California ocean 4motion suspension

[SailSki]

I had a very clear illustration of the benefits of 4 wheel drive on otherwise identical cars the night my younger daughter was born in Paris many years ago - about 6 inches of snow fell in a very short time and the hill up to our house became sheet ice. At the time I had a VW Sharan diesel with 4Motion. I came across a Ford Galaxy (which was the same car but 2 wheel drive) stuck 1/3 of the way up the hill, unable to get any further. After a lot of effort and shoving from passers by we managed to get his car moving and up the hill.
I just got back in the 4wd Sharan and drove straight up the hill with no drama at all.
We were both on standard summer tyres.
I hope this helps.

 

[Bellcrew]

We have a 2018 4 motion 204 Cali, had hired a 2wd 150 a couple of times before and it was fine. Went for the 4 motion because it was replacing a land cruiser Amazon. Of course it’s nothing like the amazon off road, but it drives much better than the 2wd in my opinion. You can feel it being push and pulled round the corner much more sure footed. As for ride, it’s superb, very smooth. We tow as well and like the Amazon you can’t feel it’s there. We also went for the diff lock and have had to use it, on that off road Killer, wet muddy grass with a slight incline! Still on standard tyres mind you.

Sales men will tell you anything if they need to shift a vehicle. It’s a big purchase go for what you want.

Correct me if I am wrong but doesn't the VW four wheel drive system run in front wheel drive at all times unless the system senses wheel spin and then transfers some drive to the rear wheels via the Haldex clutch.

 

[Ksar-el-kebir]

Cheers, I think I will keep it as an “icing on the cake” option. I am thinking that there will be some time I would wish I have it but maybe a handful of times over 10 years I guess... the correct tyres however, I absolutely want those!!


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I’ve got a 4motion and the ride is definitely better than my last one which was 2wd.
Have the diff lock and had VB air suspension fitted. That helps off-road especially when you’re on a rocky track.
Haven’t done much in the snow but a fair bit in the Sahara with sand and mud.
Only damage was scratched paintwork caused by errant donkeys!

 

[Ksar-el-kebir]

I’ve got a 4motion and the ride is definitely better than my last one which was 2wd.
Have the diff lock and had VB air suspension fitted. That helps off-road especially when you’re on a rocky track.
Haven’t done much in the snow but a fair bit in the Sahara with sand and mud.
Only damage was scratched paintwork caused by errant donkeys!

I have all weather tyres too.

 

[yorkshirepudd]

I had a very clear illustration of the benefits of 4 wheel drive on otherwise identical cars the night my younger daughter was born in Paris many years ago - about 6 inches of snow fell in a very short time and the hill up to our house became sheet ice. At the time I had a VW Sharan diesel with 4Motion. I came across a Ford Galaxy (which was the same car but 2 wheel drive) stuck 1/3 of the way up the hill, unable to get any further. After a lot of effort and shoving from passers by we managed to get his car moving and up the hill.
I just got back in the 4wd Sharan and drove straight up the hill with no drama at all.
We were both on standard summer tyres.
I hope this helps.

Fab it does indeed. As I’ll be towing I can only imagine it would be beneficial even further with some weight pushing down on the back end, lifting the front a bit!


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[yorkshirepudd]

I’ve got a 4motion and the ride is definitely better than my last one which was 2wd.
Have the diff lock and had VB air suspension fitted. That helps off-road especially when you’re on a rocky track.
Haven’t done much in the snow but a fair bit in the Sahara with sand and mud.
Only damage was scratched paintwork caused by errant donkeys!

Awesome, that’s good enough for me if you can drive across the Sahara with one!!

Do you mind me asking about the air suspension I know nothing about what VB do but it looks like there are a few options.

What did you go for and do you mind saying how much it costs?

The one I hired I thought would’ve been improved ride-wise with air suspension, but if you can raise/lower it obviously would be cool too...


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[Ksar-el-kebir]

Awesome, that’s good enough for me if you can drive across the Sahara with one!!

Do you mind me asking about the air suspension I know nothing about what VB do but it looks like there are a few options.

What did you go for and do you mind saying how much it costs?

The one I hired I thought would’ve been improved ride-wise with air suspension, but if you can raise/lower it obviously would be cool too...


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Including fitting and VAT £5,160. That’s on all wheels and with automatic levelling. VB 4 C kit. Installed by Full Circle Enterprises of Banham, Norfolk.

 

[briwy]

We had our VB fitted by Mick Leicghtley here. Local to you just north of Donny.

https://www.specialistautomotiveproducts.co.uk/

Mick is a great guy, very knowlegeble and has fitted literally hundreds of T5/6 with air suspension.

 

[WelshGas]

Correct me if I am wrong but doesn't the VW four wheel drive system run in front wheel drive at all times unless the system senses wheel spin and then transfers some drive to the rear wheels via the Haldex clutch.

No, 90% front and 10% rear unless the system determines otherwise eg: traction, cornering, acceleration.

https://www.volkswagen.co.uk/technology/transmissions-and-drivetrains/4motion

 

[Christine Kirk]

We have had our 204, 4 motion, DSG box, Ocean, since the end of January, ( came from the Sheffield Van dealer; we're based in rural East Yorkshire and found the Hull dealer hopeless). So far we have travelled 5000mls in extreme comfort, down to Spain and then back via friends in rural France; it is quiet and rides well so I think the sales man is taking Bull.
Our other VW is a 2 wheel drive T4 Caravelle, in which we have done 244,000mls since new in 2003, its a comfortable ride also. In both vehicles we have now done 500 plus miles in a day in comfort; the Ocean feels more sure footed and given the fact that it weighs much more the permanent all wheel drive system must play a part. The 2 wheel drive Caravelle is hopeless on a slippery surface (grass fields!) as the weight distribution is all wrong. Both are on 17" standard tyres and we can definitely advise that some tyres are louder than others. The Caravelle is on Goodyear ones now, but in the past we have found Avons are also suited. Both are large and van like so don't expect sports car dynamics, so in our experience the 4 wheel drive system is worth having.
For the record the California has loosened up considerably, it is fast and surefooted; initially returned about 31mpg ( run down to Spain) but this has gradually improved to about 34mpg. It needed "AD BLUE" top up at 4500mls ( 10+ litres); we specified LED headlights which are an improvement over the halogens in the Caravelle.
Hope the above is helpful.

 

[yorkshirepudd]

We have had our 204, 4 motion, DSG box, Ocean, since the end of January, ( came from the Sheffield Van dealer; we're based in rural East Yorkshire and found the Hull dealer hopeless). So far we have travelled 5000mls in extreme comfort, down to Spain and then back via friends in rural France; it is quiet and rides well so I think the sales man is taking Bull.
Our other VW is a 2 wheel drive T4 Caravelle, in which we have done 244,000mls since new in 2003, its a comfortable ride also. In both vehicles we have now done 500 plus miles in a day in comfort; the Ocean feels more sure footed and given the fact that it weighs much more the permanent all wheel drive system must play a part. The 2 wheel drive Caravelle is hopeless on a slippery surface (grass fields!) as the weight distribution is all wrong. Both are on 17" standard tyres and we can definitely advise that some tyres are louder than others. The Caravelle is on Goodyear ones now, but in the past we have found Avons are also suited. Both are large and van like so don't expect sports car dynamics, so in our experience the 4 wheel drive system is worth having.
For the record the California has loosened up considerably, it is fast and surefooted; initially returned about 31mpg ( run down to Spain) but this has gradually improved to about 34mpg. It needed "AD BLUE" top up at 4500mls ( 10+ litres); we specified LED headlights which are an improvement over the halogens in the Caravelle.
View attachment 42923 Hope the above is helpful.

Thank you for sharing, that is helpful indeed! Particularly to know about grass. That’s a great looking Cali and your adventures sound great! I’ve not heard anything to support the line I was being spun at all so definitely ignoring it! That MPG doesn’t sound too bad for the size of it. Definitely would like LED headlights! Thank you and for the tip about dealers!


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[greenfintry]

We are on our second 4motion..... also with VB air suspension....... fitted the latter after beaching a few times in snow drifts in the mega snow drifts in the Alps last winter. The adjust on the air sus is good to raise up the van to dig out snow blown under when parked up..... also good for sport setting on autoroutes to improve fuel economy (maybe 4mpg better) and limbo into multi-storey car parks

 

[Legin]

We are on our second 4motion..... also with VB air suspension....... fitted the latter after beaching a few times in snow drifts in the mega snow drifts in the Alps last winter. The adjust on the air sus is good to raise up the van to dig out snow blown under when parked up..... also good for sport setting on autoroutes to improve fuel economy (maybe 4mpg better) and limbo into multi-storey car parks

What does the VB do for the ride though ?

 

[B J G]

I had VB on my T6 4M and after a prolonged issue with VB about the poor ride and handling I had it replaced by the Bilstein based system. The supplier referred to VB as 'Very Bouncy' which was my issue.

As to the ride I would say that the air system doesn't provide any better ride quality than the steel spring system does. Spring and damper upgrades are available for up to 40% of the cost of air system. It does give ride height and parked levelling options.

Being able to drop the Cali when parked is a big plus with my wife as no climbing in or out is required, just step in. Makes washing the roof easier also.

Definitely try to find someone locally with air to compare against springs.

 

[Legin]

Ok thanks for that valuable info. How do you find the Bilstein system by comparison ?

 

[B J G]

Ok thanks for that valuable info. How do you find the Bilstein system by comparison ?

Bilstein controlled by E-level system and a VIAIR Compressor.

Almost instant raising or lowering, VB was slow.
Control panel in door panel top storage for easy access, VB was on a flexicable on the floor.
VB compressor quieter (due to small capacity)
Bilstein compressor/tank normally fits into spare wheel area. I didn't want to loose that and had a few issues with noise until I designed my own solution. Compressor sits inside the spare wheel. VB one is under the passenger seat near the fuel-adblue tanks.

Bilstein struts are shorter which means max raised height is less than the VB System. Bilstein would be slightly higher than the original steel spring setup in raised position, no problem for me as don't go on anything other than fields or normal camp sites.
Bilstein goes lower, I don't 'drop' the air out as it traps the mudflaps, not driveable in this position. Lots of photo's of vans with 18" and over wheels with air in lowered position on EBAY.

VB has 4 heights selectable. E-Level has 3 which you can either set yourself or it can do an auto setup, but can be manually set anywhere as required very quickly.

VB optional auto level. E-level done manually but minutes faster than VB. Not quite such a high incline tolerance as VB. The shorter struts mentioned above being the reason.

Bilsteins handle back roads with ease. High speeds can be safely done, beyond my requirements.

Bilsteins are more expensive than VB. Biggest difference is the damping and ride performance.

Bit more to it than that but I'm probably boring you already.

 

[Legin]

Not bored at all. Finally someone can give a detailed and objective assessment of the pros and cons. I guess its Bilstein,s undoubted damping prowess that is the decider here, more or less an air spring has only the rising rate as a variable.

 

[B J G]

Not bored at all. Finally someone can give a detailed and objective assessment of the pros and cons. I guess its Bilstein,s undoubted damping prowess that is the decider here, more or less an air spring has only the rising rate as a variable.

Recently when the Cali was in for a couple of days at the dealers they loaned me a T6 van, probably a T28 as on 205 tyres. The ride was smooth and performance was impressive, a manual gearbox, no body roll either. It showed up the handling short comings of the Cali with all of the extra internal and roof weight added to a basic van.
The extra sound deadening and door seals made it clear where much of the Cali cost goes. Helps appreciate why the Cali is superior to van conversions.

Both VB and Bilstein air seem to transmit more rough surface noise than the original steel suspension, crashing is the term I believe, noise rather than a physical jolt, illogical as the same rubber insulators are used and air would be assumed to isolate the body better than steel. Bilstein is noticeably better than VB.

A big benefit of an air suspension is that you can lower the Cali to a 'sport' height and no matter what load is carrier it will maintain that height/ground clearance. In the case of an E-Level controlled system if high (speed bump) or low (pothole) obstacle is encountered a simple press of a button increases the ground clearance in seconds, VB more like minutes.

If you want more info on my saga let me know and I'll PM you.