Climate Change.....our children and their children.

[Lightning]

I'm a walking talking contradiction (pretty much like everyone)
I have solar, a Powerwall for the house, ASHP replacing the oil boiler next month, an EV, bought some woodland, eat organic, have met most of the meat I eat.
What privaledge!
Only paid for by having a jetset job, I go transatlantic and I wipe out any "saving" made and usually end up on a plane way more than average.
But I also feel like it has to start somehow - the costs only go down as demand goes up, and demand is partial influenced by successes.

While ‘success’ is measured by increased GDP which is in turn driven by increased consumption it’s an uphill battle.

I read somewhere that Spain have recently recognised this as a fundamental problem and intend to somehow reframe their whole economic model towards protecting the environment.

 

[Amarillo]

And those 3 billions people more compared to when I was born, they are all in countries where people don't have money to afford kids. Isn't that a joke!

I think the opposite is true. They cannot afford not to have kids: they rely on their many kids to support them into old age.

Fertility rates are falling steadily, not only in rich countries, but in developing countries too.

When global fertility rates fall below 2.1 the global population will fall after a sufficient time lag - probably about an average lifetime. So while fertility rates do need to be brought down further, it is not the gargantuan Global task it once was - the battle is mainly won.

 

[Eber123]

Good morning,

To improve humans behaviour towards envorinment which develope in the last 100 years is a mammoth task. I don't evny the politicians and industrial leaders.

Yes, everybody can do their bit. But if we are honest, "normal" poeple have done that for decates. In school we've been informed and warned about the envoirmental impact. Our parents, experienced and remember the starving and suffering during the war and afterwards, thought us not to waste food, re-use what is possible to re-use, think what to through away, try to repair instead of replacing.

But our western culture in the last 50 years has influcenced us to life an easy, comfortable live. Industry developed products and services that lured us into a more "wasteful behavour" (I am not blaming the industry).

I think we all agree something needs to be done, but it is easier said than done. Millions and millions of money was invested in the car industry and therefor in our culture of travel. To declare this investment as obsolete in need of replacement is not easy and will ask for resistence. Poeple will lose their job, which cannot be replacment with new technology implemented by industrie. In Europe alone the tourist industry is fighting for each single visitor. Vistors which will than add more to the carbon emission output.

Heatings in houses all over the country. Depending in what country you live, there are hunderts of thousends old oil or gas heatings which are very bad for the environment. They need to be replaced. With what? Who will pay for this? Millions of cars older than 7 or 8 years damaging the air more than technology is able to prevent. Who will replace those? Who will pay for this? Radios, kitchen utilities etc. break. Who will repair them? During seaons in the year (Christmas, Easter, Halloween etc.) the additional plastic usage, who will recycle those? Looking for cheap food forces the suppliers to use chemicals on the land or inhuman handling of animals. Food will be transported half over the earth before we buy it for a few cent. Cost of housing forces us further way from the city. Commuting to work (whatever the transport is) was the result.

What I am trying to say is that it is complex to re-wind our way of living and change it to a more sustainalbe way of life respecting the enviornment (because we are part of the envoirnment we need to respect ourselves too).

In our household since years we try to do our best to be more envoirnmental conscious, but I admit, I don't like if the large investments I made (camper, house, heating etc) is been cursed on by groups of more radical envoirnmentalists.

We all have a lot to do to find togeher a solution in a respectful and constructive way to ensure that our world will be worth to live in for our children and their children.

Happy California,
Eberhard

 

[MattBW]

I think the opposite is true. They cannot afford not to have kids: they rely on their many kids to support them into old age.

Fertility rates are falling steadily, not only in rich countries, but in developing countries too.

When global fertility rates fall below 2.1 the global population will fall after a sufficient time lag - probably about an average lifetime. So while fertility rates do need to be brought down further, it is not the gargantuan Global task it once was - the battle is mainly won.

If you watch that show, the difference between a growing population and decreasing is just 2.4 per woman for increase to 2.3 per woman for decrease...

What that graph doesn't show is that our mortality rates have plummetted too. People are having less children but also far less are dying. I am sure it will level out at some point but where will we be by then?

 

[Calimili]

I think the opposite is true. They cannot afford not to have kids: they rely on their many kids to support them into old age.

Fertility rates are falling steadily, not only in rich countries, but in developing countries too.

When global fertility rates fall below 2.1 the global population will fall after a sufficient time lag - probably about an average lifetime. So while fertility rates do need to be brought down further, it is not the gargantuan Global task it once was - the battle is mainly won.

I respectfully disagree. It is the poor countries that cannot afford kids that have the highest birth rates.
https://www.indexmundi.com/g/r.aspx?v=25https://www.indexmundi.com/g/r.aspx?v=25
If you are looking for UK, EU countries and US, scroll down. A lot.
And certainly not because they have different values than us "westeners", because they seem quite desperate to risk their lives in perilous journeys to reach our shores. They must think "here" is better than "there".

 

[Amarillo]

If you watch that show, the difference between a growing population and decreasing is just 2.4 per woman for increase to 2.3 per woman for decrease...

What that graph doesn't show is that our mortality rates have plummetted too. People are having less children but also far less are dying. I am sure it will level out at some point but where will we be by then?

That's exactly right. It will take a lifetime for a stable fertility rate to be reflected by a stable population - only war is likely to alter that. What we need to do is prepare for that maximum population, and not use the inevitable rise in population as an excuse for doing nothing.

It might be that Global population will top out at 10 billion. Managing Africa's growing population will be key.

 

[MattBW]

or a severe pandemic or food shortage perhaps...

 

[soulstyledevon]

The population has doubled since I was born! We now have 7.7 billion people in the world when in 1890 we had 1 billion... Let that sink in. In 130 years we have increased our population by 8 times... almost like bacteria expanding to consume all the fuel.

The problem for me is simply too many people and the pressure to keep feeding all those people is half the problem that is causing us to lose forests to grow food. Driving cars and such and eating meat wouldn't be a problem if there werent nearly 8 billion of us but there are and we need to make changes to protect ourselves. Then you have developing nations seeking to raise their standard of living, they aren't going to consume less are they? Only more...

I think sadly the human being needs to learn things the hard way, nature will sort us out even if we can't exercise some good judgement as a species. Hopefully we will adapt sooner rather than too late.

Watched this yesterday, really puts it in perspective.

BBC Two - Horizon, 2020, Chris Packham: 7.7 Billion People and Counting

Naturalist Chris Packham investigates the impact of our growing human population.

www.bbc.co.uk

I watched that Tuesday night and found it absolutely fascinating.
I love Packham’s no nonsense plain speaking.

Didn’t he say its countries in the west and developed world creating the pollution and down to our uncontrollable consumption.
We can’t go blaming countries in Africa.

Personally myself, I’ve been on a mission for some time to scale down and reduce what I buy and use.
Even adapting the same thought process within my campervan, hence not needing additional stoves and awning etc...

I’m a big follower of the minimalist movement.
Bizarrely I’m happier with less.

 

[GrannyJen]

Walk across any landfill and see what we throw away and convert that into human and environment suffering.

It's not what we eat, it's what we don't eat but throw away. It's not what we use, it's what we don't use, the wasteful packaging, the discarded technology, the "stuff" we need this year but don't need next year.

I'm not preaching. I'm nagging myself.

 

[Calimili]

Walk across any landfill and see what we throw away and convert that into human and environment suffering.

It's not what we eat, it's what we don't eat but throw away. It's not what we use, it's what we don't use, the wasteful packaging, the discarded technology, the "stuff" we need this year but don't need next year.

I'm not preaching. I'm nagging myself.

I never waste any of the diesel I buy, I use it all.

 

[Ch1pbutty]

Delicious craft beer brewed using surplus bread | Toast Brewing

We brew with surplus bread, turning leftover loaves into liquid gold. All profits go to environmental charities.

www.toastale.com

 

[Ocean Spirit]

I believe there is a urgent need of clarity to identify what the actual problems are and how to tackle them.

Yes, absolutely!
But even if we separate out pollution and Climate change and anything else into more understandable categories and appropriate combative measures we need to tackle them all to survive.

My final thought today lies with large families....
Something that may have been carried through unknowing generations as tradition with pride and no inkling of the eventual issues being discussed today regarding the extent of their contribution to over population.
While it may sadden some people moving forward, education of the matter should inspire most people to reduce the number of intended offspring on the basis that generally people are reasonable.

I have lived in the same area practically all my life, the infrastructure is the same
but
the housing is up by a huge amount,
the emissions from the volume of extra traffic all at a standstill at peak times in increased massively
Some of that traffic is simply because Mum and dad would go crazy stuck in the house with 5 kids so they go out.
The more kids the more financial benefit.
Our schools are full and some parents travel further delivering kids to different schools outside the catchment areas so are faced with tough choices regarding transport.
ETC ETC ETC

I'd like to see a program Senior schools have to deliver that pulls all this together logically and is able to pul in stats so the children can make informed decisions about the future.
I am heartened when some children have greater understanding than those adults who do not care at all.
But each day without a concious effort is another day closer to disaster.

 

[BenPcaliman]

Just watching "Horizon 2020 Chris Packham 7.7 Billion people and counting" eye opener

 

[mpglueck]

Ha Ha. You post this tonight after me spotting this
earlier today.
I have mixed feelings.
View attachment 54483

That must be a real German idiot....

 

[Sp0_0k]

[QUOTE="hotel california, post: 397083, member: 4572"
Main reason for a lot of problems in the world in general is overpopulation resulting in overconsumption imo.
[/QUOTE]
This. Rest is ignorant bs.

 

[Dorchest]

Great new short climate change video here - serious message but seriously funny too - please share it widely:

I worry for the future of our children. I didn’t really want children personally but I was endowed with SAS sperm that could defeat any contraceptive known to woman! Love them to bits (my children - not my sperm) but I wish the future was looking less bleak.

 

[Amarillo]

A different take on population increase in this weeks economist:

Across the bloc women can expect to have an average of 1.6 babies each, or as few as 1.3 in some countries. That leaves Europe with too few children to maintain its population absent immigration.

Europe has good and bad reasons for wanting more babies

Policies to reward fertility can disguise vote-buying, or worse

www.economist.com

 

[Calimili]

A different take on population increase in this weeks economist:

Across the bloc women can expect to have an average of 1.6 babies each, or as few as 1.3 in some countries. That leaves Europe with too few children to maintain its population absent immigration.

Europe has good and bad reasons for wanting more babies

Policies to reward fertility can disguise vote-buying, or worse

www.economist.com

Therefore advocating people to have less children in Europe where children can be afforded better than Africa or other poor countries, where the education they can receive is far superior in Europe, a lot has been done here to reduce the environmental impact of our life style and industries, must be somehow a bit incorrect, im my opinion.
It' people who can't afford children that should stop reproducing...
Immigration will not balance the problem.

 

[Stewart Hall]

I really do not know what sort of reaction this post will get.
But Climate change has been something nobody ever wanted to believe to be a phenomenon that Humans are responsible for or that it is truly a more than passing cyclic series of extremities that occur naturally from time to time.
Beleiver or sceptic there are undeniably scary things going on in the world and the acceleration of the scary extremities that are having devastating effects on the planet and our lives are so far reaching now I have to wonder whether the world will change the way we live unrecognisably before we respect whats happening enough to take the advice out there and stem the tide so to speak.

I can't profess to understanding whats thrown at us in terms of scientific evidence or to being very pro-active in ensuring I do everything I can to help. But in 2020 the weight of the onformation passed our way and the events they speak of have reached a level where I am in no doubt. Eroding shore lines, strong storms, floods, extreme heat, increased health issues are now dominating our lives in a way we can no longer look back on as an isolated historical freak moment. It's switched from an occasional report to absolutely daily warning and daily consequences for all to see.
What will it take for the world to pull together on this and instead of just listening to the news actually make the right changes? how smart are we? Can we control human population growth or are we to selfish? How much will that help? will we walk the kids to school instead of sitting outside the gates in the car for 20 minutes so we get a good space and sit there with the engine running? Do we need to fly so often? how many single use products am I going to throw away?
I'm damn sure we all have moments where we care and others when we only think about our own actions as a priority.

I saw a young lady on TV this week who has chosen not to have children because of all the things going on in the world that a child would be bought into and how it would simply add to the problem.

Quite a deep post from a climate change novice.....and not one that I have written trying to be smart in anyway. It's written because I'm scared for the children over the coming generations and I accept every step put on me by authorities so long as I can see past a money making scheme and I want to do more independantly too. It doesn't mean I'll never fly, it doesn't mean I'm desperate to swap out my diesel T6....but I am a convert, it's here and we have to choices as far as I'm concerned and they are....
Decide it's someone elses problem and let nature take it's course and hope future generations can reclaim something after multiple disasters
or
Think a little more everyday about our own actions big and small and do the right thing accepting that the right thing to do is not always what we wanted.
Education is the key and there is no excuse for ignorance.
If you believe recycling is key then recycle. If you think unnecessary traffic is the problem, drive less but do something and keep doing something.

‍‍‍............!

 

[Stewart Hall]

‍‍‍.........!!

 

[Lightning]

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[sidepod]

I just work on the basis that the human race is but a blink of an eye in the great scheme of things. When I look at some of the things going on in the world I often wish Mother Nature would hurry up and f**k us all once and for all. We simply do not deserve this planet.

 

[Thepuma]

I wonder what the Woolly Mammoths blamed theor global warming/climate change on before it made them extinct.

Guess we will never know lol

 

[Ozzy Pete]

I just work on the basis that the human race is but a blink of an eye in the great scheme of things. When I look at some of the things going on in the world I often wish Mother Nature would hurry up and f**k us all once and for all. We simply do not deserve this planet.

The human race is 1 minute to midnight in the grand scheme of things. And still we’ve cocked it up..

 

[Lightning]

I wonder what the Woolly Mammoths blamed theor global warming/climate change on before it made them extinct.

Guess we will never know lol

Human hunting didn’t help.

DNA clues to why woolly mammoth died out

The last woolly mammoths were wracked with genetic disease and had a strange shiny coat, say scientists.

www.bbc.com