H&R anti roll bar fitting

[Ian Young]

Hi,
I am going to fit H&R uprated anti roll bar to my 17 plate Ocean and was wondering which adjustment hole most people use on the front bar?
I assume front hole will be softer and rear hole harder.
My van is running standard 17 wheels with standard springs and shocks.
Main reason for fitting the bars is to stop the van from rolling and causing travel sickness.
Thanks
Ian

 

[Bobbybus]

It's a shame nobody replied; probably nobody has fitted them. I am going to fit them, so was wondering if you had found out through other means.

 

[tuono001]

Just to ressurect this what did you go for in the end?
Hopefully getting mine fitted in the next week or two.

 

[sidepod]

Entirely depends on how you like the van to handle.

Stiffer front will give more understeer ( straight on in a corner), softer front less understeer.

 

[Jester]

I hired a Cali before ordering and came to the same conclusion as you re travel sickness.

So from factory I had the HD antiroll bars fitted and the springs fitted via the dealer ie lowerd by 30mm.

Although we have not had much time on the road imo it greatly improved the roll.
There is a little more crashing not enough to put me off. I’m on 18’s you should feel less on 17’s

 

[Bobbybus]

Not taken the leap yet. The 4motion is a vehicle many supplier/fitter want to shy away from as there is not much room at the rear making awkward for them. Some say fitting lowering springs at the rear can cause problems for the angle of the drive shafts; fact or fiction?
It doesn't help that the California/4motion has a mix of t28/30/32 parts. At least that's what I have been told.
There isn't a company I have found yet that will commit with confidence, or give me the confidence of their advice for me to commit to them.

 

[Skewif]

Not taken the leap yet. The 4motion is a vehicle many supplier/fitter want to shy away from as there is not much room at the rear making awkward for them. Some say fitting lowering springs at the rear can cause problems for the angle of the drive shafts; fact or fiction?
It doesn't help that the California/4motion has a mix of t28/30/32 parts. At least that's what I have been told.
There isn't a company I have found yet that will commit with confidence, or give me the confidence of their advice for me to commit to them.

What exactly do you want to cure? The bounciness? Wollowiness? Roll? Do you really want to go lower or stay the same height?

 

[briwy]

Not taken the leap yet. The 4motion is a vehicle many supplier/fitter want to shy away from as there is not much room at the rear making awkward for them. Some say fitting lowering springs at the rear can cause problems for the angle of the drive shafts; fact or fiction?
It doesn't help that the California/4motion has a mix of t28/30/32 parts. At least that's what I have been told.
There isn't a company I have found yet that will commit with confidence, or give me the confidence of their advice for me to commit to them.

Re the driveshaft angles I can't see that as a problem provided the lowering isn't ridiculous. We have air suspension which for general driving is usually in Sport mode. Nearly 60k miles with no problems.

 

[Bobbybus]

What exactly do you want to cure? The bounciness? Wollowiness? Roll? Do you really want to go lower or stay the same height?

I'm hoping to cure the wallowing by fitting slightly stiffer springs with matching damping. Lowering would be nice but not essential, though I don't want to have a higher ride height. I have the CFCA engine and DSG as well as 4motion and according to my California supplement have a GVW of 3080kg with a front axle rating of 1600kg and rear axle rating of 1575kg (I know, those figures don't total 3080). I don't want coilovers and something like the Bilstien b12 is not tailored sufficiently to my vehicle. Often I am presented by companies saying 'this is what we offer' but the solution is just too generic.
I also want to flatten the roll out by fitting H&R arb and this is where some companies have become reluctant to commit, saying how 'difficult' it is to fit them at the rear because of the drive shafts etc.

 

[Skewif]

I'm hoping to cure the wallowing by fitting slightly stiffer springs with matching damping. Lowering would be nice but not essential, though I don't want to have a higher ride height. I have the CFCA engine and DSG as well as 4motion and according to my California supplement have a GVW of 3080kg with a front axle rating of 1600kg and rear axle rating of 1575kg (I know, those figures don't total 3080). I don't want coilovers and something like the Bilstien b12 is not tailored sufficiently to my vehicle. Often I am presented by companies saying 'this is what we offer' but the solution is just too generic.
I also want to flatten the roll out by fitting H&R arb and this is where some companies have become reluctant to commit, saying how 'difficult' it is to fit them at the rear because of the drive shafts etc.

Assuming you are on stock springs and shocks with a fair few miles I recommend fitting some decent rear shocks first. This will make a huge difference and remove the wollowiness. For ~£150 it transforms the ride. Just the new shocks won’t reduce the amount of roll at the apex of a corner but will instantly feel like you have less roll when turning in / changing direction.
If you’re happy lowering then the VW sports springs all round will give you more level cornering though even less suspension travel. If you don’t mind going up just a small amount (~25mm) only on the rear then fitting T32 rear springs are a great way to reduce a lot of roll and make the ride better especially when loaded.
Another option would be to fit new rear shocks and the VW uprated ARB’s front and rear instead of the H&R ones as a bit more forgiving and not a modification. Though most just do the rear as easy to do and provides most of the improvement.

 

[Bobbybus]

Plenty to think about. Thanks for your replies. I'm hoping to have a 'one shot solution' but there are so many variables...Maybe I will have a moment of clarity and 'bite the bullet'.

 

[ferret99]

To again resurrect this, what did you do @Bobbybus ? I'm in a similar position of wondering about springs and ARBs on my '16 Ocean.

 

[Bobbybus]

Ferrett99, I had H&R hd anti roll bars fitted. Less roll and less understeer. I have not changed the springs or dampers. I do not think I shall be lowering the vehicle, but may change the dampers to Bilstien eventually.
Ironically, the fitment of the new arb has raised the vehicle slightly! Others on here have reported similar, though I don't understand why that should have happened.

 

[clarinetbcn]

Ferrett99, I had H&R hd anti roll bars fitted. Less roll and less understeer. I have not changed the springs or dampers. I do not think I shall be lowering the vehicle, but may change the dampers to Bilstien eventually.
Ironically, the fitment of the new arb has raised the vehicle slightly! Others on here have reported similar, though I don't understand why that should have happened.

It's possible that the new rubber bushings in the mounting points of the arb are responsible, but only in the sense that they would return the vehicle to its original spec height. There is some longitudinal torsion on the outside bushing even when both sides of the suspension are compressed equally. An old bushing could have ceded, and the new bushing would put things back in place.

It pays to be aware when raising arb strength relative to springs, because on a straight road with the body flat, when only one side of the suspension hits a bump, part of the suspension compression of the bump will be transmitted to the other side, reducing the advantage of independent suspension in this case.

 

[Maxx]

I recently had the 30mm lowering springs fitted by VW during a service. I am pretty happy with the result. The body roll is significantly reduced to the extent that when it rolls now in a corner, it kind of feels justified!

 

[B J G]

It's possible that the new rubber bushings in the mounting points of the arb are responsible, but only in the sense that they would return the vehicle to its original spec height. There is some longitudinal torsion on the outside bushing even when both sides of the suspension are compressed equally. An old bushing could have ceded, and the new bushing would put things back in place.

It pays to be aware when raising arb strength relative to springs, because on a straight road with the body flat, when only one side of the suspension hits a bump, part of the suspension compression of the bump will be transmitted to the other side, reducing the advantage of independent suspension in this case.

The ARB's can also try to do the same if using ramps on one side to level when parking.
More noticeable if air suspension fitted.

 

[sidepod]

the fitment of the new arb has raised the vehicle slightly! Others on here have reported similar, though I don't understand why that should have happened.

Physically impossible

 

[Bobbybus]

Physically impossible

That is what I thought...but it has, by about 10-15mm.

 

[B J G]

That is what I thought...but it has, by about 10-15mm.

Have you ever tried disconnecting both sides at the front with a height measure before and after?

Easier to ask than actually take the time to do.

 

[sidepod]

That is what I thought...but it has, by about 10-15mm.

Then there is something else in play.

 

[Bobbybus]

Have you ever tried disconnecting both sides at the front with a height measure before and after?

Easier to ask than actually take the time to do.

No. The mot is due July and I had intended to have my usual independent VW specialist to have a look, but the mot has now been extended until January. There is no detriment to ride and the handling is improved. And of course, I am not using it so much at the moment.