Byelaws, pop-top and cooking

[Defender90]

Do they? Really?

My mum's friend, in her late 70s, (real person not internet hearsay) got a FPN of £200 4 weeks ago for travelling 10 miles to go to Waitrose Colchester. Plod were sitting in the car park checking everyone's number plate. So clearly they do not have better things to do.

Meanwhile, in South Hertfordshire, gangs are chopping catalytic converters off people's vehicles.

That’s what’s wrong with this country if the police spent more time and effort on the drug dealers,rapists,and every other low life ,this country would be a better place for everyone else.Don’t get me wrong I respect the police and the effort they make it’s the policy makers that drive poor decisions I blame.

 

[bob_summers]

So you could sleep in the van?

In Spain yes. You can pop the top, open sliding windows and use leveling ramps.
You can’t use anything that exceeds the perimeter of the van, awnings, tables, chairs, hinged windows.

 

[Velma's Dad]

In Spain yes. You can pop the top, open sliding windows and use leveling ramps.
You can’t use anything that exceeds the perimeter of the van, awnings, tables, chairs, hinged windows.

Well I guess that's clear then. Just out of interest, what about the MH people, can they put a step outside the door... or do they have to jump??

 

[bob_summers]

Well I guess that's clear then. Just out of interest, what about the MH people, can they put a step outside the door... or do they have to jump??

If it’s an automatic step they can’t even open the door

 

[bob_summers]

Putting a sign like this in your window might prevent an agente municipal who doesn’t know the law, from banging on your door at 3am (or a nosy resident from phoning them in the first place)!
I’ve had no problems in an innocent looking black van but obviously MHs attract more attention!

 

[Barbara]

Whilst visiting Sevilla in October with a plan to cycle it started to rain so we had our lunch on our table outside under the awing in a car park. Very few cars about and no one complained. We often visit a park in Madrid and put the table and chairs out in the car park, no problem but again not a very busy day. Not sure I would in the UK.

 

[Velma's Dad]

Whilst visiting Sevilla in October with a plan to cycle it started to rain so we had our lunch on our table outside under the awing in a car park. Very few cars about and no one complained. We often visit a park in Madrid and put the table and chairs out in the car park, no problem but again not a very busy day. Not sure I would in the UK.

Reminds me of:
Q: What's the difference between American and British people when they're on holiday overseas?
A: The Yanks behave like they own the place; the Brits behave like they don't care who owns the place.

(Sorry Barbara, only kidding )

 

[Anthony1]

No, let's not start this again. It will only become an offence if you have the intention to reside AND you are asked to move and don't AND you cause significant harm or disruption.

If anyone wants to know more they can read the thread in the Three Cocks section.

What and where is the Three Cocks section?

 

[Velma's Dad]

What and where is the Three Cocks section?

If you go to the Forums tab and look at all the sections, it's the one at the bottom. It's where threads get put if they are deemed unreasonably argumentative. Posts there then don't come up in Recent Posts list. Some threads in Three Cocks have been locked (ie no further posts allowed).

For info, the thread I was referring to is this one:

https://vwcaliforniaclub.com/threads/gov-uk-consultation-strengthening-police-powers-to-tackle-unauthorised-encampments.33904/

It contains a lot of debate and discussion about the possible impact of the bill going through parliament that includes criminalisation of certain "residing on land with vehicles", and its possible effects on "wild camping".

 

[Barbara]

Reminds me of:
Q: What's the difference between American and British people when they're on holiday overseas?
A: The Yanks behave like they own the place; the Brits behave like they don't care who owns the place.

(Sorry Barbara, only kidding )

Not funny. Not sure what else to say as shaking with hurt. I feel I am not someone who would impinge on others and maybe this is not the place to make such jokes at others expense. Maybe you misunderstood my comment about not in the UK. It was to indicate that other counties are often more relaxed about parking and ways of life than the UK.

I have travelled expensively for work around the world and have also felt that I have respected the ways of the countries and to class all British people of all Americans in one way in my option is wrong. I understand that a joke can seem funny to someone and not others so I will try to forget about it as this site is more than the odd upset.

 

[Velma's Dad]

Not funny. Not sure what else to say as shaking with hurt. I feel I am not someone who would impinge on others and maybe this is not the place to make such jokes at others expense.

Barbara I'm really sorry, I was just joking and certainly not intended to be at your expense.

 

[bob_summers]

Not funny. Not sure what else to say as shaking with hurt. I feel I am not someone who would impinge on others and maybe this is not the place to make such jokes at others expense. Maybe you misunderstood my comment about not in the UK. It was to indicate that other counties are often more relaxed about parking and ways of life than the UK.

I have travelled expensively for work around the world and have also felt that I have respected the ways of the countries and to class all British people of all Americans in one way in my option is wrong. I understand that a joke can seem funny to someone and not others so I will try to forget about it as this site is more than the odd upset.

Don’t think VD was referring to you personally, just an offhand joke - but regarding the law, what you did in Seville is very usual and I doubt would’ve raised an eyebrow from anyone. My experience of brits traveling through here is that they are super respectful and have their own stereotype based on that!!
I’m currently staying on a site on the basque coast, several lay bys on the coast road have had wild campers on for days (I’m following the Basque cycling tour). I’ve been wild and quasi legally camping here for years and have never had a single problem. Put the awning out, table etc and I just bring it in if the place begins to fill up.

Whether all this is still the case in coming years with the camper van explosion in Spain, remains to be seen!

 

[Barbara]

Barbara I'm really sorry, I was just joking and certainly not intended to be at your expense.

Thanks no great harm done.

 

[rod_vw]

Going back to the subject of signs, it's time all such signs in the UK had to display details of the relevant by-law as they do in many parts of Europe. That way no Tom, Dick or Harry could erect signs at a personal whim.

 

[Gina-B]

Doesn't 'reside' imply a residence - ie somewhere you live? That feels much more of a permanent thing doesn't it - like the grey nomads of America and Australia? Aren't the rest of us just having fun on a day out? Please!

 

[Velma's Dad]

Doesn't 'reside' imply a residence - ie somewhere you live? That feels much more of a permanent thing doesn't it - like the grey nomads of America and Australia? Aren't the rest of us just having fun on a day out? Please!

I'm guessing you're referring to the word "reside" in the PCSC Bill sections on "unauthorised encampments"?

Ultimately the term will have to be interpreted by the courts, who will have regard to what they consider to be the everyday meaning of the word, and also to what they believe was parliament's intention and purpose of the statute.

There are however also concerns that the police and local authorities might choose to construe a very broad meaning to the term, and hence use it to deter people from overnight stays altogether, even though a court might or might not not ultimately back them up if it came to a prosecution.

 

[flying banana]

Not funny. Not sure what else to say as shaking with hurt. I feel I am not someone who would impinge on others and maybe this is not the place to make such jokes at others expense. Maybe you misunderstood my comment about not in the UK. It was to indicate that other counties are often more relaxed about parking and ways of life than the UK.

I have travelled expensively for work around the world and have also felt that I have respected the ways of the countries and to class all British people of all Americans in one way in my option is wrong. I understand that a joke can seem funny to someone and not others so I will try to forget about it as this site is more than the odd upset.

Bit ott. Never heard any jokes about a country before? Irish jokes maybe?
I do agree that it wasn't funny though.
come on VD, who telt you that stinker

 

[Magic Bus]

Police enforce law in pandemic shocker. It always amazes me that people who break the law often moan that the police haven’t got anything better to do when they are caught.

Was she actually breaking the law, though? You are allowed to go shopping and are asked to stay local but there’s not definition of what local is. If that’s your nearest Waitrose, then why not? Can the Police force you to shop at Aldi or Sainsbury’s? My local shop is an Aldi but there’s a lot of things they don’t stock. My nearest large supermarket is 7-8 miles away.

There was a case where Derby’s Police fined 2 women who’d travelled 4 miles to walk in the local park. The fines were quickly rescinded when it was confirmed what was guidance and what was the actual law.

 

[Amarillo]

Do they? Really?

My mum's friend, in her late 70s, (real person not internet hearsay) got a FPN of £200 4 weeks ago for travelling 10 miles to go to Waitrose Colchester. Plod were sitting in the car park checking everyone's number plate. So clearly they do not have better things to do.

As I don’t know your mum’s friend, I’m quite content to chalk that yarn up as Internet hearsay.

 

[Joker 1299]

Bit ott. Never heard any jokes about a country before? Irish jokes maybe?
I do agree that it wasn't funny though.
come on VD, who telt you that stinker

Nothing like a good old straight talking Yorkshireman! Or is that stereotyping too? Wait, I can see where this is heading; best get back on topic...

 

[Velma's Dad]

The regulations at the time stated that you should not leave your town or the part of the city you reside in to partake in your daily exercise.

No they didn't, the regulations said no such thing.

To "visit a public outdoor place for the purposes of open air recreation" was a specified exception to the requirement to remain at home. No reference at all was made about "local" or "your town" etc etc.

If you're going to cite the law, do it correctly.

 

[Joker 1299]

I am quoting it correctly. If you remember Boris was critised for his cycle ride to the Olympic park as it was outside of the area of the city he lived in.
If your going to criticise, do it correctly.

@Borris How could you?

 

[Velma's Dad]

I am quoting it correctly. If you remember Boris was critised for his cycle ride to the Olympic park as it was outside of the area of the city he lived in.
If your going to criticise, do it correctly.

What exactly are you quoting then? I suspect you are recalling something from the various versions of government guidance that have been issued. Perhaps (surprisingly, a year into the pandemic) you haven't yet grasped the difference between guidance and the law.

The police can and and should (in a measured and proportionate way) issue fixed penalties whenever they have reasonable suspicion that a law has been broken. However they certainly should never issue a FPN simply because they believe government guidance has not been complied with.

I repeat, the coronavirus regulations (ie the law) have never specified that activities should be "local" or in any other way defined how far you could travel from home for things for which you have a "reasonable excuse".

 

[Amarillo]

Im aware of the case you are talking about. The two women had driven from their town to a local reservoir for exercise. The regulations at the time stated that you should not leave your town or the part of the city you reside in to partake in your daily exercise.

The regulations said nothing of the sort.

In England they said that you may not leave your home without “reasonable excuse”. A non exhaustive list of “reasonable excuses” was given which included exercise. No limit on time or distance travelled was given. Separately, non statutory guidance was issued which may well have *advised* to stay local, but this would not be enforceable. So it all comes down to what is reasonable.

 

[Amarillo]

Haha very good.

I am fully aware of the difference between guidance and legislation thank you

Im quoting the Prime Minister in his speech to the commons in 4th January. A full copy of the legislation that covers this can be found online if you wish to educate yourself.

A Prime Minister’s speech does not define the law.