving the financial advantage of replacing the batteries vs the solar. Some have reported damaged batteries after a couple of months of being left without charge. At the second replacement you have already spent more than the solar, meanwhile having had poor perfomance from them too

 

[Dr-Snickers]

I may be wrong but I would have thought the 2hr run on the weekends would be enough to top up the batteries each week, because you wouldn’t be charging them from empty. That’s certainly my experience last summer driving to our caravan which is just over an hour away. I still plug in once a month but my batteries are always charged after my drive.

Deciding whether you want something to keep you topped up whilst on holiday or if you want something to keep your batteries in top condition may be the important aspect here. I’m planning on the fitted solar for easy charging and keeping the batteries in good condition but my van sits outside all the time, and so can make use of the solar energy. If yours is in the covered car park this latter aspect may be an expensive option that is essentially redundant.

There are people on the forum who never charge their batteries regularly but just drive the van, don’t have solar and say their batteries are doing fine. It may not be the gold standard approach but it works for them.

 

[Calimili]

I may be wrong but I would have thought the 2hr run on the weekends would be enough to top up the batteries each week, because you wouldn’t be charging them from empty. That’s certainly my experience last summer driving to our caravan which is just over an hour away. I still plug in once a month but my batteries are always charged after my drive.

Deciding whether you want something to keep you topped up whilst on holiday or if you want something to keep your batteries in top condition may be the important aspect here. I’m planning on the fitted solar for easy charging and keeping the batteries in good condition but my van sits outside all the time, and so can make use of the solar energy. If yours is in the covered car park this latter aspect may be an expensive option that is essentially redundant.

There are people on the forum who never charge their batteries regularly but just drive the van, don’t have solar and say their batteries are doing fine. It may not be the gold standard approach but it works for them.

It depends if you drive the van during the week ..
How do you know the batteries are fully charged after a short drive?
When you turn the engine off, surely they show 100%. But actual state of charge should be read after a couple of hours. In addition to that the alternator will only charge them up to 80%.
I don't agree the solar would be redundant, I think the solar would be necessary, because relying on keeping the LB in good state just by driving the van 2 hours round trip once a week, won't suffice.
At least during the weekend he could charge the batteries to 100%, while camping and drawing power for fridge/lights, possibly heating .

 

[Dr-Snickers]

It depends if you drive the van during the week ..
How do you know the batteries are fully charged after a short drive?
When you turn the engine off, surely they show 100%. But actual state of charge should be read after a couple of hours. In addition to that the alternator will only charge them up to 80%.
I don't agree the solar would be redundant, I think the solar would be necessary, because relying on keeping the LB in good state just by driving the van 2 hours round trip once a week, won't suffice.
At least during the weekend he could charge the batteries to 100%, while camping and drawing power for fridge/lights, possibly heating .

Of course and there are lots of variables here. I’m just pointing out that 2/7 days per week on solar may not be enough either. I’d hate the OP to spend a lot of money on something that isn’t able to perform as well in their particular circumstances.

In my case, my batteries say fully charged on arrival and they are still fully charged when we head out the following morning for the 1/2mile trip with all our gear, or at least they were last summer. It’s been a long winter, so I’ll know soon enough if my battery health has reduced through lockdown, when we can start going in April.

 

[andyinluton]

In addition to that the alternator will only charge them up to 80%.
I don't agree the solar would be redundant, I think the solar would be necessary, because relying on keeping the LB in good state just by driving the van 2 hours round trip once a week, won't suffice.

On a T6.1 the alternator will charge them to 100%. which is far more than a solar panel will do in a garage.

My advice would be to use the van a few times to see what power you are using & how quick it recharges when driving. Then decide if you need a different strategy.

Parked up for even a month the leisure batteries shouldn't drop below 90% if everything is switched off. A two hour drive would get you to 100%, use it for 3 or 4 days without moving the van & then drive 2 hours home & the batteries should be back to 100% when you park it up again.

 

[Calimili]

On a T6.1 the alternator will charge them to 100%. which is far more than a solar panel will do in a garage.

My advice would be to use the van a few times to see what power you are using & how quick it recharges when driving. Then decide if you need a different strategy.

Parked up for even a month the leisure batteries shouldn't drop below 90% if everything is switched off. A two hour drive would get you to 100%, use it for 3 or 4 days without moving the van & then drive 2 hours home & the batteries should be back to 100% when you park it up again.

I agree in testing it first, but nevertheless prepare for plan B.
Just to clarify: I am not suggesting solar to charge the LBs whilst in a covered garage, but to charge in those two days when the van is NOT in the garage.