T 6.1 control panel battery capacity

[Gazzer01]

Update
Cube fuse (and 2 spares) arrived this morning (£4.95 each plus delivery)
1, I checked the voltage levels of the rear battery which was good and fully charged
2, Removed the blown 100A cube fuse by simply removing the positive cable from the front battery to the rear battery and replaced with a new fuse and then very attached the positive cable followed by carefully tightening the retaining nut.
3, Checked the control panel (See picture below) which was all good.
4, Started engine and ran for 15 minutes periodically checking control panel voltage and current
5, Set control panel to maximum charge and observed van revs and positive charge current increase.
6, As the batteries were already charged, observed the current decrease after a little while followed by a negative current draw (presumably as the starter battery took charge/equalised) for a while.

Conclusion
All now resolved thanks to @yossarian @WelshGas and will keep a continued eye when on site on EHU along with general driving. I remain curious if the fuse had a manufacture fault or there was a genuine current >100 A. Time will tell on that one.

Finally, Sharing your knowledge is truly gratefully appreciated and saved me a lot of time and effort. Thank you !!!!!!!

 

[WelshGas]

Update
Cube fuse (and 2 spares) arrived this morning (£4.95 each plus delivery)
1, I checked the voltage levels of the rear battery which was good and fully charged
2, Removed the blown 100A cube fuse by simply removing the positive cable from the front battery to the rear battery and replaced with a new fuse and then very attached the positive cable followed by carefully tightening the retaining nut.
3, Checked the control panel (See picture below) which was all good.
4, Started engine and ran for 15 minutes periodically checking control panel voltage and current
5, Set control panel to maximum charge and observed van revs and positive charge current increase.
6, As the batteries were already charged, observed the current decrease after a little while followed by a negative current draw (presumably as the starter battery took charge/equalised) for a while.

Conclusion
All now resolved thanks to @yossarian @WelshGas and will keep a continued eye when on site on EHU along with general driving. I remain curious if the fuse had a manufacture fault or there was a genuine current >100 A. Time will tell on that one.

Finally, Sharing your knowledge is truly gratefully appreciated and saved me a lot of time and effort. Thank you !!!!!!!

View attachment 99906

Could be a faulty fuse, they are fragile.

 

[yossarian]

Interesting comparison, there are far worse dealer examples than this one:

	This thread	Alternative thread
Problem	Cube fuse	Cube fuse
Vehicle	T6.1	T6.1
Repair type	DIY	Dealer
Dealer visits	0	2
Time to repair	4 days	+- 40 days
Cost	+- £10	Free

The advantages of DIY (in this case) are quite compelling:

• Battery does not sit around sulphating while you wait for your dealer.
• Less chance of blowing additional fuses.
• Batteries equalised properly using a current limiting charger before parallel connection.
• Less driving around.
• No trying to explain electrics to VW.
• Ability to repair during a holiday.

I understand that not everyone has the requisite skill set. But if you do I'd suggest the DIY route. Tools to pack:

• Multimeter.
• 10mm and 13mm spanners.
• 1 Ohm 10W or so resistor if you have such a thing in your shed.
• Spare fuses.

Congrats to @Gazzer01 for the quick, neat and well documented resolution. @andy.bowen-ashwin@ I'm glad your problem was resolved and thanks for reporting the resolution.

 

[HappyGus]

That's a nice job! I'm not sure I would have managed myself this. If I understood correctly, the blown fuse is directly on the rear battery? Not with the other VW T6 fuses? Is the battery charging in between mandatory? Because it start to make a lot of tools to have :s

 

[Gazzer01]

That's a nice job! I'm not sure I would have managed myself this. If I understood correctly, the blown fuse is directly on the rear battery? Not with the other VW T6 fuses? Is the battery charging in between mandatory? Because it start to make a lot of tools to have :s

@HappyGus You raise an interesting personal point here about being unsure if you could have managed this yourself as I was thinking exactly the same as you initially !!. The van was new and delivered only a few weeks prior, to the failure, I had no experience with this type of vehicle previously, I had a very good idea there was a problem but no idea whatsoever A; how to troubleshoot and B; how to rectify.

The trigger point for me at least was the experience of forum members in @yossarian and @WelshGas who provided the guidance to troubleshoot and rectify as well as building my confidence along the way. In my mind at the beginning was the option to simply take the van to the dealer and have it fixed under warranty and to leave it to them, however I have read threads on the forum that its not always found by the dealers in a timely manner and other complications can arise. @yossarian summed this up very nicely in his post showing a specific comparison to a dealer fix versus a DIY approach.

"Doing it yourself" is a calculated decision I ultimately took as I believed the forum support would be there based on their previous experiences with the same problem and the logical and credible way it was explained to me. That may not be the right decision for other issues but I know was the right one in my case.

Ultimately, If you still feel unsure then my recommendation for what its worth as a beginner would be to go with your gut instinct - a GBP 75,000 van (in my case) is an awful lot of money after all.

You are absolutely correct in that the (ceramic) fuse is directly connected to the rear leisure battery positive terminal in isolation and not a conventional (bladed ) fuse in a fuse box with other fuses.

Will leave to @yossarian and @WelshGas to comment with their guidance on whether its mandatory to charge prior to swapping out the fuse but for me it was a very successful approach.

 

[WelshGas]

That's a nice job! I'm not sure I would have managed myself this. If I understood correctly, the blown fuse is directly on the rear battery? Not with the other VW T6 fuses? Is the battery charging in between mandatory? Because it start to make a lot of tools to have :s

@HappyGus You raise an interesting personal point here about being unsure if you could have managed this yourself as I was thinking exactly the same as you initially !!. The van was new and delivered only a few weeks prior, to the failure, I had no experience with this type of vehicle previously, I had a very good idea there was a problem but no idea whatsoever A; how to troubleshoot and B; how to rectify.

The trigger point for me at least was the experience of forum members in @yossarian and @WelshGas who provided the guidance to troubleshoot and rectify as well as building my confidence along the way. In my mind at the beginning was the option to simply take the van to the dealer and have it fixed under warranty and to leave it to them, however I have read threads on the forum that its not always found by the dealers in a timely manner and other complications can arise. @yossarian summed this up very nicely in his post showing a specific comparison to a dealer fix versus a DIY approach.

"Doing it yourself" is a calculated decision I ultimately took as I believed the forum support would be there based on their previous experiences with the same problem and the logical and credible way it was explained to me. That may not be the right decision for other issues but I know was the right one in my case.

Ultimately, If you still feel unsure then my recommendation for what its worth as a beginner would be to go with your gut instinct - a GBP 75,000 van (in my case) is an awful lot of money after all.

You are absolutely correct in that the (ceramic) fuse is directly connected to the rear leisure battery positive terminal in isolation and not a conventional (bladed ) fuse in a fuse box with other fuses.

Will leave to @yossarian and @WelshGas to comment with their guidance on whether its mandatory to charge prior to swapping out the fuse but for me it was a very successful approach.

Ideally, batteries wired in parallel should be same type, same age and same output when connected to avoid significant power surges on connection.
Thus, when the Cube fuse blows, if the voltages of the 2 disconnected batteries are very similar, just replacing the fuse and reconnecting the batteries is OK.
Its only when the rear battery has a significantly lower voltage is their a problem.
When the cube fuse blows, the front leisure battery will be charged by the engine, if driving, or by the built in charger if connected to EHU.
Not so the rear leisure battery, whose voltage will decline over time.

I‘ve solved that particular problem. I have a 100w Solar Panel wired to the rear leisure battery BUT wired below the Cube Fuse.
In this Scenario the Rear leisure battery is kept fully charged even if the fuse blows. Also I know the fuse has blown as I will not see the Solar Panel voltage on the camping Control Panel.

 

[yossarian]

@HappyGus You raise an interesting personal point here about being unsure if you could have managed this yourself as I was thinking exactly the same as you initially !!. The van was new and delivered only a few weeks prior, to the failure, I had no experience with this type of vehicle previously, I had a very good idea there was a problem but no idea whatsoever A; how to troubleshoot and B; how to rectify.

The trigger point for me at least was the experience of forum members in @yossarian and @WelshGas who provided the guidance to troubleshoot and rectify as well as building my confidence along the way. In my mind at the beginning was the option to simply take the van to the dealer and have it fixed under warranty and to leave it to them, however I have read threads on the forum that its not always found by the dealers in a timely manner and other complications can arise. @yossarian summed this up very nicely in his post showing a specific comparison to a dealer fix versus a DIY approach.

"Doing it yourself" is a calculated decision I ultimately took as I believed the forum support would be there based on their previous experiences with the same problem and the logical and credible way it was explained to me. That may not be the right decision for other issues but I know was the right one in my case.

Ultimately, If you still feel unsure then my recommendation for what its worth as a beginner would be to go with your gut instinct - a GBP 75,000 van (in my case) is an awful lot of money after all.

You are absolutely correct in that the (ceramic) fuse is directly connected to the rear leisure battery positive terminal in isolation and not a conventional (bladed ) fuse in a fuse box with other fuses.

Will leave to @yossarian and @WelshGas to comment with their guidance on whether its mandatory to charge prior to swapping out the fuse but for me it was a very successful approach.

One battery manufacturer, a good source of information to me over decades, tells their service personnel to charge all batteries to at least 12.4V before doing anything.

My personal theory is that if VW did this their customer satisfaction on leisure battery problems would be much greater. I've done the math on here before one could search for it.

In a pinch it is simply necessary to have both batteries at a similar state of charge. Very easily achieved with a low value resistor. But even with only a voltmeter it can be done.

 

[Steve1]

That's a nice job! I'm not sure I would have managed myself this. If I understood correctly, the blown fuse is directly on the rear battery? Not with the other VW T6 fuses? Is the battery charging in between mandatory? Because it start to make a lot of tools to have :s

Not mandatory I would say, but nicer.
If one is charged and one very flat you would get a similar level of sparking to when you use jump leads from a good vehicle to a flat one. Which might be a bit disturbing in a confined space. Also a small chance if the surge is big the 100A fuse could blow on connection, but probably fairly unlikely it's not much different to the split charge relay opening with a charged main battery and flat leisure ones and that is protected by an 80A fuse I believe.
Charging them to the same level is better though overall to prevent the sparks and the surge.

 

[andy.bowen-ashwin@]

i had written about this problem back in August with my 1 year old Ocean. Battery was only showing half full even after EHU and thousands of miles driving. This forum suggested Cube fuse as a potential fix.

During use in August got even worse and dropped to only 2 bars of 9.

After two trips to the dealer (4 days at a time ) they diagnosed - cube fuse blown! This was replaced and all fine now and fully charged. Have VW a knowledge base on faults as this seems to be a common problem? Dealers seem more geared up to fix Transporters and not Calis. My dealer says they have now recruited a Cali specialist as a lot of vehicles out there. Will now consider getting a spare cube fuse in case it happens again.

 

[G3WRT]

Update
Cube fuse (and 2 spares) arrived this morning (£4.95 each plus delivery)
1, I checked the voltage levels of the rear battery which was good and fully charged
2, Removed the blown 100A cube fuse by simply removing the positive cable from the front battery to the rear battery and replaced with a new fuse and then very attached the positive cable followed by carefully tightening the retaining nut.
3, Checked the control panel (See picture below) which was all good.
4, Started engine and ran for 15 minutes periodically checking control panel voltage and current
5, Set control panel to maximum charge and observed van revs and positive charge current increase.
6, As the batteries were already charged, observed the current decrease after a little while followed by a negative current draw (presumably as the starter battery took charge/equalised) for a while.

Conclusion
All now resolved thanks to @yossarian @WelshGas and will keep a continued eye when on site on EHU along with general driving. I remain curious if the fuse had a manufacture fault or there was a genuine current >100 A. Time will tell on that one.

Finally, Sharing your knowledge is truly gratefully appreciated and saved me a lot of time and effort. Thank you !!!!!!!

View attachment 99906

i had written about this problem back in August with my 1 year old Ocean. Battery was only showing half full even after EHU and thousands of miles driving. This forum suggested Cube fuse as a potential fix.

During use in August got even worse and dropped to only 2 bars of 9.

After two trips to the dealer (4 days at a time ) they diagnosed - cube fuse blown! This was replaced and all fine now and fully charged. Have VW a knowledge base on faults as this seems to be a common problem? Dealers seem more geared up to fix Transporters and not Calis. My dealer says they have now recruited a Cali specialist as a lot of vehicles out there. Will now consider getting a spare cube fuse in case it happens again.

I would like to read more on this score. In my view a +/- meter would be a good idea , an analogue meter fitted to most 1950 cars. But I realise this will never happen for cosmetic reasons , yet it is required to improve the human interface..

 

[G3WRT]

Could be a faulty fuse, they are fragile.

What is actually required is an a simple analogue meter + and minus too simple to be incorporated as it was in the 1950's. We go forward and backward.

 

[Peter84]

I have a blown cube fuse as well on my 2022 T6.1 Ocean. Ordered 75A fuses in advance before stumbling upon this thread, just found out mine has a 100A fitted as well. Will it be a problem to use a 75A fuse? Going away for the weekend and won't receive a 100A in time as I need to order them, the local car parts supplier looked very confused when I asked for one and didn't had them in stock.

 

[Peter84]

Oh and while I'm at it, anybody knows what the flexible black tube/hose coming out of the battery is? I accidentally broke it when removing the battery.

 

[Gazzer01]

Would always recommend going with the fuse rating what’s fitted By the manufacture however a lower rated fuse is better than a higher one in a pinch if there is no underlying problem that blows it immediately. if it does blow immediately then follow this rectification post or get advice from the dealer if you are not confident in fixing yourself. what I can say from my experience is that when my fuse blew and I replaced it for a like for like 100A in my 2022 6.1 it’s never happened since and possibly a manufacturer fault on the fuse design/manufacturing process.

I’ll always defer to @yossarian or @WelshGas who both are both far more advanced in this area and helped me.

 

[andyinluton]

Am I the only one that’s somewhat concerned that we have 100amp fuses blowing for seemingly no reason?

 

[Peter84]

@andyinluton I can imagine your concern. In my case I can't say for sure if it was already blown when I received it or that it blown recently. Did not do a long trip yet so could have missed the issue. The rear battery measured 11.9V so not completely empty, the van was built in May last year.

 

[Wesel]

Oh and while I'm at it, anybody knows what the flexible black tube/hose coming out of the battery is? I accidentally broke it when removing the battery.

The black flexible tube coming out of the battery is a vent to send the potentially explosive hydrogen released by the battery charge to the outside of the car.

 

[Peter84]

@Wesel good to know, I'll wrap some tape around it to be sure it's still able to vent those toxic fumes!

 

[Californication69]

@Wesel good to know, I'll wrap some tape around it to be sure it's still able to vent those toxic fumes!

I’ll be removing the battery again and finding out where to push this tube downwards, as I thought it was an additional protection for an additional cable!

 

[WelshGas]

Am I the only one that’s somewhat concerned that we have 100amp fuses blowing for seemingly no reason?

They are very prone to damage due to vibration and over tightening, and that is from experience. Mine blew after taking an unexpected speed hump/road repair at 50mph.

 

[WelshGas]

I wonder why VW have increased the Cube Fuse from 50amp on the T5.1 to 75amp on the T6 and finally 100amp on the T6.1?

 

[WelshGas]

I’ll be removing the battery again and finding out where to push this tube downwards, as I thought it was an additional protection for an additional cable!

It’s useful to tie a strap or belt around the rear leisure battery. Makes it much easier to remove next time.

 

[Californication69]

It’s useful to tie a strap or belt around the rear leisure battery. Makes it much easier to remove next time.

Ohhhh yes !

 

[chockswahay]

I think I may have issues with my batteries. I have had the EHU plugged in for 24 hours yet the bar graph not really moving, despite the volt increase. I used the heating for a few hours on Friday and battery ran down quickly so I started the engine and ran it for 30 minutes ready for Saturday. Again after a few hours use batteries showing 12.2 and down to 11.8 on heater start up…. Which in turn meant heater would cut out immediately. So, despite my heater problems (mentioned on another thread) I’m wondering if my batteries are shot or maybe the cube fuse blown?

These are the figures….












sorry about them being out of sequence, but if you check the date and time you can see before and after 24 hour charge. Although volts improved the bar graph does not show full? Certainly I can not make much beyond 36 hours before battery shows low, and that is without much heater use. I do use fridge but only on low. Also if it adds to the mix….I do use Max Charge on way to site.

 

[yossarian]

Certainly worth a look at the cube fuse. Early T6.1s would give you an error but VW may have changed this behaviour since it's totally undocumented.

Based on the bar graph and voltage something fishy is going on.