Calling all TSI Cali owners.... this forum needs you!

[California7]

In light of the current diesel gate at VW HQ it would be really useful to have some feedback on your vans.

What are they like to drive, torque is an often a concern, do you tow?

Inevitably it’s the fuel economy that puts people off, how do you use your van and what’s your mpg?

More and more people are going to be considering ordering petrol the longer the current crisis continues so your real world feedback will be very helpful.

I have more than a casual interest too...

Tom

 

[sidepod]

What crisis would that be then?

 

[Lloydfred]

Turns out VW & BMW locked a load of primates and humans in a testing facility in Germany and exposed them to oily fumes.

 

[DaNish]

I ordered the TSI 204 and are still waiting for delivery. But during my research I found this thread on a german forum: https://www.motor-talk.de/forum/vw-t6-multivan-tsi-150-ps-t6214422.html#commentlistJumpMarker
It is about the Multivan and the 150 hp engine, but I think it gives a reasonable perspective on the big variations in fuel consumption. Basically it will cost you to go petrol (about 3l more pr. 100 seems to be the most common experience), but if it fits your driving needs and you, like me, would like to avoid diesel bans in cities, it sounds like a very nice driving experience.
Regarding torque the TSI 204 has 350 NM, which is a bit more than the 150 TDI. So when it comes to towing, I would compare it more to the 150 TDI, than the 204 TDI. I do not tow anything very heavy, so I have not researched that very much.
I too would value any real world experience from TSI owners. It has been quite difficult to find much experience. The engine in TSI is an EA888, but apparently without some of the fuel saving additions used in some Audis. But I have not been able to find any technical information detailing which version of the EA888 is currently used in T6. So all knowledge regarding this could be interesting.

 

[Bellcrew]

Turns out VW & BMW locked a load of primates and humans in a testing facility in Germany and exposed them to oily fumes.

Sounds just like every bus garage I have ever been in, mechanics working in a permanent fug of diesel fumes, the extraction system an ornament, just too much of a faff to connect up and of course no SCR on any of the old double deckers.

 

[WelshGas]

I ordered the TSI 204 and are still waiting for delivery. But during my research I found this thread on a german forum: https://www.motor-talk.de/forum/vw-t6-multivan-tsi-150-ps-t6214422.html#commentlistJumpMarker
It is about the Multivan and the 150 hp engine, but I think it gives a reasonable perspective on the big variations in fuel consumption. Basically it will cost you to go petrol (about 3l more pr. 100 seems to be the most common experience), but if it fits your driving needs and you, like me, would like to avoid diesel bans in cities, it sounds like a very nice driving experience.
Regarding torque the TSI 204 has 350 NM, which is a bit more than the 150 TDI. So when it comes to towing, I would compare it more to the 150 TDI, than the 204 TDI. I do not tow anything very heavy, so I have not researched that very much.
I too would value any real world experience from TSI owners. It has been quite difficult to find much experience. The engine in TSI is an EA888, but apparently without some of the fuel saving additions used in some Audis. But I have not been able to find any technical information detailing which version of the EA888 is currently used in T6. So all knowledge regarding this could be interesting.

You might find this interesting

http://www.vwt4forum.co.uk/showthread.php?t=1442834&highlight=Caravelle

 

[DaNish]

You might find this interesting

http://www.vwt4forum.co.uk/showthread.php?t=1442834&highlight=Caravelle

Thanks WG, really good thread. The short version cited from that thread: Our VW T6 TSI have a EA888 Gen 2 similar to audi A4 B8 with theVVT. Our engine code is CJKA or CJKB
CJKA is 204 and CJKB is 150 and the engines are identical apart from tuning.
But really worth reading.

 

[Max-Felix]

Good link from real owners WG, if I was ordering a new Cali now it would be petrol all the way, no questions asked. I like old diesel Land Rovers for the off road chuggy diesel characteristic but given the choice for any other vehicle for me it would be a no-brainer.

That's all things considered - price, maintenance/potential issues, additives, politics, city access, refinement, future re-sale, adequate power/torque.

The most often quoted issue is fuel consumption but to re-post some figures I shoved in an older topic below - for most low mileage Cali owners the fuel consumption issue is seriously over blown and as I say you need to take into consideration lower price, lower maintenance, no additives and a shed load less of potential emissions and other components that have a habit of being rather fragile and certainly expensive to replace.

Petrol is around £1.19

Diesel £1.22

But the difference has been much more marked in the past in petrol's favour.

For most Cali owners fuel consumption is not a huge deal and relatively insignificant and overplayed next to other costs.

We don't know what a petrol Cali real world MPG would be but say at 5000 miles a year at say £5.40 gallon:

20mpg = £1350
25mpg = £1080
30mpg = £900
35mpg = £770

So say the likely difference is maybe 25 mpg petrol vs 35 mpg diesel then it's only £300 odd at 5000 miles a year! Even if you're the exception at 10k a year then £600.

 

[briwy]

Depends where you go. Most of our high mileage is done abroad so diesel is still generally cheaper at the pump over there. Doing 15-20k a year makes a huge difference. If we only did 5k a year I don't
think we would have bought one, just hired when needed.

 

[Max-Felix]

Dearer than here!

http://www.fuel-prices-europe.info/

In France it's 1.41 odd Euros a litre at present at £1 = Euro 1.10 that's £1.28 litre.

If fuel (diesel/petrol) is the same price and you do 15,000 miles a year then the difference is significant but not that huge all things considered = £1000 at £1.28 litre. But that is at a 25 petrol vs 35 diesel. Not sure what the real world consumption would be for the new petrol but for me on two 10,000 mile Europe trips in diesel Calis it's been low/mid 30's.

Petrol could well be better than 25.

As I say though you need to consider other savings with the petrol in terms of purchase, maintenance, parts, Adblue etc and most owners do much less than 15k.

I know many will quite rightly defend diesel as that is what they own and for many it will be a great choice but at least now there is a choice!

Man, I must be bored at work but just averaged out the mileage per year of the first 21 Calis for sale on here - average mileage over all 21, a fair sample of old, mid-age and young, is under 6000 annually.

 

[WelshGas]

Dearer than here!

http://www.fuel-prices-europe.info/

In France it's 1.41 odd Euros a litre at present at £1 = Euro 1.10 that's £1.28 litre.

If fuel (diesel/petrol) is the same price and you do 15,000 miles a year then the difference is significant but not that huge all things considered = £1000 at £1.28 litre. But that is at a 25 petrol vs 35 diesel. Not sure what the real world consumption would be for the new petrol but for me on two 10,000 mile Europe trips in diesel Calis it's been low/mid 30's.

Petrol could well be better than 25.

As I say though you need to consider other savings with the petrol in terms of purchase, maintenance, parts, Adblue etc and most owners do much less than 15k.

I know many will quite rightly defend diesel as that is what they own and for many it will be a great choice but at least now there is a choice!

Man, I must be bored at work but just averaged out the mileage per year of the first 21 Calis for sale on here - average mileage over all 21, a fair sample of old, mid-age and young, is under 6000 annually.

Don't forget to subtract AdBlue costs from the equation, and long term DPF replacement cost + Sensors etc:

 

[WelshGas]

So, what's the chance that VW make a Petrol - Hybrid?

 

[Max-Felix]

So, what's the chance that VW make a Petrol - Hybrid?

It has to be the very near future solution I'm sure and then fully electric using near field charging built into the roads. Maybe not in our driving lifetime though...

http://theconversation.com/wired-up...e-your-electric-car-while-youre-driving-72625

 

[Digger]

So, what's the chance that VW make a Petrol - Hybrid?

Probably just an all electric in collaboration with a Chinese company.
The main issue with the petrol version is the CO2 emissions and other pollutants. It is surely the best option for shorter journeys without doubt. That said my contact with some officials shows they don't like the petrol version either and it will be subjected to similar restrictions and taxation.

 

[blondebier]

if I was ordering a new Cali now it would be petrol all the way, no questions asked.

I would have done, except they don't do a TSI DSG for the Beach in the UK. Come on VW!

So, what's the chance that VW make a Petrol - Hybrid?

I wish they would. I've got a Golf GTE and it's a cracking bit of kit. Last year I filled up 4 times. Average over 2000 miles on a tank.

It's got a relatively small battery and a 1.4 TSI petrol engine. It's a hoot.

 

[Hotel California]

This is not going in the wright direction as the OP is asking petrol Cali owners for advice....
Most of the replies are diesel related witch we had in other topics:
https://vwcaliforniaclub.com/thread...w-or-wait-until-june.18723/page-2#post-215292

I have put myself up at VW to testdrive a 204bhp DSG 4motion petrol version , but as there is no testcar availeble in Belgium according to VW i am without a clue how it drives .

 

[andyinluton]

For most Cali owners fuel consumption is not a huge deal and relatively insignificant and overplayed next to other costs.

We don't know what a petrol Cali real world MPG would be but say at 5000 miles a year at say £5.40 gallon:

20mpg = £1350
25mpg = £1080
30mpg = £900
35mpg = £770

So say the likely difference is maybe 25 mpg petrol vs 35 mpg diesel then it's only £300 odd at 5000 miles a year! Even if you're the exception at 10k a year then £600.

I await some proper data re the fuel consumption, I fear the real difference in my case would be more like 40mpg Diesel to 20mpg Petrol so £600 for 5000 miles, but I do more like 15,000miles a year so £1800 a year extra. That is not relatively insignificant & is more than my maintenance, tax & insurance combined.

It also makes a huge difference when considering individual trips, doubling the fuel bill for a trip to Spain would be painful.

Also for me using it almost daily, effectively halving the range on a tankful would be a complete pain.

 

[andyinluton]

Man, I must be bored at work but just averaged out the mileage per year of the first 21 Calis for sale on here - average mileage over all 21, a fair sample of old, mid-age and young, is under 6000 annually.

You can prove anything with statistics.
I would suggest those 21 are from owners that aren't using them, hence they are up for sale.
It would be interesting to get the stats from people that do use them.
The current car like MPG is a major attraction for me & makes the Cali viable as a car replacement.

 

[California7]

Thanks for the above, but still no first hand experience. I guess there are only a handful out there.

I will be towing a light twin axle car trailer occasionally (all up weight about 1250Kg).

The cost including depreciation, servicing costs is a very interesting one and will depend how long you intend to keep hold of it. In my case probably around 4 years.

The van I have ordered will be partly paid for via PCP following a chunky deposit (not interested in the pros & cons of finance - the maths works for me ). Based on my mileage of 10K PA, the PCP illustration I received had the guaranteed future value of the petrol considerably lower than the diesel which meant that the monthly rentals were considerably higher. Now what the actual value of either will be is anyone's guess and it could well be that come trade in time you'd have considerably more equity in one than the other.

I reckon that assuming the diesel gets around 35mpg and the petrol 25mpg I'd be spending around £650 more per year with the petrol, if I keep the van for 4 years that's £2600, from memory the rental was around £50/month more for the petrol (£2400 over 4 years), meaning I'd be £5000 worse off with petrol.... but the petrol van may be worth considerably more come trade in time in which case it might not cost me anything extra - In the end I'd be gambling known worst case costs (diesel van ends up being actually worth less/same as the guaranteed future value) against the petrol being worth £5000 more than VW themselves think it will be. It's a tough one in the current anti diesel climate. (no pun!)

Having said that, my wife wants me to cancel our order and buy a new TVR (OK that bit is a dream), but she does want to go for the petrol cali.

If the exhaust crackles on the overrun I would probably be persuaded!

I've been at my desk too long today....

Tom

 

[Jerseyroberts]

Hi,

I am due to pick up a TSI beach that was ordered late October in the next few days (it arrived at dealers last week and going to have a look tomorrow). I’m a mix of excitement and nerves.

As background, it will be an everyday drive (regular short distance at a low speed). I plan to do one holiday trip of about a thousand miles a year in Europe/UK. Probably about 7000 miles max a year in total. No towing will be done.

Not sure how comparible this will be to the norm but I presume quite different.

Thanks for all the thoughts and advice in other posts. Really useful site

 

[California7]

Hi,

I am due to pick up a TSI beach that was ordered late October in the next few days (it arrived at dealers last week and going to have a look tomorrow). I’m a mix of excitement and nerves.

As background, it will be an everyday drive (regular short distance at a low speed). I plan to do one holiday trip of about a thousand miles a year in Europe/UK. Probably about 7000 miles max a year in total. No towing will be done.

Not sure how comparible this will be to the norm but I presume quite different.

Thanks for all the thoughts and advice in other posts. Really useful site

Congratulations! I wouldn’t be able to sleep with excitement!

Looking forward to hearing all about it in the coming weeks, please post a picture to give us diesel boys something to take our minds off it!

 

[westfalia]

I have put myself up at VW to testdrive a 204bhp DSG 4motion petrol version , but as there is no testcar availeble in Belgium according to VW i am without a clue how it drives

Wise decision by VW there.

 

[andyinluton]

Hi,

I am due to pick up a TSI beach that was ordered late October in the next few days (it arrived at dealers last week and going to have a look tomorrow). I’m a mix of excitement and nerves.

As background, it will be an everyday drive (regular short distance at a low speed). I plan to do one holiday trip of about a thousand miles a year in Europe/UK. Probably about 7000 miles max a year in total. No towing will be done.

Not sure how comparible this will be to the norm but I presume quite different.

Thanks for all the thoughts and advice in other posts. Really useful site

For you a petrol sounds like the sensible choice, a diesel would get clogged up with lots of short journeys & guessing by your name the option of a 50 mile blast down the motorway once a week isn't viable.

 

[podge]

This is an interesting read as well

https://vans.honestjohn.co.uk/our-v...or-thought-whats-it-like-to-run-a-petrol-van/

All be it for a T6 Transporter, but the claimed mileage doesn't differ significantly from the mileage the review has achieved in real life

 

[andyinluton]

This is an interesting read as well

https://vans.honestjohn.co.uk/our-v...or-thought-whats-it-like-to-run-a-petrol-van/

All be it for a T6 Transporter, but the claimed mileage doesn't differ significantly from the mileage the review has achieved in real life

Until they actually put some weight in it then it dropped to 24.9mpg.......