Engine 'Chipped'?

Hello

I have an early Ocean with the 2.5 TDI engine; Has anyone had there's 'Chipped' for better MPG and has it worked?

Thank you

Padddy

i had my 140 remapped to 185 it did improve fuel economy and mid range torque

Had our old 140 5.1Beach remapped (just above 170) by Bognor Motors & current 5.1 Joker already had a professional remap (175). Improves mid range torque so less gear changes required, & improved economy if driven sensibly.

calikev said:

i had my 140 remapped to 185 it did improve fuel economy and mid range torque

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Thank you, do you mind if I ask how much it cost?

Paddy

Ch1pbutty said:

Had our old 140 5.1Beach remapped (just above 170) by Bognor Motors & current 5.1 Joker already had a professional remap (175). Improves mid range torque so less gear changes required, & improved economy if driven sensibly.

Click to expand...

Thank you, do you mind if I ask how much it cost?

Paddy

paddymounter said:

Thank you, do you mind if I ask how much it cost?

Paddy

Click to expand...

it was about 8 years ago i think it was £250 the came to me downloaded the data to store incase it needed putting back to standard re installed the new map it took about 2 hrs in total

calikev said:

it was about 8 years ago i think it was £250 the came to me downloaded the data to store incase it needed putting back to standard re installed the new map it took about 2 hrs in total

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Brilliant Thank you

My 2011 T5 SE was remapped by Breeze for £500 2 years ago. I was sceptical but economy was in low 30 mpg and is now 40 and it is quicker too. How do they do that?

Jools said:

My 2011 T5 SE was remapped by Breeze for £500 2 years ago. I was sceptical but economy was in low 30 mpg and is now 40 and it is quicker too. How do they do that?

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By ignoring adherence to emissions legislation to which the original OE-supplied vehicle is subject - look at VAG’s history (‘dieselgate’ 2004-2018, and a €1B fine) for a perspective !!!

Johnny Rocket said:

By ignoring adherence to emissions legislation to which the original OE-supplied vehicle is subject - look at VAG’s history (‘dieselgate’ 2004-2018, and a €1B fine) for a perspective !!!

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When you get an not you get the emissions test printout too - there’s no difference in emissions

Fun fact about vw engines - they are mostly the same in all vans / calis. Just every year they adjust the remapping software to add a couple hp on making it look like a new engine

Remapping technically can cause your engine to be hotter, hence the recommendation for higher quality fuels.

We remapped a 110hp transporter to 186hp

It was an absolute game changer for gear ratios too, and made motorways a dream

I had my previous 59-plate T5 conversion done & as above it noticeably improved performance and made it far better to drive. I think any fuel consumption benefit was offset by increased enthusiasm ...

Pendle Performance are well regarded - I went to their HQ in Yorkshire, but I understand they've now franchised their method / software. looks to be now £495 + VAT.

see: https://pendleperformance.com/our-agents/

Melyn said:

When you get an not you get the emissions test printout too - there’s no difference in emissions

Fun fact about vw engines - they are mostly the same in all vans / calis. Just every year they adjust the remapping software to add a couple hp on making it look like a new engine

Remapping technically can cause your engine to be hotter, hence the recommendation for higher quality fuels.

We remapped a 110hp transporter to 186hp

It was an absolute game changer for gear ratios too, and made motorways a dream

Click to expand...

Sorry, I hesitated to chip in (ha !) here - I am sure this is now going to run and run, but it's a serious business and with a huge amount of misinformation being peddled . . .


Firstly, please be aware that an MoT 'emissions test' measures only carbon monoxide (CO) and hydrocarbons (HC), and even that is done with extremely cheap and rudimentary equipment, and, crucially, at just a single set-point, which is at engine IDLE.

Your tuner's remapping almost certainly leaves the idle settings totally unchanged, hence the post-tuned emissions levels measured by the MoT man (for what they're worth - not much) will not change.


The 'performance' remapping exercise however is done over the real operating envelope of the engine, so at real-world speeds and, crucially, loads. It is in these regimes, when fuel flows are significant and combustion temperatures very high, that inevitable compromises are made compared with the factory mapping, and emissions of CO, HC and of NOx (oxides of nitrogen, such as NO, NO2) run significant risk of being greater . . . and outside of the legislated limits.

Yes, you can get performance and economy improvements from remapping, but there are both important emissions corollaries, plus possible effects on durability and longevity of hardware.

There is no magic - the mechanical hardware remains the same throughout all of this, so the only variables to play with are the limits of the operating regime (fuel flows, engine speeds, boost pressures etc.) and of course the combustion process itself, and the consequences of those changes on emissions levels, operating temperatures, warm-up etc..

All that the tuner does is to elect to run the engine and its systems closer to margins of safety, or to stray beyond / outside of the manufacturer's or legislator's limits, to achieve something which the manufacturer could also have done with the very same hardware, but chose not to.

By the way, the emissions gear required to demonstrate adherence to national and worldwide legislation is extremely complex and expensive, requiring transient full-power engine dynamometers and high-grade emissions-measuring equipment which only manufacturers and national / world testing bodies can afford - a decent set-up costs £millions. Then, the correlation effort required to reconcile between static engine dyno results and the real vehicle on the road is another huge challenge, something which made the proving of non-compliance by VAG in 'dieselegate' quite a task.

The instruments available to the humble MoT man are nothing other than very coarse and crude tools with which the horrors caused by simple defects such as failed piston rings, stuck injectors or shot valve guides would become evident.

What none of the outfits offering remapping can do, is demonstrate compliance of the modified system with the regulations.

I hope some of that might be of some help.

Enjoy your chipped motors, but, caveat emptor ;-) !!!

PS it's probably pretty obvious, but maybe also worth mentioning, that the total lifetime contribution to your vehicle's emissions output from time spent in the idling condition is vanishingly small, even if you were a coach driver or the vehicle spent its entire life queuing on routes down to the west country on sunny bank holiday weekends !

Johnny Rocket said:

Sorry, I hesitated to chip in (ha !) here - I am sure this is now going to run and run, but it's a serious business and with a huge amount of misinformation being peddled . . .


Firstly, please be aware that an MoT 'emissions test' measures only carbon monoxide (CO) and hydrocarbons (HC), and even that is done with extremely cheap and rudimentary equipment, and, crucially, at just a single set-point, which is at engine IDLE.

Your tuner's remapping almost certainly leaves the idle settings totally unchanged, hence the post-tuned emissions levels measured by the MoT man (for what they're worth - not much) will not change.


The 'performance' remapping exercise however is done over the real operating envelope of the engine, so at real-world speeds and, crucially, loads. It is in these regimes, when fuel flows are significant and combustion temperatures very high, that inevitable compromises are made compared with the factory mapping, and emissions of CO, HC and of NOx (oxides of nitrogen, such as NO, NO2) run significant risk of being greater . . . and outside of the legislated limits.

Yes, you can get performance and economy improvements from remapping, but there are both important emissions corollaries, plus possible effects on durability and longevity of hardware.

There is no magic - the mechanical hardware remains the same throughout all of this, so the only variables to play with are the limits of the operating regime (fuel flows, engine speeds, boost pressures etc.) and of course the combustion process itself, and the consequences of those changes on emissions levels, operating temperatures, warm-up etc..

All that the tuner does is to elect to run the engine and its systems closer to margins of safety, or to stray beyond / outside of the manufacturer's or legislator's limits, to achieve something which the manufacturer could also have done with the very same hardware, but chose not to.

By the way, the emissions gear required to demonstrate adherence to national and worldwide legislation is extremely complex and expensive, requiring transient full-power engine dynamometers and high-grade emissions-measuring equipment which only manufacturers and national / world testing bodies can afford - a decent set-up costs £millions. Then, the correlation effort required to reconcile between static engine dyno results and the real vehicle on the road is another huge challenge, something which made the proving of non-compliance by VAG in 'dieselegate' quite a task.

The instruments available to the humble MoT man are nothing other than very coarse and crude tools with which the horrors caused by simple defects such as failed piston rings, stuck injectors or shot valve guides would become evident.

What none of the outfits offering remapping can do, is demonstrate compliance of the modified system with the regulations.

I hope some of that might be of some help.

Enjoy your chipped motors, but, caveat emptor ;-) !!!

Click to expand...

Johnny Rocket said:

Sorry, I hesitated to chip in (ha !) here - I am sure this is now going to run and run, but it's a serious business and with a huge amount of misinformation being peddled . . .


Firstly, please be aware that an MoT 'emissions test' measures only carbon monoxide (CO) and hydrocarbons (HC), and even that is done with extremely cheap and rudimentary equipment, and, crucially, at just a single set-point, which is at engine IDLE.

Your tuner's remapping almost certainly leaves the idle settings totally unchanged, hence the post-tuned emissions levels measured by the MoT man (for what they're worth - not much) will not change.


The 'performance' remapping exercise however is done over the real operating envelope of the engine, so at real-world speeds and, crucially, loads. It is in these regimes, when fuel flows are significant and combustion temperatures very high, that inevitable compromises are made compared with the factory mapping, and emissions of CO, HC and of NOx (oxides of nitrogen, such as NO, NO2) run significant risk of being greater . . . and outside of the legislated limits.

Yes, you can get performance and economy improvements from remapping, but there are both important emissions corollaries, plus possible effects on durability and longevity of hardware.

There is no magic - the mechanical hardware remains the same throughout all of this, so the only variables to play with are the limits of the operating regime (fuel flows, engine speeds, boost pressures etc.) and of course the combustion process itself, and the consequences of those changes on emissions levels, operating temperatures, warm-up etc..

All that the tuner does is to elect to run the engine and its systems closer to margins of safety, or to stray beyond / outside of the manufacturer's or legislator's limits, to achieve something which the manufacturer could also have done with the very same hardware, but chose not to.

By the way, the emissions gear required to demonstrate adherence to national and worldwide legislation is extremely complex and expensive, requiring transient full-power engine dynamometers and high-grade emissions-measuring equipment which only manufacturers and national / world testing bodies can afford - a decent set-up costs £millions. Then, the correlation effort required to reconcile between static engine dyno results and the real vehicle on the road is another huge challenge, something which made the proving of non-compliance by VAG in 'dieselegate' quite a task.

The instruments available to the humble MoT man are nothing other than very coarse and crude tools with which the horrors caused by simple defects such as failed piston rings, stuck injectors or shot valve guides would become evident.

What none of the outfits offering remapping can do, is demonstrate compliance of the modified system with the regulations.

I hope some of that might be of some help.

Enjoy your chipped motors, but, caveat emptor ;-) !!!

Click to expand...

Super useful info! Appreciated

Melyn said:

Super useful info! Appreciated

Click to expand...

Not at all; my pleasure - it's often dead difficult to convey information on a subject one knows intimately, without appearing to lecture, or worse still be hectoring . . . I do hope I maybe achieved that, and thanks anyway for receiving it in the spirit intended!

Jools said:

My 2011 T5 SE was remapped by Breeze for £500 2 years ago. I was sceptical but economy was in low 30 mpg and is now 40 and it is quicker too. How do they do that?

Click to expand...

Thank You

calikev said:

i had my 140 remapped to 185 it did improve fuel economy and mid range torque

Click to expand...

Thank You

Johnny Rocket said:

Not at all; my pleasure - it's often dead difficult to convey information on a subject one knows intimately, without appearing to lecture, or worse still be hectoring . . . I do hope I maybe achieved that, and thanks anyway for receiving it in the spirit intended!

Click to expand...

Did you (or a mate) have a bad experience?

Ch1pbutty said:

Did you (or a mate) have a bad experience?

Click to expand...

With remapping you mean ?

Johnny Rocket said:

With remapping you mean ?

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Yes

A side issue. How much does one’s insurance go up?

With Adrianflux - 0. But it’s a known insured for ‘“modded” and states on their insurance policy too that they are fine with remaps