Electric roof vs Beach roof

[Ajspicer]

The novelty of the electric roof is starting to wear off a little now having owned the Cali for 6 months.

I have read some pits on here about expensive hydraulic repairs when parts of the system have failed, considering we are hoping to keep the Cali for a long long time, I was wondering if anyone has ever considered converting to a manual roof in the event of a hydraulic failure / repair bill. Surely to gas struts and the fasteners must be a lot cheaper?

Just a thought :?:

How long does it take Beach owners to pop up and close down?

Andrew.

 

[Custardtart]

I'm not sure what's on the full fat cali but the beach has two safety buckles which you unclip then two latches which you undo then push. Once you get it moving the gas-struts take over and do the rest.

I'd say the longest part of the job is opening the sliding hatch to start.

That said, I can think of a few advantages of your electro-hydraulic roof:

1. it's very bling bling!
2. I expect it'll do better if you've got some stuff on the roof (say roofbox, kayak etc)

 

[James]

I'd take the manual roof every time - but both can be fragile and need care and attention.

The electric roof on the full fat Cali is its 'halo' feature, and designed to be a talking/selling point. The Mercedes Marco Polo on sale in Europe has an electric rear seat that at the press of a button coverts into a bed, so that's its 'halo' feature. They all have something

James

 

[Pollychops]

If you want the Full Campervan with kitchen, cupboards etc then there is no choice. It comes with the electric roof. As the Beach doesn't have the kitchen etc it has the manual, probably a matter of cost as the Beach is targeting a different market. I am not sure if you can upgrade the Beach to have an electric roof....please if anyone thinks you can let us know.

 

[James]

If you want the Full Campervan with kitchen, cupboards etc then there is no choice. It comes with the electric roof. As the Beach doesn't have the kitchen etc it has the manual, probably a matter of cost as the Beach is targeting a different market. I am not sure if you can upgrade the Beach to have an electric roof....please if anyone thinks you can let us know.

If the roofs are the same size then it should be possible, the Beach roof does come up and sit at slightly higher angle. It would be an interesting upgrade but a lot of bits, i guess it will be done eventually.

You just strip a Cali SE back, I think I've seen that done in Germany, take out the units and put in a Beach interior. You can sell a full Cali interior for a fair price.

Pre facelift LHD Cali's came in Trend and Comfortline, I believe Trend dispensed of the electric roof, it's shame that in some you can't have the choice. That said, I guess, if you did, when it came to sell people may favour one with an electric roof.

Would be very interesting to see a Beach with an electric roof

James

 

[Pollychops]

I would guess the cost of all of the bits for electric roof is high and adding this to the beach may make the overall cost less appealing and possibly too close to the cost of the SE, which may push Beach buyers to look elsewhere.

 

[gatvol]

I'd have had a manual roof, but electric was the only option as I wanted the kitchen.

I would put it in the ticking time bomb category. It will fail, it will be bloody expensive, I will feel like a complete mug when this happens, I will feel sick when I hand over massive sums of money to get it fixed.

 

[Pollychops]

Maybe you should get rid now and save yourself the heartache, you could get a good price for your SE buy a new beach with the manual roof and put in a Maxxcamp kitchen.

 

[Kaydee]

Sorry but the original poster asked about down grading the electric roof to manual ,which I have always thought would be a damn good idea.He didn't ask about upgrading the beach,which seems to have taken over the thread,so without being rude has anyone gone from hydraulic to manual,not from manual to hydraulic.cheers

 

[Kaydee]

To AJ spicer,looking at the images of both vans ,the rear supports and the roofs seem the same,the difference I think lies with the front supporting arm so in theory I can't see why replacing just the front hydraulic arms shouldn't work fine ,the lift height looks pretty much the same and having looked at the mounting points on both vans (and I could be wrong)I reckon it would be possible to lose the front arms and hydraulics and fit a strut,to be fair it's what converters have been doing for years,if and when my motorised top fails I will do just this and will look into the practicalities of carrying out the conversion,metal is metal and bolts are bolts,it's not rocket science,and as I was always told when I was young ....anything a man can build with tools ,another can change with tools.

 

[calikev]

To AJ spicer,looking at the images of both vans ,the rear supports and the roofs seem the same,the difference I think lies with the front supporting arm so in theory I can't see why replacing just the front hydraulic arms shouldn't work fine ,the lift height looks pretty much the same and having looked at the mounting points on both vans (and I could be wrong)I reckon it would be possible to lose the front arms and hydraulics and fit a strut,to be fair it's what converters have been doing for years,if and when my motorised top fails I will do just this and will look into the practicalities of carrying out the conversion,metal is metal and bolts are bolts,it's not rocket science,and as I was always told when I was young ....anything a man can build with tools ,another can change with tools.

I agree I looked at the comparison between the beach and se and your right about the gas struts it would just need a handle fitting to pull it down and some way of fastening it shut

 

[Kaydee]

Yes exactly calikev ,and though I haven't done the measuring it wouldn't surprise me if the struts weren't very similar to those holding the tailgate up

 

[calikev]

That would make sense. I do know of someone who buys California roofs and fits them to conversions without the hydraulics so I know it can be done

 

[Kaydee]

This is definitely worth following up on,it's the best and most practical way to avoid big bills when the roof fails and to be fair they are all going to,all we have to do is have the conversion info available for people to use when it starts to happen,I am going to do a bit of research into this,all the best to you Calikev.

 

[martinhjones]

I am sitting in my Cali, in France right now reading this. My roof failed on closing last week and the control panel has been replaced by a VW dealer here at a cost of approx £600 and a 4 day wait. The roof seemed to close ok but didn't complete its finishing off sequence. The panel was then saying it was open but it would not open or close it any more. The alarm sounded if I tried to drive it.
The dealer used his diagnostic laptop to determine control panel failure. Now it seems to be working ok but (as far as I could tell from his French) he has warned me that the "jacks" seem worn and need replacing when I am back in the UK.
The van is 08 reg and has done 25000 miles. The prospect of further failures terrifies me and this is no way to spend a holiday.
Manual for me if I can get it done somewhere: hence reading this thread.
Martin

 

[Pollychops]

Sorry to hear about your problem, I hope this is not a recurring problem. We had a Mazda Bongo years ago, it was 10 years old when we got it and that electric roof was up and down like a yo yo and we never experienced any problems. Let's hope this does not become a post as long as the blistering paint post.

 

[jts46]

This is definitely worth following up on,it's the best and most practical way to avoid big bills when the roof fails and to be fair they are all going to,all we have to do is have the conversion info available for people to use when it starts to happen,I am going to do a bit of research into this,all the best to you Calikev.

I would be very interested in your research, my cali has now done 108,000 miles and had trouble with passenger side of roof lifting at 70mph on A10 in France. Roof seemed ok and have just completed 4 weeks camping in Italy, with no further problems
Have often thought about converting mine to a manual lift roof

:cool

 

[martinhjones]

Still in France and holding my breath each time I move the Cali.
Might the biggest problem in converting to manual be removing the hydraulics! :?:

 

[Kaydee]

Not sure you would need to martin,once the struts are disconnected,and the manual strut installed the old equipment isn't going to interfere or get in the way,and if it's non functional why bother.

 

[martinhjones]

Sounds good! I don't know much about how it all works, so I was imagining ends of hydraulic pipes rattling around in the channels. And then the horrors of 1000 psi oil being pumped into the van if someone operated the roof controls.

 

[smgcowfoldparts]

The roof control unit is separate to the van from a diagnostic point of view and has it's own diagnostic menu. You may have been able to clear the codes and reset the roof yourself by going into the diagnostic menu to get the roof closed. We had a customer who had an intermittent alarm for the roof still being open on their California and there was one code in it, we cleared it in the roof control unit diagnostic menu and it has been fine ever since. His did actually fully close though.

thanks

 

[Kaydee]

Just for interest Alex,you must know the common parts for the beach and california,I understand VW will want you to repair the roof according to model ,but it seems that if a pleasant chap like yourself could offer some advice to us keen on a retro fit back to manual it would be bussiness for VW and a fair dollop of goodwill into the bargain,what do you think
Kevin

 

[smgcowfoldparts]

You would have to remove the hydraulic system I would have thought, then be faced with the possibility of the roof unit showing a fault, make sure that all holes where the hydraulic lines come out of the interior are suitably covered so as not to leak, remove the roof pump, remove the hydraulic rams, re-manufacture the roof so that you can open and shut it by hand, secure it when it is closed to keep it water tight as well.

There would not be any goodwill forthcoming from VW towards this as you are changing to a non-standard item and changing the vehicle from stock. Is it possible? Anything is possible and it would also depend on how deep your pockets are as well.

cheers

 

[Kaydee]

I meant that owners would feel happier that VW were prepared to consider this ,not Goodwill as in financial help from VW.
I bow to your superior knowledge,but can't see why the hydraulics can't just stay put,once the rams are disconnected they aren't going anywhere.The main supports unbolt and the manual arms are simple enough to mount ,the existing rails are more than up to the job ,the error message may bother some people,OK if it does they aren't going to go this route and as for roof brackets ,pretty much every other Camper out there manages fine without the roofs blowing off so That can be overcome safely .I know I am simplifying this but still can't see a good reason for removing all the hydraulics ,they just aren't going to get in the way.
Best wishes and thanks
Kevin

 

[smgcowfoldparts]

In theory you could leave the hydraulic system in their, but if you are going to the hassle of changing to a manual roof then take it all out as not required. If the hydraulic rams come out which they would probably have to, then you would not want the fluid leaking out for example. All hypothetical, but I would personally want to do the job properly and thoroughly if I was going down this route and not leave anything there that didn't need to be left or was no longer used.

cheers