Roof cover vs internal liner for blackout

[California Dreamin]

We are trying to resist getting too many accessories until we really know what we really need and have got used to our Beach however after first few trips and being woken up at 4am* by the light and the birds we wondered if a topper might help. We can cope, I know there are worse problems, but wondered whether a topper vs a liner would be best. Not too keen on self adhesive velcro but the external toppers look like a faff. Any advice gratefully received.

*first world problem

 

[AlisonF]

Started to write a long reply but gave up - I have both internal and external. No problem. Much less noise. water proof. internal is there all the time. external can be done on your own but less than 5 mins with a helpful neighbour... if you can afford it get both. else, if deciding between one or the other... phew, i have a preference but won't express it here as will be shot down by others... so send a PM !

 

[calicasas]

Started to write a long reply but gave up - I have both internal and external. No problem. Much less noise. water proof. internal is there all the time. external can be done on your own but less than 5 mins with a helpful neighbour... if you can afford it get both. else, if deciding between one or the other... phew, i have a preference but won't express it here as will be shot down by others... so send a PM !

Having both also, I would agree with the above. Both provide advantages and disadvantages. Very tight call... Dare I give my opinion? All I would say is that the internal one is great but leaks a tiny bit in a storm. Also outer cover allows you to drive off will canvas dry. In winter having both are great, but I also have a pucer screen which is brilliant for extremes of weather (hot/cold).

 

[bigmac77]

I have a Comfortz leisure topper and a Pucer roof screen, the pucer makes it very dark up top. So much so that my kids always sleep longer in the Cali than they do at home. I do find the Pucer a bit on the bulky side for stowing where as the topper fits in one of the chairs in the tailgate. It would seem nothing is ever perfect.

 

[Keith Smith]

It's a bit sad, and worrying, if we can't give an honest opinion without risking being shot down.

Unfortunately I only have the external topper so can't give a comparative view. I chose the external as I thought it important to be able to keep the roof fabric dry. It keeps the roof space warmer and darker and is not too onerous to fit and, when stored in the tailgate it helps to balance the door weight.

However I can definitely see the advantages of having the internal fitted permanently in place especially if you travel on your own a lot

 

[cpjb@btinternet.com]

Does the internal liner (as provided by Nick at Comfotz) help in blocking the light out? I still can't believe that VW with the T6 fabric have provided something that is totally unfit for purpose. We shouldn't have to need all of this other liner/topper stuff in the summer months. Surely the main advantage of the Cali is the practicality of being able to set up/de-camp quickly. Rant over - sorry for butting in "Calafornia Dreamin". Just hacked off.

 

[andyinluton]

Having had both

Internal Advantages -
Once fitted stays in place so no hassle putting it on
i don't get wet taking it off in the rain
Can open the windows for more light & ventilation
doesn't need storing
Keeps the interior dark when windows are shut
keeps occupants dry even if canvas gets wet

External advantages -
Keeps the canvas dry
probably better insulation

If our canvas gets wet I can put the roof up at home & let it dry out when its convenient
As you can probably guess we sold the external topper & just use the internal now, if we were using the van for skiing etc we could well get another external one just to keep the snow out of the roof mechanism.

 

[Teejay]

It's a bit sad, and worrying, if we can't give an honest opinion without risking being shot down.

Totally agree, opinions from experience users are vital.

 

[Teejay]

Having had both

Internal Advantages -
Once fitted stays in place so no hassle putting it on
i don't get wet taking it off in the rain
Can open the windows for more light & ventilation
doesn't need storing
Keeps the interior dark when windows are shut
keeps occupants dry even if canvas gets wet

External advantages -
Keeps the canvas dry
probably better insulation

If our canvas gets wet I can put the roof up at home & let it dry out when its convenient
As you can probably guess we sold the external topper & just use the internal now, if we were using the van for skiing etc we could well get another external one just to keep the snow out of the roof mechanism.

Does the external one cover the drain holes I've been reading about?

 

[WelshGas]

Does the external one cover the drain holes I've been reading about?

No.

 

[WelshGas]

Any material used for tents have their problems and the California roof bellows is no exception.
As has been stated already both internal and external Toppers will insulate and keep out the light.
The external keeps the Bellows material dry, the internal doesn't have to be removed.
So, if you can elevate the roof at home then the Internal Topper should be 1st choice.
If you cannot elevate the roof at home to dry the bellows then the External Topper should be considered.
If you use the California in snowy conditions then maybe both for the additional insulation and as a snow cover.

 

[Velma's Dad]

i have a preference but won't express it here as will be shot down by others

Oh, I wish you'd feel able to tell us what you think and prefer. I'd be really interested as we haven't yet gone for a topper of either kind (I'm tending towards the internal type at the moment). I understand the various practical pros/cons as summarised in various useful posts above, but your personal perspective would be really interesting to read.

(We have an SE, not a Beach by the way as in the OP's question, bit I guess it doesn't make a lot of difference whether we're talking about manual or powered pop-ups?)

 

[WelshGas]

Oh, I wish you'd feel able to tell us what you think and prefer. I'd be really interested as we haven't yet gone for a topper of either kind (I'm tending towards the internal type at the moment). I understand the various practical pros/cons as summarised in various useful posts above, but your personal perspective would be really interesting to read.

(We have an SE, not a Beach by the way as in the OP's question, bit I guess it doesn't make a lot of difference whether we're talking about manual or powered pop-ups?)

It doesn't. Also the T6 appears to have a more translucent roof bellows than the T5 hence his query regarding the light. I don't know what effect either Topper would have on the "Dawn Chorus" as whichever Topper you go with your still left with the requirements of adequate ventilation which will also let in the noise.

 

[WelshGas]

Thinking about the difference between a Manual and Hydraulic roof, can you stop the Manual roof midway to assist in putting on an External Topper?

 

[Calihunter]

I only have the Comfortz external cover which is excellent. The reason I went for the external cover over the internal, is that I like to stick my head up through the hatch whilst lowering the roof, as you can make sure the bellows are clear of the scissor mechanism as the roof comes down. My wife walks around the outside double checking. I wasn't sure how I would get on doing this with an internal topper? I don't use a bungee. We have been in horrendous rain and wind and our bellows have remained dry beneath the external topper. If you take the topper off when its wet most of the water shakes off. We have a black topper which also makes it quite dark inside.

 

[snowy55]

I don't have a topper or an inner, I keep my eyes shut and wear ear plugs

 

[ArunAlec]

I only have the Comfortz external cover which is excellent. The reason I went for the external cover over the internal, is that I like to stick my head up through the hatch whilst lowering the roof, as you can make sure the bellows are clear of the scissor mechanism as the roof comes down. My wife walks around the outside double checking. I wasn't sure how I would get on doing this with an internal topper? I don't use a bungee. We have been in horrendous rain and wind and our bellows have remained dry beneath the external topper. If you take the topper off when its wet most of the water shakes off. We have a black topper which also makes it quite dark inside.

My thoughts exactly. I can vouch for the weatherproof quality of the Comfortz external as I am "enjoying" the British summer in the Cali in Snowdonia.
Another reason I went for the external was concern about having to have a wet canvas sitting on top of the upper bunk.

 

[Trailertrash]

Following three months of ownership and trips I can say that the comfortz topper is a must. It keeps out the light and adds another layer of insulation and weather proofing to the canvas.I have fitted it myself according to the UTUBE video instructions with no problem. Also get yourself a good quality sleep mask and some industrial grade ear plugs.

 

[California Dreamin]

Thank you everyone for such helpful replies. We couldn't be more pleased with our T6 but do wonder why they a) didnt make the vents midge proof and b) why not a darker material but hey ho.

One concern was that an inner would create opportunity for damp between the canvas and the inner but i am not hearing that that is a problem here - especially with the t6 bellows.

We have a starlight blue van so a pretty dark colour. Already a bit worried about summer temperatures (like that is a problem this year ) so thought a light grey topper would be sensible - however the black would look better and be darker in the morning. Do the lighter colours also keep the light levels lower?

Finally, I am pretty new round here so perhaps haven't seen the worst of things but cannot understand people who peddle unpleasantness on forums. There is enough bad in the world without us inventing our own - especially on a site dedicated to us all escaping and having fun in our campervans.

So thank you all for your help.

 

[briwy]

We have the prototype internal topper that Nick produced. Been in use now for 18 months withour any problems at all. We also have an external topper but rarely use it now as we are so impressed with the internal one. Just about to leave for Norway for five weeks and we aren't taking the external one to save space.
If we are planning on staying in one spot for a while and the weather is bad then we would use the esternal one as well.
Personally I think that the internal one gives more thermal protection than the external. Probably because the air gap is a lot smaller so cold air can't move around as much. Similar to having a close fitting sleeping bag as opposed to a loose fit one.
We haven't found lowering the roof is a problem with the internal one making it more likely to casue the fabric to catch but we have always used a bungee wihich helps.
This is the report I did on the first proper test of the prototype.
https://vwcaliforniaclub.com/threads/internal-topper.9224/page-2

 

[Kano]

Just a quick question; Does the internal cover keeps the roof space cooler in the Summer? I mean when temps are high as they may be in Spain or Southern France. I know it works to keep the roof warmer in cold weather over in Blighty..

 

[Sheffield10]

And another quick question - does anyone have experience of the external topper causing damage to the roof paintwork -e,g, in strong winds does the topper flap about at all causing movement between it and the roof ?

 

[WelshGas]

And another quick question - does anyone have experience of the external topper causing damage to the roof paintwork -e,g, in strong winds does the topper flap about at all causing movement between it and the roof ?

Hasn't on my vehicle. Properly fitted and tensioned the only wind movement might be on the sides against the canvas, not on the elevated section as my Comfortz topper fits perfectly.

 

[BerndRos]

I think you should spend the money on one, but be ready to hardly use it.

In my many hundreds of nights in my Cali, many in extreme cold in Eastern Europe, I guess I have only put my Pucer cover on half a dozen times....they tend to be simply too much trouble.....

 

[motacyclist]

Just a quick question; Does the internal cover keeps the roof space cooler in the Summer? I mean when temps are high as they may be in Spain or Southern France. I know it works to keep the roof warmer in cold weather over in Blighty..

Yes.