Buy all your VW California Accessories at the Club Shop Visit Shop

2nd AGM leisure battery in the back of the Grand California

@andy_c
Is the Dc-Dc charger switched to only work when the engine is running? or can it be manually switched on to top up the rear battery from the front one whilst parked up?
 
@andy_c
Is the Dc-Dc charger switched to only work when the engine is running? or can it be manually switched on to top up the rear battery from the front one whilst parked up?
Its got a couple of alternator settings for ignition detection and then a user configurable mode that I set to come on when the OEM panel takes the original leisure battery high enough - you could indeed lower this so it was topping up.
 
Hi Folks,

I thought I’d update on our upgrade as we’re on day 3 of proveout in the Alps and I’m pretty happy so far. Before I provide the details it’s worth saying that if I was competent enough to do what @T3Z-GB has done, I would, but I’m not, and all the installers I spoke to were reluctant to touch the van based on warranty and not knowing it. So the upgrade I’ve done is relatively simple, it’s not cheap, and I imagine people might argue that I’m risking the warranty (but AFAIC it’s worth it). My wife and I work from the van on 130W laptops and the kids are tablet addicts and it looks like we can survive at least 4 days off grid which is what we’ve been targeting (maybe more but we haven’t got that far). I spent a fair amount of time working with Solbian to try and add additional solar to the roof, but I have the satellite dish and frankly it’s a super expensive way for relatively modest increase in capability so I haven’t gone that route (yet). So…

Upgrade was as follows… everything is Victron, because of seamless networking and configuration via iPhone app:

1) 2 x 11Kg Gaslow cylinders with the Wave / Dimes Bluetooth monitors - awesome! Love gas for cooking, heating and hot water.
2) removed votronic solar controller and installed a Victron one.
3) Addred a Victron smart battery sense to the 94Ah leisure battery - works in conjunction with my OEM 105W solar panel and Victron controller in 2).
4) wired in an eco flow delta max and transfer switch - this provides the inverted 240 volt system - I avoid charging the leisure batteries from this and so far have relied on solar or car charger input port (bouncing off leisure batteries plus solar) - IMHO it’s awesome.
5) upgraded the isolator switch as above to support a second battery.
6) added a Victron dc dc charger
7) added a Victron 170ah AGM deep cycle battery as the 2nd AGM battery. @andyinluton has pointed out I should go straight to lithium - he’s probably right, but I already had the battery and I was unsure of the effect of a lithium battery within the charging system I’ve rigged - OEM trickle charger, Victron dc-dc charger, solar controllers
8) added a Victron smart battery sense to this second leisure battery and also a Victron smart battery shunt to this.
9) leave the van supply on setting ‘2’ connected to the 170ah battery (never 1+2 because they’re different sizes, chemistries, etc).
8) installed a second Victron smart solar charger to this second AGM leisure battery and connected a solar extension lead.
9) Added an ecoflow 160w portable panel that can power the ecoflow or the extension lead to the second leisure battery.

It’s snowing here and the OEM 105W panel is iced up, but the ecoflow panel fits internally within the van and the windscreen and so an unintended benefit is I’m still recharging

Photos below - eco flow installation; dc-dc charger and 2 x Victron solar chargers (smart shunt and battery sense are hidden behind the panel) And second AGM battery; ecoflow 160w panels in windscreen.

Happy to answer any questions and will continue to update on upgrade and pros and cons as I experience them!

Kr

Andy

View attachment 91236

View attachment 91237

View attachment 91238

View attachment 91239

View attachment 91240

View attachment 91241

View attachment 91242
Hi Andy,
Im just about to do this but a thought occurred to me before I started.

If you plug power into either of the sockets now (original external or new internal socket you have added), it immediately makes the other socket(s) not being used live. For example if you plug power into your internal socket(s) you've added, the external one also becomes live.

I'm going to install mine with a 240v isolator changeover switch to take out that issue. I can't see if you've done that?
 
Last edited:
Hi Andy,
Im just about to do this but a thought occurred to me before I started.

If you plug power into either of the sockets now, it immediately makes the other socket(s) not being used live. For example if you plug power into your internal socket(s) the external one becomes live.

I'm going to install mine with a 240v isolator changeover switch to take out that issue. I can't see if you've done that?

I may have misunderstood you but if you are planning on plugging 240v into an internal socket be careful!
 
Hi Andy,
Im just about to do this but a thought occurred to me before I started.

If you plug power into either of the sockets now (original external or new internal socket you have added), it immediately makes the other socket(s) not being used live. For example if you plug power into your internal socket(s) you've added, the external one also becomes live.

I'm going to install mine with a 240v isolator changeover switch to take out that issue. I can't see if you've done that?
Looking at the photos, he has put a plug on the incoming lead to the consumer unit & that is either plugged into a socket off the back of the external supply or the output from the inverter as required. If so, there is no chance of live exposed pins & all incoming supply is via the consumer unit.
 
Looking at the photos, he has put a plug on the incoming lead to the consumer unit & that is either plugged into a socket off the back of the external supply or the output from the inverter as required. If so, there is no chance of live exposed pins & all incoming supply is via the consumer unit.
Just being pedantic, if someone were to fiddle with the external socket when you're powering your van from the new internal sockets, you'd make the external one live and could electrocute anyone touching it. - Without a changeover switch, which is what Im now going to do.

Same with the internal sockets if they're unplugged and you're plugged in to a power source externally.
 
Just being pedantic, if someone were to fiddle with the external socket when you're powering your van from the new internal sockets, you'd make the external one live and could electrocute anyone touching it. - Without a changeover switch, which is what Im now going to do.

Same with the internal sockets if they're unplugged and you're plugged in to a power source externally.
Just being even more pedantic you haven't understood what is shown in the photo. There is a physical break in the lead between the external intake and the consumer unit.
The lead from the consumer unit has a plug on it. That plug is either plugged into to a socket wired to the external intake OR it is plugged into the inverter.
It’s impossible to connect the inverter and the external intake at the same time. Therefore it’s impossible to make the external intake live by plugging in the inverter.
 
Hi Andy,
Im just about to do this but a thought occurred to me before I started.

If you plug power into either of the sockets now (original external or new internal socket you have added), it immediately makes the other socket(s) not being used live. For example if you plug power into your internal socket(s) you've added, the external one also becomes live.

I'm going to install mine with a 240v isolator changeover switch to take out that issue. I can't see if you've done that?
Hi Dominic,

In my original post where I outlined the installation of my ecoflow and provided the same photo in “WHAT’S BEHIND THE PANELS IN A GC ELECTRICAL CUPBOARD?” and in my solution post above I mention the installation of a transfer switch (“wired in an eco flow delta max and transfer switch”). I also replied to @Mr T in that thread with a description of the wiring installation that you might find useful to reference. The grey box you can see in the photo by the ecoflow is exactly this. “Transfer” switches are also known as “changeover” switches and I certainly have one of these in the installation.

Have I understood correctly that this is your question and does this allay your concern?

Kr

Andy
 
Hi Dominic,

In my original post where I outlined the installation of my ecoflow and provided the same photo in “WHAT’S BEHIND THE PANELS IN A GC ELECTRICAL CUPBOARD?” and in my solution post above I mention the installation of a transfer switch (“wired in an eco flow delta max and transfer switch”). I also replied to @Mr T in that thread with a description of the wiring installation that you might find useful to reference. The grey box you can see in the photo by the ecoflow is exactly this. “Transfer” switches are also known as “changeover” switches and I certainly have one of these in the installation.

Have I understood correctly that this is your question and does this allay your concern?

Kr

Andy
IMHO doing this safely is super important so please see:

https://vwcaliforniaclub.com/threads/what’s-behind-the-panels-in-a-gc-electrical-cupboard.32914/page-3

and to emphasise the point I’ll reproduce the key points in my reply to @Mr T:


I followed the pics of @markicp to encourage me to take off the panel , open up the foam and expose the wires from the external hookup point. This has an inline connector. I replaced the inline connector on the lead out of the filler with an inline splitter and took one to the industrial connector for charging the generator and the other line to the mains in on the gen transfer switch. The line that originally went from the external filler to the consumer unit now gets wired into the load out on the gen transfer switch. The generator in on the transfer switch is fed off the other industrial connector which is fed from a 3 pin output socket on the generator.

I have young children so was careful to do the above to ensure the right connectors and leads were being used that don’t expose live pins that could be dangerous - for example the industrial connectors are not the same the mains supply is female and the gen in is an industrial male. The transfer switch is IMHO important too.

One uses the gen transfer switch to switch between mains in and generator in. In this way I’m faking the external mains supply. As a result this will power the 3 pin sockets (note - as if they were an extension lead) and also charge the leisure batteries. Now I don’t necessarily want to charge the leisure batteries like this as I’m beefing up the solar capability so I can turn the middle switch on the consumer unit off which disabled the charging system (from what I can tell :).”
 
IMHO doing this safely is super important so please see:

https://vwcaliforniaclub.com/threads/what’s-behind-the-panels-in-a-gc-electrical-cupboard.32914/page-3

and to emphasise the point I’ll reproduce the key points in my reply to @Mr T:


I followed the pics of @markicp to encourage me to take off the panel , open up the foam and expose the wires from the external hookup point. This has an inline connector. I replaced the inline connector on the lead out of the filler with an inline splitter and took one to the industrial connector for charging the generator and the other line to the mains in on the gen transfer switch. The line that originally went from the external filler to the consumer unit now gets wired into the load out on the gen transfer switch. The generator in on the transfer switch is fed off the other industrial connector which is fed from a 3 pin output socket on the generator.

I have young children so was careful to do the above to ensure the right connectors and leads were being used that don’t expose live pins that could be dangerous - for example the industrial connectors are not the same the mains supply is female and the gen in is an industrial male. The transfer switch is IMHO important too.

One uses the gen transfer switch to switch between mains in and generator in. In this way I’m faking the external mains supply. As a result this will power the 3 pin sockets (note - as if they were an extension lead) and also charge the leisure batteries. Now I don’t necessarily want to charge the leisure batteries like this as I’m beefing up the solar capability so I can turn the middle switch on the consumer unit off which disabled the charging system (from what I can tell :).”
Noted, I think I was getting confused between your post and the post on a similar thread of Markicp who it looks like has simply plugged his ecoflow straight into a new internal socket. I can see no transfer switch there.
 
Firstly, the battery is 95ah, not that it makes much difference.

His cost calculations are based on him fitting it, not a qualified electrician.

Finally, there is no inverter or other electronics added into this, so it won't make your 3 pin sockets live.

Add a decent inverter and you're looking at around £350ish which is still much cheaper than going down the lithium route or a separate battery generator like my Jackery.

However, my 1kwh 1kw Jackery cost £995. It takes the 47.5ah capacity of the AGM battery plus Jackery to 120ah usable plus of course adds the ability to use the 3 pin sockets, and no wiring to run or worry about and no warranty issues, and the Jackery is usable outside the motorhome.

I think that's a more comprehensive comparison.

It's definitely not apples and apples.
Hi can you use the jackery to power the fridge in the CG?....and can you use the factory fitted solar to charge it
 
Hi Folks,

I thought I’d update on our upgrade as we’re on day 3 of proveout in the Alps and I’m pretty happy so far. Before I provide the details it’s worth saying that if I was competent enough to do what @T3Z-GB has done, I would, but I’m not, and all the installers I spoke to were reluctant to touch the van based on warranty and not knowing it. So the upgrade I’ve done is relatively simple, it’s not cheap, and I imagine people might argue that I’m risking the warranty (but AFAIC it’s worth it). My wife and I work from the van on 130W laptops and the kids are tablet addicts and it looks like we can survive at least 4 days off grid which is what we’ve been targeting (maybe more but we haven’t got that far). I spent a fair amount of time working with Solbian to try and add additional solar to the roof, but I have the satellite dish and frankly it’s a super expensive way for relatively modest increase in capability so I haven’t gone that route (yet). So…

Upgrade was as follows… everything is Victron, because of seamless networking and configuration via iPhone app:

1) 2 x 11Kg Gaslow cylinders with the Wave / Dimes Bluetooth monitors - awesome! Love gas for cooking, heating and hot water.
2) removed votronic solar controller and installed a Victron one.
3) Addred a Victron smart battery sense to the 94Ah leisure battery - works in conjunction with my OEM 105W solar panel and Victron controller in 2).
4) wired in an eco flow delta max and transfer switch - this provides the inverted 240 volt system - I avoid charging the leisure batteries from this and so far have relied on solar or car charger input port (bouncing off leisure batteries plus solar) - IMHO it’s awesome.
5) upgraded the isolator switch as above to support a second battery.
6) added a Victron dc dc charger
7) added a Victron 170ah AGM deep cycle battery as the 2nd AGM battery. @andyinluton has pointed out I should go straight to lithium - he’s probably right, but I already had the battery and I was unsure of the effect of a lithium battery within the charging system I’ve rigged - OEM trickle charger, Victron dc-dc charger, solar controllers
8) added a Victron smart battery sense to this second leisure battery and also a Victron smart battery shunt to this.
9) leave the van supply on setting ‘2’ connected to the 170ah battery (never 1+2 because they’re different sizes, chemistries, etc).
8) installed a second Victron smart solar charger to this second AGM leisure battery and connected a solar extension lead.
9) Added an ecoflow 160w portable panel that can power the ecoflow or the extension lead to the second leisure battery.

It’s snowing here and the OEM 105W panel is iced up, but the ecoflow panel fits internally within the van and the windscreen and so an unintended benefit is I’m still recharging

Photos below - eco flow installation; dc-dc charger and 2 x Victron solar chargers (smart shunt and battery sense are hidden behind the panel) And second AGM battery; ecoflow 160w panels in windscreen.

Happy to answer any questions and will continue to update on upgrade and pros and cons as I experience them!

Kr

Andy

View attachment 91236

View attachment 91237

View attachment 91238

View attachment 91239

View attachment 91240

View attachment 91241

View attachment 91242
Hi Andy,

now that the weather has improved, have you managed to test how much charge you get from the solar panel behind the windscreen vs outside in direct sunlight?

thanks.
 
Hi Andy,

now that the weather has improved, have you managed to test how much charge you get from the solar panel behind the windscreen vs outside in direct sunlight?

thanks.
Hi T3Z-GB,

Since our Alps trip in April we’ve done a number of trips and the loss through the windscreen is (fairly subjectively) circa 50%. If you’ve followed my install then you’ll probably guess that for anything other than laptop usage on the inverter this is not an issue whatsoever. However, I’ve got relatively comfortable chaining the panels to the outside of the van and adjusting them to follow the sun (so much better than the OEM and reorienting the van!). I’m now contemplating additional ecoflow panels perhaps even the new 400W ones - folks will only need to do this if they’ve got really heavy inverted power consumption like our laptops running for a significant portion of the day.

Hope that helps!

Kr

Andy
 
Hi T3Z-GB,

Since our Alps trip in April we’ve done a number of trips and the loss through the windscreen is (fairly subjectively) circa 50%. If you’ve followed my install then you’ll probably guess that for anything other than laptop usage on the inverter this is not an issue whatsoever. However, I’ve got relatively comfortable chaining the panels to the outside of the van and adjusting them to follow the sun (so much better than the OEM and reorienting the van!). I’m now contemplating additional ecoflow panels perhaps even the new 400W ones - folks will only need to do this if they’ve got really heavy inverted power consumption like our laptops running for a significant portion of the day.

Hope that helps!

Kr

Andy
Thanks Andy,

Very helpful. Iv downgraded my laptop from a Dell XPS15 which had a 130 watt charger, to a smaller.14 inch laptop. Now only 65 watt.
Our power consumption is around 80 to 120ah daily. Induction cooking, kettle, laptop, phones etc all hang off the vans lithium battery bank. The 104 watt IOEM panel makes a good effort, however Iv ordered in the Bluetri 120watt panel for when I need an extra boost to the 104w while unattended. and the 350 for when we stick around one location for a few days.
If possible do you have any pics of how you attach the panels to the outside of the van please. The 350 watt panel is around 12kg and 228cm long 90cm wide, so not to sure where and how I’ll attach that yet.

Thx

Terry.
 
Hey!
I’m thinking it out loud here; is it a bad idea to use two lithium batteries they’re equivalent in Wh.

I fitted solar panels on the roof last summer. I’m now planning to replace the AGM leisure battery with a lithium one; considering Liontron LiFePO4 LX 12.8V 100Ah ARCTIC. It can operate at temperatures down to -30 Celsius.
 
Hey!
I’m thinking it out loud here; is it a bad idea to use two lithium batteries they’re equivalent in Wh.

I fitted solar panels on the roof last summer. I’m now planning to replace the AGM leisure battery with a lithium one; considering Liontron LiFePO4 LX 12.8V 100Ah ARCTIC. It can operate at temperatures down to -30 Celsius.
Typically the (internal) BMS is the limitation and most manufacturers will publish series and parallel limits. This quickstart guide prohibits series connections and allows parallel connections (no limit specified so certainly >=2)
 
You are making it too complicated. There is the "big Red switch" in the electrical cupboard at the back of the van, its the isolator for all habitation electrics. for a few quid there is an off the shelf replacement for the isolator that is designed to connect more than one supply, swap the switch & there is room in the cupboard for an additional battery so only short leads required.
Half hour to install & totally reversible.
Pics below original single battery switch V 2 battery switch.
Its top left of each picture View attachment 89256
View attachment 89255
Hi Andy
This really seems the ideal solution. It’s this something you have done? If so does it affect the display info at all?
Many thanks
Gregg
 
Hi Andy
This really seems the ideal solution. It’s this something you have done? If so does it affect the display info at all?
Many thanks
Gregg
Sorry I never got round to it, sold the GC and went back to an Ocean.
 
Back
Top