What’s behind the panels in a GC electrical cupboard?

[Jester]

Not yet fitted them. I figure I can fit the filler on the end of the cabinet

Thats what I wanted to do but advised its not legal via the installer, so back to the drawing board, maybe fit the filler cap in the lower skirt!!!

 

[runesag]

Thank you so much for sharing the pictures. I picked up my GC600 in Germany on Friday, and I'm interested in doing the exact same thing, with a second battery and a large pure sine inverter.

Where do you think you would place the battery and inverter?

 

[Adeybruce]

Thank you so much for sharing the pictures. I picked up my GC600 in Germany on Friday, and I'm interested in doing the exact same thing, with a second battery and a large pure sine inverter.

Where do you think you would place the battery and inverter?

I’ve see.3 options so far:
- replacing the existing leisure battery under the bonnet with a more powerful lithium battery (not so good for winter camping)
- under the right hand seat where it’s easier to access the existing wiring
- in the rear cupboards in or next to the existing electrical cupboard
Hope this helps a little

 

[Cohny]

This afternoons’ job was to investigate the GC’s electrics. Eventually I need more battery storage, a decent inverter and a way to switch the existing 240v sockets to inverter rather than shore power. Here’s what I found
after undoing about 20 screws.
Amongst other things, just trying to work out what work the DC/DC Converter is doing?

View attachment 52769

View attachment 52770

View attachment 52771

View attachment 52772

Hi
Just bought a 680 and like you would like to increase battery capacity. I also took the panels out in the electrics cupboard expecting to see the leisure battery! Now I know where it is - thanks!
Any thoughts on how to connect a second battery, there must be a way of plugging one in to the electrics in the cupboard?

 

[WelshGas]

Hi
Just bought a 680 and like you would like to increase battery capacity. I also took the panels out in the electrics cupboard expecting to see the leisure battery! Now I know where it is - thanks!
Any thoughts on how to connect a second battery, there must be a way of plugging one in to the electrics in the cupboard?

Any 2nd Leisure Battery must be wired in Parallel to the existing Leisure Battery, so red +tve to red+tve and black - tve to black - tve. This will give a 12v battery but with double the amp hours. The batteries should be the same make/model and similar ages.

 

[CaliRolf600]

[QUOTE = "figodelgringo, post: 389661, member: 21019"]
danke für die Hilfe!

Ich habe die zweite Batterie im Auto vom Händler nicht gesehen und ich habe vergessen zu fragen (mein Fehler)
kann es unter der 2 Sitzbank sein? Wo befindet sich das Truma-Gerät?
[/ZITAT]
Die Batterie für das Fahrzeug befindet sich unter dem Fussraum vom Fahrer.

 

[Holidaymaker]

This afternoons’ job was to investigate the GC’s electrics. Eventually I need more battery storage, a decent inverter and a way to switch the existing 240v sockets to inverter rather than shore power. Here’s what I found
after undoing about 20 screws.
Amongst other things, just trying to work out what work the DC/DC Converter is doing?

View attachment 52769

View attachment 52770

View attachment 52771

View attachment 52772

Thankyou posting very interesting photographs inside. What is DC / DC converter purpose in our GC? Why is need convert Dc?

 

[Irothwell]

Hi
Just bought a 680 and like you would like to increase battery capacity. I also took the panels out in the electrics cupboard expecting to see the leisure battery! Now I know where it is - thanks!
Any thoughts on how to connect a second battery, there must be a way of plugging one in to the electrics in the cupboard?

Looking at the photos of the electric cupboard. The battery isolation switch must be connected to the leisure battery? So if that is that case a 2nd battery could be connected to the leisure battery side of that switch and the neg to chassis point.

 

[soppelsa]

Will the charger under the seat do 2 batteries and I'm not sure but do the batteries have to be identical ,age and capacity?

 

[Eber123]

Hello,

I just saw these interesting posts. Thank you for the pictures, very interesting.

With the standard gas and electric setup of the VW Grand California long free standing times are challanging. I am not a specialist, far away from this, but reading up a lot of information from other GC users. It seems to me that an upgrade of the GC electric is not easy. Researching this it seems to me also that companies converting and upgrading campervans don't like to take on the GC because of the complexity (this is the case in Ireland, but I guess easier in the UK).

Electricity
From my experience the standard on board battery will last about a day in colder weather and two days in warmer, sonny weather (or there abouts).
Installing a Lithium battery is not straight forward, so most of the users say. Replacing the Lithium battery one-to-one cause problems with heat and humidity. Installing the Lithium battery in the boot means a lot of cable installation. Also the cables and alternator must be able to deal with this. I have not fully understood the details, but it seems not that straight forward. To charge the Lithium battery a decent booster needs also installed also.

I believe that a 2nd AGM battery with exact the same technical specification in the boot is the easiest (and cheapest) option to get the electricity increased. There is some good information about this on the Caliboard. The disadvantage is to add a good bit of weight and only double the power (but hey, better than nothing). The advantage of this is that the installation does not change a lot of the standard VW setup, which is good for the warranty.

Gas
I don't get this part. It seems to me that many camper vans and motorhomes have gas installed. Using the standard red propane cylinders is fine as long as you stay in UK or Ireland. Going abroad for a longer time (or not in the summer) and therefore need to refill the propane is an issue. The only way around this, as far as I can see, is to install refillable propane cylinders and a refill mount. This refill mount must be outside the van and not in the propane cabinet. My research shows that there is a possibility that LPG stations won't fill up propane with the refill mount inside the camper van or even refillable propane cylinders on their own.
At the moment I try to find an installer to get a price for the installation. As far as I can see that the installation, 2x 11kg refillable cylinders and the pipes will cost about EUR 1,000.

Again, I am not an expert, but it seems to me that VW managed to design and implement a very complicated and unique electric solutions that prevents the users to easy upgrade the battery power or other changes (e.g. install more 12 V sockets). For me personally means that I won't find anybody in Ireland to help me upgrade the battery or other changes. And if I find somebody it will be very expensive.
With the propane VW is in line with other manufacturers. It seems to me that only UK based camper van companies think about this and offer (of even have as standard) LPG installed. For me it means I have to spend another EUR 1,000 to make the GC more practical.

The Grand California is camper van designed for the (extensive) use in well maintained envorinment, with the occasional one night off grid use in halfway nice weather. Upgrading of power and propane seems to be possible but extremely difficult and therefor expensive. If I would have been aware of these issues I would still have bought the GC, but would have put EUR 2,000 aside for further updates. Also before I would sign a contract for a GC now, I would spend time to find a good company who is willing to work on the GC. I believe it is easier in the UK, but almost impossible in Ireland.

Kind regards,
Eberhard

 

[soppelsa]

I've gone for diesel heating then probably the goal zero yeti 1500x power station with the 12v charger.
Charge it up before you set off then plug it in to the 20a rear 12v socket when driving (if required) then when needed plug the 240v into the outside hookup.That way you recharge both batteries and the 240v sockets have a supply or possibly re supply the 12v 20amp socket and turn the inverter off on the yeti because the 240v is not as efficient because you get more losses.
That way you're not messing with anything and not invalidating the warranty.
£2k though.

 

[maurizio]

Good morning, I'm building a second leisure battery with the Imanager regulator
Can you tell me the chassis point for the negative pole in the trunk (centralita area)
thank you

 

[andy_c]

I've gone for diesel heating then probably the goal zero yeti 1500x power station with the 12v charger.
Charge it up before you set off then plug it in to the 20a rear 12v socket when driving (if required) then when needed plug the 240v into the outside hookup.That way you recharge both batteries and the 240v sockets have a supply or possibly re supply the 12v 20amp socket and turn the inverter off on the yeti because the 240v is not as efficient because you get more losses.
That way you're not messing with anything and not invalidating the warranty.
£2k though.

Hi

Is anyone able to confirm whether attempting to charge via the 12v 20 amp socket a) actually charges the leisure battery successfully and b) is safe to do so this way?

Many thanks!

Andy

 

[dominichayhoe]

The GC has a main battery in the engine compartment
And a 2nd lesure battery to power the camperpart
Both are AMG 520A/92Ah as far i can read on the technical details given by my VW dealer
I think it sits under the floor in the rear somewhere .

That's incorrect.

The GC has two batteries yes, but the vehicle battery is under the drivers seat footwell, and the leisure battery is under the bonnet.

 

[dominichayhoe]

Great good to know that as it will save a bit on a fitted mat.

I'm afraid to say mine, and quite a few others I've heard from is badly scuffed up.

 

[dominichayhoe]

This afternoons’ job was to investigate the GC’s electrics. Eventually I need more battery storage, a decent inverter and a way to switch the existing 240v sockets to inverter rather than shore power. Here’s what I found
after undoing about 20 screws.
Amongst other things, just trying to work out what work the DC/DC Converter is doing?

View attachment 52769

View attachment 52770

View attachment 52771

View attachment 52772

Could you let us know which van you have and your spec list, i.e. do you have the LED coloured lighting?

In my version of this cupboard, I do not have the B2B or the electronics box next to it which I believe is the lighting control unit.

 

[dominichayhoe]

Massive variables in that question. The 680 has 170w of solar, which helps a lot. But if your using heating, the fridge etc it won’t last too long without great sunshine. Ideally it could use another leisure battery

The 680 has 174w solar panel (don't forget that won't be at 12v - more like 22v so the amps won't be as high as you think) and the 600 has a 104w solar panel.

 

[dominichayhoe]

I've gone for diesel heating then probably the goal zero yeti 1500x power station with the 12v charger.
Charge it up before you set off then plug it in to the 20a rear 12v socket when driving (if required) then when needed plug the 240v into the outside hookup.That way you recharge both batteries and the 240v sockets have a supply or possibly re supply the 12v 20amp socket and turn the inverter off on the yeti because the 240v is not as efficient because you get more losses.
That way you're not messing with anything and not invalidating the warranty.
£2k though.

I have gone down this route, as I simply couldn't be bothered to take a PHD on VW GC electrics!

I've fitted lithium batteries and inverters in many other vans, but in our GC I simply went and bought a Jackery 1000w for £995.

I intend to install a socket inside the van so you don;t have to have the Jackery outside or plug into the main shore socket on the outside of the van.

 

[dominichayhoe]

Hi

Is anyone able to confirm whether attempting to charge via the 12v 20 amp socket a) actually charges the leisure battery successfully and b) is safe to do so this way?

Many thanks!

Andy

Leisure battery, or portable battery generator like my Jackery? If the latter, then yes.
EDIT: Sorry misunderstood the question. I thought you were asking about charging the external battery generator. The leisure battery I have no idea and no intention of testing it for fear of frying the electrics.

 

[Mr T]

I have gone down this route, as I simply couldn't be bothered to take a PHD on VW GC electrics!

I've fitted lithium batteries and inverters in many other vans, but in our GC I simply went and bought a Jackery 1000w for £995.

I intend to install a socket inside the van so you don;t have to have the Jackery outside or plug into the main shore socket on the outside of the van.

Think this is the sort of route I will take, be interested to see how easy it is to fit a socket inside to save dangling a cable out to the hook up point. Please share when you’ve worked it out

 

[andy_c]

Leisure battery, or portable battery generator like my Jackery? If the latter, then yes.

Thanks Dominic. I'd taken the original poster's suggestion as the goal zero could be charged via the 12v 20 A socket when driving which is what I think you're confirming. But I failed to understand ' or possibly re supply the 12v 20amp socket and turn the inverter off on the yeti because the 240v is not as efficient because you get more losses.' in the original post and was trying to determine if they were suggesting that instead of recharging the leisure battery by faking the shore power from the inverted goal zero power station, they were suggesting using the output from the goal zero to go into that socket to recharge the leisure battery thus avoiding power loss via the inverter, etc. Don't know enough about these systems yet to know if I'm asking something really dumb!

 

[Jester]

I'm afraid to say mine, and quite a few others I've heard from is badly scuffed up.

Well I decided that I wouldn’t risk it so purchased the VW OEM full carpet great quality and thick. Helps with insulation in the winter. Also had a summer carpet made a synthetic sea grass. And for the garage/boot area a made to measure rubber mat.

 

[soppelsa]

What I suggested is the 12v output from the yeti and

Thanks Dominic. I'd taken the original poster's suggestion as the goal zero could be charged via the 12v 20 A socket when driving which is what I think you're confirming. But I failed to understand ' or possibly re supply the 12v 20amp socket and turn the inverter off on the yeti because the 240v is not as efficient because you get more losses.' in the original post and was trying to determine if they were suggesting that instead of recharging the leisure battery by faking the shore power from the inverted goal zero power station, they were suggesting using the output from the goal zero to go into that socket to recharge the leisure battery thus avoiding power loss via the inverter, etc. Don't know enough about these systems yet to know if I'm asking something really dumb!

What I suggested was if you supply the 12v 20A skt at the rear with the 12v output from the Yeti {not the input with the additional charging adapter that you have to purchase separately} then you be able to provide a 12v supply to the van.
In the process it might top up the leisure battery.
Leaving the 240v inverter switched on the Yeti will be wasting energy and what I was implying is that supplying the 12v system is more efficient than the 240v supply option.
On another point you could make a lead up for the Yeti that simply plugs into the rear 240v skt which avoids the external lead issue.
The downside is if you plug into the Yeti 1st the 13amp plug will have live exposed pins.
So always plug into the van skt 1st and be cautious.

Thanks Dominic. I'd taken the original poster's suggestion as the goal zero could be charged via the 12v 20 A socket when driving which is what I think you're confirming. But I failed to understand ' or possibly re supply the 12v 20amp socket and turn the inverter off on the yeti because the 240v is not as efficient because you get more losses.' in the original post and was trying to determine if they were suggesting that instead of recharging the leisure battery by faking the shore power from the inverted goal zero power station, they were suggesting using the output from the goal zero to go into that socket to recharge the leisure battery thus avoiding power loss via the inverter, etc. Don't know enough about these systems yet to know if I'm asking something really dumb!

What

Thanks Dominic. I'd taken the original poster's suggestion as the goal zero could be charged via the 12v 20 A socket when driving which is what I think you're confirming. But I failed to understand ' or possibly re supply the 12v 20amp socket and turn the inverter off on the yeti because the 240v is not as efficient because you get more losses.' in the original post and was trying to determine if they were suggesting that instead of recharging the leisure battery by faking the shore power from the inverted goal zero power station, they were suggesting using the output from the goal zero to go into that socket to recharge the leisure battery thus avoiding power loss via the inverter, etc. Don't know enough about these systems yet to know if I'm asking something really dumb!

The yeti if you use the 12v output must re supply the 12v system.
It

 

[dominichayhoe]

What I suggested is the 12v output from the yeti and

What I suggested was if you supply the 12v 20A skt at the rear with the 12v output from the Yeti {not the input with the additional charging adapter that you have to purchase separately} then you be able to provide a 12v supply to the van.
In the process it might top up the leisure battery.
Leaving the 240v inverter switched on the Yeti will be wasting energy and what I was implying is that supplying the 12v system is more efficient than the 240v supply option.
On another point you could make a lead up for the Yeti that simply plugs into the rear 240v skt which avoids the external lead issue.
The downside is if you plug into the Yeti 1st the 13amp plug will have live exposed pins.
So always plug into the van skt 1st and be cautious.

What

The yeti if you use the 12v output must re supply the 12v system.
It

Have you tried what you're suggesting? I highly doubt plugging into the 12v socket from the yetis output, or any other battery generator, will feed back to the 12v circuits and charge the 12v batteries and worse still may damage the vans electrical system.

The vans 12v 'cigarette lighter' socket like most cars is probably a dumb system, i.e. two wires with in-line fuse from the battery. Therefore a feed can go both ways. However, I wouldn't want to trust the rear 12v socket is wired the same, and quite frankly wouldn't trust the cab one is either in these vans as the electrics are a crazy maze of circuits and electrical components. Rather you than me testing your theory!

Im not sure what you mean by:

'On another point you could make a lead up for the Yeti that simply plugs into the rear 240v skt which avoids the external lead issue.'

You don't mean the 3 pin 240v socket do you?

This won't feed the other 240v electrics and could likely seriously damage your van. You would need to reverse the polarity for the system to accept the charge you are trying to give it.(240v circuits have 3 wires and work in one direction unless reversed). Plus it would have no fuse/breaker system in case of an overload. You need to understand that the wires from this socket are part of a ring and the charge would be distributed everywhere with no breaker to stop an overload. This is why the main feed goes to the consumer unit first.

You need to come in at the consumer unit, and the easiest way I can think to do this is to find the external sockets cabling and split it to add another entry point with a socket of some sort.

Perhaps you could let us know your experience in this area. I'm not an electrician, but it sounds like you're spit-balling ideas that have no bearing on reality and worse still could seriously damage owners vans, but I'm not a qualified electrician, so if you are feel free to tell me I'm incorrect!

 

[dominichayhoe]

Thanks Dominic. I'd taken the original poster's suggestion as the goal zero could be charged via the 12v 20 A socket when driving which is what I think you're confirming. But I failed to understand ' or possibly re supply the 12v 20amp socket and turn the inverter off on the yeti because the 240v is not as efficient because you get more losses.' in the original post and was trying to determine if they were suggesting that instead of recharging the leisure battery by faking the shore power from the inverted goal zero power station, they were suggesting using the output from the goal zero to go into that socket to recharge the leisure battery thus avoiding power loss via the inverter, etc. Don't know enough about these systems yet to know if I'm asking something really dumb!

Hi Andy,
I think what he was trying to say was if you use the yeti, or another battery generator, to power the vans electrics, going from 12v to 240v back to 12v as you would with an inverter, is inefficient.

However, see my post above as I have serious doubts about his methods. I wait to be proven incorrect!