£5,800 fault - just out of warranty wwyd

[Ting Tong]

I took the precaution of having our 2018 California (204ps bi-turbo) serviced with a main dealer on 14 April 2023 as we were about to go to China for 5 months. I'd hoped that the service would identify any final issues before the extended warranty expired on 1 August 2023. I also asked them to investigate the recurring issue of the coil light illuminating on start up on almost every trip.

Upon collection, I was told that they were unable to identify any issue that would lead to the coil light illuminating. I remarked that I found their inability to find the fault concerning because were about to go away and the warranty was expiring. My remark was met by shrugging shoulders!

We are now back in the UK and the coil light still illuminates on start up on almost every trip. Also, having driven on the motorway, I note that performance was limited and so booked it in to be re-investigated. Miraculously, they can now find the fault and it needs a new Turbo plus a few other bits totalling £5,800! I have a meeting with the service manager about it tomorrow but he says there is no goodwill despite their inability to find the fault before the warranty expired and despite the fact it has only 500 miles since they looked at it.

Apart from explode, what would you do? If there's no goodwill, I'll take it elsewhere to be fixed.

 

[Daggartukvan1]

Sorry to hear this - I would point out that the fault was first reported whilst under warranty and regardless of any elapsed time it remains outstanding. I would have thought that their failure to diagnose is their own shortcoming and they haven't fulfilled their obligations under the terms of warranty (best to read them first though). Good luck and don't capitulate

 

[Elmo3]

The fault clearly pre existed expiry of the warranty. If they don’t fix it, letter before action and small claims court.

 

[Perfectos]

A fault reported whist in warranty that has not been fixed should be considered to be an existing condition that is covered under warranty!
it’s not your fault the garage did not correctly diagnose the the fault , in warranty, it’s is their fault they now agree !
You reported the fault whilst in warranty , they now agree the fault is a fault and agree the fault existed whilst in warranty .
the remedial measure is a. FOC fix otherwise take it legal.

 

[ivan & jill]

If you take the vehicle to an independent garage that has diagnostic kit that can read the detailed VW fault codes it may confirm when the fault first occurred. That would be clear evidence of the problem being within the warranty period.

 

[larrylamb]

First of all I would be after a second opinion on the turbo fault diagnosis.

 

[WelshGas]

I find it very suspicious that they couldn't find anything with the initial Diagnostic scan if the warning light was coming on at every start. Something was triggering that light and should have been seen if the vehicle was started whilst connected to the Diagnostic computer. The turbo problem may be connected or a separate problem..
The vehicle diagnostics really need examination by an expert.

 

[Ch1pbutty]

Typical VW.

It takes months to get your vehicle booked in, warranty clock continues to tick whilst you are waiting.

Van finally gets looked at and is not properly fixed. Warranty expires.

Work outside of warranty is paid for by the Owners, profit on the work boosts dealers PNL.

 

[Velma's Dad]

If they are still refusing after your meeting, and you're confident of your facts as you outlined above, offer to take it to an arbitration process (invite them to suggest one) but warn them that if they don't then participate you will have no hesitation in recovering your losses through the courts.

The small claims procedure (it's not actually a separate court) is very straightforward, you can do all the steps online but read carefully the guidance to make sure you've proposed some form of arbitration first.

Do all your communications with the company in writing (which can include emailing them a summary of what has been discussed and agreed/not agreed to date) and then make sure you send a formal letter before action to their registered office address.

Best of luck and let us know how you get on.

 

[Wannabecamperman]

If they are still refusing after your meeting, and you're confident of your facts as you outlined above, offer to take it to an arbitration process (invite them to suggest one) but warn them that if they don't then participate you will have no hesitation in recovering your losses through the courts.

The small claims procedure (it's not actually a separate court) is very straightforward, you can do all the steps online but read carefully the guidance to make sure you've proposed some form of arbitration first.

Do all your communications with the company in writing (which can include emailing them a summary of what has been discussed and agreed/not agreed to date) and then make sure you send a formal letter before action to their registered office address.

Best of luck and let us know how you get on.

Sound advice above.

Remain calm, polite and friendly throughout, but try to get the details presented to a Service Manager at the dealership that you reported the coil fault to prior to service. Then request that the Service Manager reply in writing to the arbitration suggestion.

Finally, when communicating your threat to go down the court route, write ''without prejudice'' in clear letters at the top of the communication, be that letter or email.

That should at least give the dealership pause for thought.

 

[Borris]

Have you tried VW customer relations department. Quote the terms of the Factory Extended Warranty which can be found online. Once you have discussed it with them then have your meeting with the dealership.
Don't expect the dealership service department to cough up without a fight. They are only protecting their margins by resorting to the "it's not covered" line. My experience is that they will usually try that tack first and only give in once you've pointed out what the FEW Ts and Cs say. The fact that you reported the fault before the FEW expired and that they were unable to fix it shouldn't matter. Stick to your guns.

 

[Dave Wickham]

The fault clearly pre existed expiry of the warranty. If they don’t fix it, letter before action and small claims court.

yes, first a letter of notification of legal action (u can get a template on t'internet) then small claims court. i reckon you'd win

 

[Ting Tong]

Thanks everyone.

I had the meeting today. It was amicable and they sympathise but have their hands tied by the VW warranty rules i.e. they wouldn't get paid if they did the work foc. The VCDS error codes in April 2023 weren't permanent ones as the coil light only came on occasionally at 1st start and could be cleared by stopping and restarting after 5 minutes. Apparently, nothing can be deduced from passive codes other than they occured: the coil light could be 1001 things and the technicians just follow the VW procedure in the work manual. My compliaint would be against VW and I have asked the dealer to contact them on my behalf but will also follow this up myself once we have a better picture of the issue.

There are now 2 active error codes: one is the oil pressure switch and the other is the turbo boost. I was concerned that they seem to heavily rely on the diagnois by VCDS but they say that they do some other checks to make sure it's the turbo: they can never be 100% sure but are usually right. One check is to stick a camera down it (which didn't show anything) and another is to feel the movement of some plunger, which didn't feel as it should. They said that wiring and sensor issues could simulate a turbo fault and spent time asking for details about the symptoms and had we done anything like been in water because there's some control box at bumper level. I remarked that it had seen a lot of sand and been through several sand storms in Morocco and Western Sahara in Feb / March (when the fault started to show)...then I remembered that we'd had squirrels or mice nesting in front of the battery in January just before we went. They are now following up on this lead in case wires have been nibbled.

Anyhow, they did say that VW recognise that there's an issue with the bi-turbo on 204ps vehicles and will contribute 50% to the part cost of £2170+vat. The engine has to come out and it's a 14 hour labour job at £90+vat, which the dealer was prepared to discount to £70+vat. Also, the VW manual specifies that every nut, bolt, washer and clip that is removed has to be replaced. Thus, there's a very long list of items ranging in cost from 10p to £10. which they would also discount by 50%, bringing the revised estimate down from £5,800+vat to £3,150+vat. The local VW independent quoted about £2k but that will be with a recon bi-turbo.

I'll report back when there's more news about the diagnosis and my planned course of action.

 

[WelshGas]

Thanks everyone.

I had the meeting today. It was amicable and they sympathise but have their hands tied by the VW warranty rules i.e. they wouldn't get paid if they did the work foc. The VCDS error codes in April 2023 weren't permanent ones as the coil light only came on occasionally at 1st start and could be cleared by stopping and restarting after 5 minutes. Apparently, nothing can be deduced from passive codes other than they occured: the coil light could be 1001 things and the technicians just follow the VW procedure in the work manual. My compliaint would be against VW and I have asked the dealer to contact them on my behalf but will also follow this up myself once we have a better picture of the issue.

There are now 2 active error codes: one is the oil pressure switch and the other is the turbo boost. I was concerned that they seem to heavily rely on the diagnois by VCDS but they say that they do some other checks to make sure it's the turbo: they can never be 100% sure but are usually right. One check is to stick a camera down it (which didn't show anything) and another is to feel the movement of some plunger, which didn't feel as it should. They said that wiring and sensor issues could simulate a turbo fault and spent time asking for details about the symptoms and had we done anything like been in water because there's some control box at bumper level. I remarked that it had seen a lot of sand and been through several sand storms in Morocco and Western Sahara in Feb / March (when the fault started to show)...then I remembered that we'd had squirrels or mice nesting in front of the battery in January just before we went. They are now following up on this lead in case wires have been nibbled.

Anyhow, they did say that VW recognise that there's an issue with the bi-turbo on 204ps vehicles and will contribute 50% to the part cost of £2170+vat. The engine has to come out and it's a 14 hour labour job at £90+vat, which the dealer was prepared to discount to £70+vat. Also, the VW manual specifies that every nut, bolt, washer and clip that is removed has to be replaced. Thus, there's a very long list of items ranging in cost from 10p to £10. which they would also discount by 50%, bringing the revised estimate down from £5,800+vat to £3,150+vat. The local VW independent quoted about £2k but that will be with a recon bi-turbo.

I'll report back when there's more news about the diagnosis and my planned course of action.

Don't forget if VW do the work there is a 2yr Parts & Labour warranty, not so sure with an Independent.

 

[Ting Tong]

Don't forget if VW do the work there is a 2yr Parts & Labour warranty, not so sure with an Independent.

The independent was an approximate cost and it’s bound to be more. For the sake of the difference, it’s a no brainier to get a warranted new turbo rather than a reconditioned, especially as the latter don’t get good reports.

 

[derek_j_buchanan]

The first 2 comments say it all. Under the consumer protection act you are covered and that’s all you have to say plus you will give them 2 weeks to reconsider their position at which time if you have heard nothing “you will be hearing from my solicitor“ (your solicitor). can remember the small claims court limit but think you’ll be over. we had a similar situation with the roof corrosion debacle. VW customer service is shite! I used to have contact to the top but they’ve moved on.

 

[Corradobrit]

can remember the small claims court limit but think you’ll be over.

The limit is 10K so the OP should be fine.

 

[tallow10]

I had a similar problem with them. Threatened them with small claims court and they caved in. They will be nice to your face but happy to stab you in the back !

 

[colintfcolintf]

Who up is the local independent and who is the dealer? Message me please if you prefer not to say in public domain. I’m looking for potential people to service mine and notice that you possible aren’t far from me, so could have a good lead or two. Thanks, and good luck resolving this to you satisfaction

 

[Ting Tong]

Who up is the local independent and who is the dealer? Message me please if you prefer not to say in public domain. I’m looking for potential people to service mine and notice that you possible aren’t far from me, so could have a good lead or two. Thanks, and good luck resolving this to you satisfaction

The dealer is Sinclair Cardiff and the independent is NG Motors on Portmanmoor Rd Ln in Splott. I used them for years with other VWs and they have been excellent. Not taken the Cali there yet.

 

[WelshGas]

The dealer is Sinclair Cardiff and the independent is NG Motors on Portmanmoor Rd Ln in Splott. I used them for years with other VWs and they have been excellent. Not taken the Cali there yet.

When buying I knew more about the California than the numpties in the showroom at Sinclair's VW. Have never been back.
Use South Hereford for the past 9 years. Just make a day out of it.

 

[colintfcolintf]

Thanks both, Hereford is on my potential list. I’m guessing it’s Vertu

 

[WelshGas]

Thanks both, Hereford is on my potential list. I’m guessing it’s Vertu

Yes, Centurian Way it’s a combined dealership, one showroom for cars & commercial and one workshop. They operate a shuttle service into the town.

 

[colintfcolintf]

Yes, Centurian Way it’s a combined dealership, one showroom for cars & commercial and one workshop. They operate a shuttle service into the town.

Many thanks WelshGas

 

[Azteccamper]

When buying I knew more about the California than the numpties in the showroom at Sinclair's VW. Have never been back.
Use South Hereford for the past 9 years. Just make a day out of it.

I had work done by Sinclair years ago. Some clueless guy give me a Transporter combi as a courtesy car. They delivered my Cali back to me and had no record of me having the combi and just shrugged their shoulders. Even rang them to say about Combi - no knowledge - eventually picked it up. Odd.
It was brand new, literally 6 miles on the clock (nice van too) often think should I have kept it