EGR valve fault / engine damage on 66 plate T6

[G&Ts]

Hi all, we have a 2016 T6 204PS California. Last week the engine wouldn't start and the coolant warning light came on; on checking the coolant it was completely empty. VW Assist recovered the vehicle to the garage, it turns out that a fault with the EGR valve had caused the coolant to leak into the engine... causing a lot of damage. End result - cali needs a new engine along with valve and other parts The only blessing is that the repairs are all covered under warranty, as the repair cost will amount to around £7,000.

I see EGR valve failure is a recurrent issue with older models but there seem to be less reports more recently, so I wondered if anyone else has had a similar experience with the T6? The garage advised valve problems are fairly common but usually easily replaced and they'd never had a case cause so much damage. The cali had only been serviced two days before and coolant was full and there were no warning lights beforehand. Rather shocked to find we need a new engine after only 10 months / 13,000 miles!!

 

[andyinluton]

Was it recovered to the same garage that serviced it?

I had a Landrover engine fail a day after it had been serviced, I am sure that what was diagnosed was not what was actually the cause but it meant that the £14k engine was replaced under warranty rather than the garage having to foot the bill.

Irrelevent question really but why was it in for a service? 10 months / 13000 miles seems a bit early.

 

[CampervanTime]

That's not good news is it.

This confirms that the 5yr warranty extension is an absolute no-brainer given the complexity of these engines, the 204 especially with the trick bi-turbo too.

 

[G&Ts]

Was it recovered to the same garage that serviced it?

I had a Landrover engine fail a day after it had been serviced, I am sure that what was diagnosed was not what was actually the cause but it meant that the £14k engine was replaced under warranty rather than the garage having to foot the bill.

Irrelevent question really but why was it in for a service? 10 months / 13000 miles seems a bit early.

We had just done a 2 week trip round Brittany and the oil service light came on. Having read around a bit it seems this is result of monitoring the oil quality, apposed to a preset mileage as we had assumed. Amusingly the person who collected and returned Ivan said "That is by far the best running Cali T6 engine I've ever driven", talk about irony!

It seems strange as it does 40 miles of motorway driving a day. It was recovered to the garage that serviced it and they have been quite helpful.

Can having a new engine put into a vehicle have knock on effects?

 

[Stoneybroke]

Very concerning.

Seems strange that there was no warning. How much coolant had gone into the engine - particular over such a short period? Where had it gone?

Hope the repairs go OK.

A new engine shouldn't be an issue - provided is done competently.

 

[WelshGas]

Unless it has changed on the T6 - Oil light ON indicates Low Oil Level. If the Oil quality has changed then , on the T5, you get Oil Light and Service Display on the Dashboard MFD.
Had you topped up the Oil ? as there have been some posts about the 204 engine requiring a top up at about 15,000 miles.
NB: NOT a cause of the EGR cooler failing - that is just Sod's Law.

 

[blondebier]

Sorry to hear this. Sounds very frustrating and disappointing on such a new vehicle.

I think an engine replacement is probably the best result. I'd be happy with that.

What's the alternative? Replacing/repairing the existing unit? I'd always have lingering concerns that it had been done properly.

At least with a new unit you've got some peace of mind that it has all been replaced and the warranty might even be longer than a repaired unit.

 

[Meoncoast]

eplaced and the warranty might even be longer than a repaired unit.

If work under taken on warranty my understanding is than the new part warranty ends when the van warranty ends.

 

[Ocean Spirit]

Sorry to hear this G&T's.
all the best

 

[andyinluton]

Would the EGR cooler failing allow oil & water to mix? You've said the coolant has leaked into the engine.

If so could it be that the oil quality/service light came on due to the quality of oil being affected by coolant getting in it?

 

[WelshGas]

Would the EGR cooler failing allow oil & water to mix? You've said the coolant has leaked into the engine.

If so could it be that the oil quality/service light came on due to the quality of oil being affected by coolant getting in it?

Could be, but it was serviced apparantly.

 

[Jay20cali]

Who serviced it??

 

[andyinluton]

Could be, but it was serviced apparantly.

Yes but what i'm trying to say is theres a leak in the EGR cooler which triggers the service indicator early as the oil is contaminated.

Van is then serviced, leak not noticed, 2 days later leak has got worse & all coolant lost.

If this is the case, the need for a service early is a good indicator that there is something wrong.

 

[G&Ts]

Firstly, thanks for all your comments, really nice to get input from other cali drivers. We are taking this in our stride, this could have happened while we were out gallivanting!

The oil service message began as we left for France, "Oil service in 1000 miles", Odometer read about 12500 miles at that point, checked fluid levels which were perfect, and we've never needed to top anything up. There was never an oil warning light lit, I'm unsure if the "1000 miles to oil service" is a fixed interval or from a sensor detecting oil quality or something.
We booked the service before returning to Blighty, and it went in a couple of days after we returned. Upon its return all the fluid levels were checked again, and were fine.
The first journey after the service was wonderful (as usual), the following day the engine took a fraction of a second longer to start - which I found unusual enough to turn it off and on again, this time it started fine, and I had an enjoyable commute to work.
After 4 hours being parked I went to start Ivan and all the lights except the constant yellow coil went off, and "check coolant" message was displayed. When I checked the coolant it was empty, with nowhere for it to be seen, no fluid in the engine bay, or the floor, and G couldn't see any on the drive at home. I checked the oil, and it was in the "too full" region of the dipstick - i think I'd found my coolant at this point!

The very nice man(tm) from VW Assist, topped up the coolant, connected the computer, and tried to start Ivan, with no joy. The coolant did drop a good couple of inches, but the computer didn't show any faults, when very-nice-man touched the battery terminals he realised the one to the starter motor was hot, so cleaned the terminals on the earthing wire to ensure that wasn't a problem, and decided to recover it after it failed to start.

So overall, no warnings on the dash prior to it happening, no warning signs besides an almost imperceptibly longer start time, and no faults shown via the VW Assists computer. The garage diagnosed the EGR valve as being responsible, and we will definitely be looking to get a more in depth explanation soon. They did comment that the pressure in one cylinder was 40, and the other 3 were showing 0, PSI not BAR i'd hope!

I'm thinking the egr valve will need to be occasionally checked and cleaned, which I will happily do if
a) I find out where it is, and how to do it.
and b) the wife (G) agrees!

I'll keep this post updated, and let you know how the new engine feels

 

[WelshGas]

Yes but what i'm trying to say is theres a leak in the EGR cooler which triggers the service indicator early as the oil is contaminated.

Van is then serviced, leak not noticed, 2 days later leak has got worse & all coolant lost.

If this is the case, the need for a service early is a good indicator that there is something wrong.

Agree. I wonder why the early service was indicated, presuming of course the Computer had been correctly set for Long Life Service Intervals.
I would have thought that any antifreeze in the oil would have given some indication of its presence when the oil was changed.
What I cannot understand is how the coolant got into the oil sump when the vehicle was parked up?

 

[andyinluton]

Im guessing it didn't all go in the sump as it wouldn't fit. Would it boil off when in contact with oil at 100 degrees?

I would imagine thats the reason for the replacement engine,if its been lubricated with hot water rather than oil every bearing could be scrap.

Lucky to have a "none start" failure rather than a big bang in the outside lane of a motorway.

 

[El Greco]

Could some of the water found its way into some cylinders? Engines are not good at compressing liquids.

 

[briwy]

Make sure that they fit a new turbo/s as well as the engine itself.
If water and other contaminents have got into the oil then it will have circulated round the turbo bearings as well with possible bad results.

 

[rod_vw]

If work under taken on warranty my understanding is than the new part warranty ends when the van warranty ends.

As far as I am aware all genuine VW parts come with a two year warranty regardless of who fits them. Obviously if incorrect fitting causes a failure then the warranty is nul & void. I would always insist on a receipt showing genuine parts have been fitted with dates etc. regardless of them being fitted under original vehicle warranty.

Rod

 

[Meoncoast]

As far as I am aware all genuine VW parts come with a two year warranty regardless of who fits them. Obviously if incorrect fitting causes a failure then the warranty is nul & void. I would always insist on a receipt showing genuine parts have been fitted with dates etc. regardless of them being fitted under original vehicle warranty.

I would argue with VW if appart failed again but was told if part fully paid for under warranty by VW you only get the remaining warranty left on the van from VW if you pay for a % 2 years cover on part and 1 year if fails due to workmanship of fitting.

 

[Gavrobb]

rrelevent question really but why was it in for a service? 10 months / 13000 miles seems a bit early.

Sorry to hear about this one G&T - not good. Need to read up a bit on this EGR and what / why / where its about. Terrible.

Local dealer seems confused all the time by this but is suggesting 10k service intervals - quote here - is this not the case??

 

[B J G]

Firstly, thanks for all your comments, really nice to get input from other cali drivers. We are taking this in our stride, this could have happened while we were out gallivanting!

The oil service message began as we left for France, "Oil service in 1000 miles", Odometer read about 12500 miles at that point, checked fluid levels which were perfect, and we've never needed to top anything up. There was never an oil warning light lit, I'm unsure if the "1000 miles to oil service" is a fixed interval or from a sensor detecting oil quality or something.
We booked the service before returning to Blighty, and it went in a couple of days after we returned. Upon its return all the fluid levels were checked again, and were fine.
The first journey after the service was wonderful (as usual), the following day the engine took a fraction of a second longer to start - which I found unusual enough to turn it off and on again, this time it started fine, and I had an enjoyable commute to work.
After 4 hours being parked I went to start Ivan and all the lights except the constant yellow coil went off, and "check coolant" message was displayed. When I checked the coolant it was empty, with nowhere for it to be seen, no fluid in the engine bay, or the floor, and G couldn't see any on the drive at home. I checked the oil, and it was in the "too full" region of the dipstick - i think I'd found my coolant at this point!

The very nice man(tm) from VW Assist, topped up the coolant, connected the computer, and tried to start Ivan, with no joy. The coolant did drop a good couple of inches, but the computer didn't show any faults, when very-nice-man touched the battery terminals he realised the one to the starter motor was hot, so cleaned the terminals on the earthing wire to ensure that wasn't a problem, and decided to recover it after it failed to start.

So overall, no warnings on the dash prior to it happening, no warning signs besides an almost imperceptibly longer start time, and no faults shown via the VW Assists computer. The garage diagnosed the EGR valve as being responsible, and we will definitely be looking to get a more in depth explanation soon. They did comment that the pressure in one cylinder was 40, and the other 3 were showing 0, PSI not BAR i'd hope!

I'm thinking the egr valve will need to be occasionally checked and cleaned, which I will happily do if
a) I find out where it is, and how to do it.
and b) the wife (G) agrees!

I'll keep this post updated, and let you know how the new engine feels

I'd say that if you look at the engine front you will see an assembly with numerous rubber hoses connected plus a metal flexible one then that's the EGR. Too many connections for my tinkering. My Wife's EOS had the EGR fail recently (that's how I identified the EGR on the Cali) and that was the part replaced, £600 but VW paid 90%. It had been in the Garage for a recall on brake ABS and given a full check over the day before which confirms your experience with no pre-warning indication. Didn't have the water issue though.

I'd be worried about potential contamination to the exhaust system which may not show up initially. Ask the garage to ensure that no contamination has occurred. Could cost nearly as much as the engine.

 

[WelshGas]

Sorry to hear about this one G&T - not good. Need to read up a bit on this EGR and what / why / where its about. Terrible.

Local dealer seems confused all the time by this but is suggesting 10k service intervals - quote here - is this not the case??

Longlife Service is 20,000 miles or 2 years, whichever comes first. But oil quality is monitered and oil change can be earlier depending on driving type.

 

[Dave bee]

I have a t5 180 which is running fine, however the more I read the more I think if it does go wrong I will seriously look at changing the engine to a 2.0 tsi petrol!! Vw still having issues with their Diesel engines and everyone slowly heading towards petrol.

 

[WelshGas]

I have a t5 180 which is running fine, however the more I read the more I think if it does go wrong I will seriously look at changing the engine to a 2.0 tsi petrol!! Vw still having issues with their Diesel engines and everyone slowly heading towards petrol.

I don't think the Tsi is any less complicated. Still has an EGR valve as far as I am aware.