Lowering ocean dsg 204

[davetherave]

Thing of lowering my ocean 204 dsg any thoughts or advice much appreciated

 

[Guy12]

+ Better ride , more stable on the motorway and in wind , looks way cool
- its 30mm lower , so unless your planning on rallying its a no brainer

 

[Hotel California]

There are already treads on lowering , lots of info if you search...

Just today this topic has been added with posts...
https://vwcaliforniaclub.com/threads/lowering-springs.2223/

 

[davetherave]

+ Better ride , more stable on the motorway and in wind , looks way cool
- its 30mm lower , so unless your planning on rallying its a no brainer

nice one thanks for your input

 

[Guy12]

nice one thanks for your input

And if you have a 2mtr High garage door your van willl go under with ease.

 

[davetherave]

That's one off the reasons i need to do this plus better handling been quoted £460 by Vw smg Croydon seems fair price

 

[T6 CFO]

Don't believe I've given my two penny's worth on this subject so here goes.
I'm talking about lowering on a T6 204DSG 4 Motion but driving one without the 4 Motion for the moment. Both with heavy duty anti roll bars fitted.

Against.......

Three separate people at dealership told me not to do it.
VW built it the height it is presumably for a reason.
Read stuff about increase in tyre wear(inside)due to not being able to adjust the camber.
Personal worries about changing the stance of the vehicle with such a complicated vehicle and what damage could be caused.
Less ground clearance.
Only driven the non 4Motion and find it handles pretty well.
Potholes would be more of an issue with less travel.
I'd have to pay for it.

For.......

It looks good.
Reported improvement in stability.

I expect to get some disagreement and will be interesting if it's on the same vehicle type and setup.

My rider is that as per usual different things are important to different people.
On balance, for me, the risks outweigh the advantages.

Mike

 

[Kmann]

I guess it is a matter of how you want to use your car. And how your priorities are sorted. Is it a daily asphalt runner, and you find style important, lowering might be it. If you want to go on an adventure, funktionality might be the gold.

I would rather go for more clearance if I had 4 Motion, so I would be able to go more places? For me the Cali is a travel/adventure car and I would chose functionality over style. Well I love good style, but in my taste a Cali ready for a cross country trip looks stylish too.

So I guess I wold never consider lovering, but rather go for more clearance – especially with 4 Motion.

 

[WelshGas]

That's one off the reasons i need to do this plus better handling been quoted £460 by Vw smg Croydon seems fair price

There is a reason the suspension height and travel is what it is. The California is a heavy vehicle already and fitting shorter springs means they are either less compressible or you are going to hit the suspension stops more frequently. The vehicle weight compared to the Maximum Gross Weight determined by the axle rating means that the removable load, passengers, luggage, bikes etc: is very limited in fact and judging by what people say they carry on holiday then I would suggest many Californias are overloaded. Lowering the suspension by fitting shorter springs is, in my opinion, a recipe for problems. Even more so on a 4Motion which has a lower payload to begin with.
Using Air Suspension is a much better solution.
Aesthetics should not come into it at all.

I know VW sells lowered springs and fits them to the Sportline model. A different vehicle compared to the California for a different use.

But hey, it's your vehicle just be aware of the + & - points and make sure the garage give you the springs they remove so that it will be cheaper to return to standard.

Have fun.

 

[Guy12]

I can only speak about my T5 4MOTION
but suffice to say my findings are as follows.
1- Fully loaded (possibly overloaded) with camping gear bikes surfboards barbecues etc it has never once bottomed out.
We never travel light and anyone who knows me will testify to this
2- After 15k miles all four tyres are within 2mm of needing changing and the wear is completely even across the width of them all.

The proof of the pudding is in the eating as they say.
Volkswagens should allways be lowered its the law

 

[WelshGas]

I can only speak about my T5 4MOTION
but suffice to say my findings are as follows.
1- Fully loaded (possibly overloaded) with camping gear bikes surfboards barbecues etc it has never once bottomed out.
We never travel light and anyone who knows me will testify to this
2- After 15k miles all four tyres are within 2mm of needing changing and the wear is completely even across the width of them all.

The proof of the pudding is in the eating as they say.
Volkswagens should allways be lowered its the law

Standard Suspension 21,000 miles and tyres measured by VW at 5.0 mm tread front and rear equal across full width, and that's 4Season tyres.

So you get 15,000 miles down to 3.6 mm and I get 21,000 miles down to 5 mm.
So, roughly speaking I'll probably get an additional 10,000 miles, or more, on my standard suspension compared to your lowered.

So, some back of the envelope calculations, over 2 tyre changes for me you'll have 3. At a very conservative cost of £600/tyre change for 4 tyres.

I see. Makes sense to spend £450 +/- labour to spend an extra £600 every 60,000 miles. Great value for aesthetics that you can't see when driving.

 

[Kmann]

Volkswagens should allways be lowered its the law

I hope not … then I would not be able to reach some of the beaches where i love to surf ;-)

 

[Guy12]

Standard Suspension 21,000 miles and tyres measured by VW at 5.0 mm tread front and rear equal across full width, and that's 4Season tyres.

So you get 15,000 miles down to 3.6 mm and I get 21,000 miles down to 5 mm.
So, roughly speaking I'll probably get an additional 10,000 miles, or more, on my standard suspension compared to your lowered.

So, some back of the envelope calculations, over 2 tyre changes for me you'll have 3. At a very conservative cost of £600/tyre change for 4 tyres.

I see. Makes sense to spend £450 +/- labour to spend an extra £600 every 60,000 miles. Great value for aesthetics that you can't see when driving.

My mileage amount was a guess as the van is in the garage and I really couldn't tell you exact how many miles it's done today.
.My tyre measurements were also "back of the envelope " guesstimates, it could be 2mm it could be 3.6 , my point Was , that the wear is even across them
Thus debunking the myth that lowering by 25-30 mm ruins the camber setting as mentioned earlier.
Have the big improvements to the ride and handling been forgotten?
I could not live with the standard Vw wallowing ride, or worrying that a strong gust of wind would put me half way into the next lane n the mway . I did try it for a full season before deciding to get the springs fitted.
IF there is an extra cost attached to tyres then I would find it a price worth paying.
Loosing 30mm height has never stopped me reaching a surf spot either !
I'll get my coat now .

 

[WelshGas]

After 41,000 miles 2 years of ownership all over the UK and Europe, all year round, I just do not recognise the " I could not live with the standard Vw wallowing ride, or worrying that a strong gust of wind would put me half way into the next lane n the mway " state of the suspension and ride on the California.

Mine must have been built differently to yours.

Enjoy your vehicle.

 

[T6 CFO]

My mileage amount was a guess as the van is in the garage and I really couldn't tell you exact how many miles it's done today.
.My tyre measurements were also "back of the envelope " guesstimates, it could be 2mm it could be 3.6 , my point Was , that the wear is even across them
Thus debunking the myth that lowering by 25-30 mm ruins the camber setting as mentioned earlier.
Have the big improvements to the ride and handling been forgotten?
I could not live with the standard Vw wallowing ride, or worrying that a strong gust of wind would put me half way into the next lane n the mway . I did try it for a full season before deciding to get the springs fitted.
IF there is an extra cost attached to tyres then I would find it a price worth paying.
Loosing 30mm height has never stopped me reaching a surf spot either !
I'll get my coat now .

That's interesting, especially about the wallowing ride and motorway experience. I have to say the one I have feels pretty planted and stable as a rock on the motorway but I still need to go more mileage to be sure.
I'm wondering if there are major differences between the T5 and T6 with stability and one option I did choose which is rarely mentioned was option 1N3 Servotronic speed sensitive power steering. I got this primarily for its assistance at low speed but the benefits are probably just as beneficial at higher speed. To be honest it's all guesswork and we need someone who had a T5 to get a T6 with the options I have to give an opinion. One thing is for sure and that's that I don't get the issues you describe and I am an "enthusiastic" driver.


Mike

 

[Bobbybus]

Here are some of my observations and reasoning: You can only compare tyre wear between vehicles if they use exactly the same tyres, have the same weight distribution and are driven exactly the same. The tread on the lowered vehicle was even, showing good suspension geometry. The aesthetics are still important to many people and although you can not see the outside of the vehicle when you are driving, you can feel the benefit of better handling.
Each to his own. Nobody should dictate what they believe to be the absolute right thing to do. We are individuals, making choices and paying our money after considering the alternatives and the consequences of our choice.

 

[B J G]

Reading loads about 'lowering' being the solution to handling/feel issues but never see any mention of shock absorbers, dampers.

My experience over many years of car, not van, handling improvements was that simply fitting uprated, preferably adjustable ones, dampers had far more beneficial effect on road holding than simply changing springs.

Changing only the springs gives a mismatch between the damping settings and the new springs.
Personally I wouldn't go lower than 30mm as suspension travel becomes limited, think of how the Cali is going to react to a bump on the drivers front wheel and a hole on the passenger rear wheel.

Most photos show unladen lowered Cali's. It would be more realistic to show the vehicle with Driver & Passenger plus normal travelling gear onboard, some will get a shock at the difference.

I'll put my wooden spoon back in the drawer now.

 

[Guy12]

Reading loads about 'lowering' being the solution to handling/feel issues but never see any mention of shock absorbers, dampers.

My experience over many years of car, not van, handling improvements was that simply fitting uprated, preferably adjustable ones, dampers had far more beneficial effect on road holding than simply changing springs.

Changing only the springs gives a mismatch between the damping settings and the new springs.
Personally I wouldn't go lower than 30mm as suspension travel becomes limited, think of how the Cali is going to react to a bump on the drivers front wheel and a hole on the passenger rear wheel.

Most photos show unladen lowered Cali's. It would be more realistic to show the vehicle with Driver & Passenger plus normal travelling gear onboard, some will get a shock at the difference.

I'll put my wooden spoon back in the drawer now.

I agree with your conclusions, (uprated shocks would give a better ride and retain the ride height) the thing is that VW fit the springs as standard on some of their vans and offer them as an option on others so they are already "tried and tested" and readily available.
To my knowledge which i admit is limited they don't change the dampers.
Also finding the correct dampers/shocks would be more complex than simply buying the springs and could possibly turn out to be trial and error and very expensive?
I do have a pic somewhere of my van fully loaded with towbar bike rack ,bikes and boards etc on a trip to france but after a quick search Im struggling to find it.
I put pics onto discs to save memory on my Mac so I shall continue to look for it and post up when I find it.

I knew this thread would turn out to be a can of worms

 

[pjm-84]

I find the Cali too low when fully loaded, and have dragged mud flaps on numerous occasions. I'm actually surprised they are still on.

I toyed with air suspension as I would prefer to run it slightly lower on the motorways, but higher when on rough roads or back roads.

Wouldn't put much faith in the VW tried and tested. Look at the corrosion issue.

If you have a spare, practise removing it if you lower the Cali. (I was amazed how little clearance there was at standard height)

 

[Kmann]

I agree @B J G . If lowering, its much better to go for a full package (Springs and Dampers), like i.e. Bilstein. Myself would find the air system a lot more attractive, since I got a lot more options (high-Low-level) with it.

 

[Bobbybus]

It's all about compromise. And cost! Some stuff is extremely expensive and possibly not the best value. £400(ish) for springs and fitting against £1800 for Billies or £2500 plus for bagging it. mmm. Like I said earlier, you make your choice and pay for it.

 

[pjm-84]

Agree. I went with air suspension but it comes on a V8 Discovery 3

 

[B J G]

Found this supplier who seem to cover every option.

http://www.t4srus.co.uk/vw-t5-suspension-711-c.asp

I'm favouring air personally but will see how standard set up is. as & when I get it.

 

[Guy12]

Found this supplier who seem to cover every option.

http://www.t4srus.co.uk/vw-t5-suspension-711-c.asp

I'm favouring air personally but will see how standard set up is. as & when I get it.

That site looks like a good find, I remember swapping my T2 standard shocks to Gas ones and the difference was amazing.

 

[Stuart]

Even the T6 Sportline is not sold with lowering springs. Not sure why but I did read something about tyre wear.

It consequently looks a bit weird!