On the horns of a dilemma

[Broch Hunter]

I have been on this forum for a few months and found it to be a goldmine of useful information and advice. Right now I am on the horns of a dilemma, so my first post is a request for opinions from more learned, wiser and experienced owners.

I have an Ocean 150 DSG on order with a current provisional production date of Week 47. When I placed the order I was wearing my sensible head and opted for the 150 rather than the 204. The logic being that the power was sufficient, running costs were lower and long term reliability was likely to be better than the more complex biturbo version. I was also influenced by reviews (MMM, Camper Van Magazine, What Motorhome and AutoExpress) which suggested (at the risk of offending 204 owners) that the 150 was smoother to drive and the better overall option. I concluded that as it will only used by my wife and myself, with no plans to load it with lots of extra 'stuff' on our travels and without the extra weight of 4motion hardware the 150 was the solution for me.

Since placing the order, my heart has kept nagging at me that I should have gone for the greater power of the 204. Currently I can still amend the order, but the advice from the dealer on delivery time is that the impact will be unknown and I am very keen to avoid the delivery date slipping to April and into the clutches of the anticipated new VED costs.

I don't believe that short test drives in unloaded demonstrators will really answer the question as to whether the power of the 204 is truly needed. So I am seeking advice from existing owners on the capabilities of the 150 based on their real world day to day and touring experience. I note that many 204 owners have also opted for 4motion and wonder if, apart from the obvious benefits in snow and mud etc, a factor in their choice was the need to offset any tendency of the 204 to lose traction due to its greater power.

I also look for advice on the impact on delivery times from anyone who has amended their order. I appreciate that each case will be different in complexity and impact, but it might help me to form a view on the risk of an amendment from 150 to 204 resulting in delivery of my eagerly awaited California slipping into April or even beyond.

 

[T6 CFO]

Hi, I'm someone who ordered the 204 but know what you mean with the 150 and yes there are some persuasive arguments on the simplicity and running costs. For me though it was all or nothing with this purchase, the 4Motion was in part for the way I believe it will drive, for the odd off piste sticky moment and for prevention of front wheel spin having owned a Touran with a powerful engine which was dead easy to spin. Good luck


Mike

 

[Ambler]

Whilst I have never driven the 150 IMO the Cali is not the sort of vehicle that you drive in such a way that it induces wheel spin. I can't remember ever experiencing it on mine.

Whether you "need" 4wd drive, well there have been several threads on here in the past discusssing the pros and cons. IMO for normal use it is not necessary.

With a vehicle as heavy as the Cali I think torque is more important than bhp. Does the 150 reach max torque at low revs?

Also, which model did you test drive?

 

[GrannyJen]

I have been on this forum for a few months and found it to be a goldmine of useful information and advice. Right now I am on the horns of a dilemma, so my first post is a request for opinions from more learned, wiser and experienced owners.

I have an Ocean 150 DSG on order with a current provisional production date of Week 47. When I placed the order I was wearing my sensible head and opted for the 150 rather than the 204. The logic being that the power was sufficient, running costs were lower and long term reliability was likely to be better than the more complex biturbo version. I was also influenced by reviews (MMM, Camper Van Magazine, What Motorhome and AutoExpress) which suggested (at the risk of offending 204 owners) that the 150 was smoother to drive and the better overall option. I concluded that as it will only used by my wife and myself, with no plans to load it with lots of extra 'stuff' on our travels and without the extra weight of 4motion hardware the 150 was the solution for me.

Since placing the order, my heart has kept nagging at me that I should have gone for the greater power of the 204. Currently I can still amend the order, but the advice from the dealer on delivery time is that the impact will be unknown and I am very keen to avoid the delivery date slipping to April and into the clutches of the anticipated new VED costs.

I don't believe that short test drives in unloaded demonstrators will really answer the question as to whether the power of the 204 is truly needed. So I am seeking advice from existing owners on the capabilities of the 150 based on their real world day to day and touring experience. I note that many 204 owners have also opted for 4motion and wonder if, apart from the obvious benefits in snow and mud etc, a factor in their choice was the need to offset any tendency of the 204 to lose traction due to its greater power.

I also look for advice on the impact on delivery times from anyone who has amended their order. I appreciate that each case will be different in complexity and impact, but it might help me to form a view on the risk of an amendment from 150 to 204 resulting in delivery of my eagerly awaited California slipping into April or even beyond.

Yes, a difficult problem that a lot wrestle with. You are not alone!

Reports from those who have a 150 speak very well of the power, flexibility and torque of the engine so I do not see you having problems there unless you want to drive it up mountains, and the 150 seems to cope with those as well.

The 4WD? Again depends on where and when you anticipate going. For summer use except in really boggy terrain the weight and FWD of the Cali seems to get it out of most slippery spots, especially with all season tyres.

I camp 12 months all round and have a penchant for going off main roads into the wilderness when there's snow lying around. My 4WD is there like an insurance policy. If I didn't have it I would need it. If I've got it? Well, seriously, I have rarely needed to make a claim. However, if you are going in to remote areas in potentially wild and sub-zero weather then it's a good insurance policy to have.

 

[jason.oneill4]

Hi BH,

I think the 204/4Mot combo offers max versatility and that this underscores the purpose of the Cali? I found driving it 'fully loaded' was the exact same as when 'empty' such is the power etc. I also like the 4mot for added driving safety. Hope this helps... J.

 

[Alibee]

I'm with you all of the way BH. Ordered a 150 but if funds allowed then 204/4Motion would be my choice too. Unfortunately, my head knows damn well that the times I would need either the extra power or the 4WD would be very limited indeed.

I've always been amazed by what a 2WD car/van can do in the right hands off road, and 150bhp is going to seem like a lot as we're coming from a 78bhp T4 Westy that we loaded to the gunnels on every trip and still managed a rock-solid 78mph hour after hour, day after day.

I would also think that your dealer is probably the only one who could give you a clear steer on delays as we spend far too much time on here hypothesising about VW's order mgmt process!

 

[sidepod]

Always go with more power/torque. You don't have to use it, it's nice to have in your pocket.

Seems odd to me to waste a percentage of the extra power lugging around a 4wd system you'll use once every three blue moons.

If you can afford it and you don't mind a (possible) delay in delivery then tick the box.

Nobody, and I mean nobody, has ever posted a thread wishing they'd gone for less power/torque.
Resale is better too.

Pod.

 

[Days out]

I have a 150 DSG and although I could have pushed to get a 204 I tried to keep my purchase on budget.

I regularly drive cars with power in excess of 600bhp with 4WD but also have owned many cars with the 150-180 BHP turbo Diesel engine.

I can honestly say the 150 is more than sufficient for the California Ocean. It pulls really well and can sit at 70mph comfortably on the motorway. The acceleration is sufficient and I've not yet felt it's underpowered.

That's not to say the 204 bhp engine would not be any better as Im Sure it is but all I'm saying is that the 150 works well. It's not underpowered.

I find myself driving the Cali in a different way to my other car. (Currently a 3.0 turbo diesel with 250bhp) I'm more relaxed in the Cali and take the journey steady enjoying the view from the higher driving position. In fact the higher driving position actually helps quicker driving as you have better view over hedges and at traffic in front as you look over everyone else's roof!

I would personally stay with 150 and get the Cali as quick as possible. At the end of the day if you really think you wanted more power have it chipped!

 

[Hotel California]

Having done 40.000km in my 2012 140bhp DSG ( comparable with the 150 ) i got no feeling driving a slow verhicle at all not even in the Alpes ....we are travelling two and a dog . If four people and bikerack,roofload need to be carried it could be diffrent but it is a lesiure verhicle not a sportscar.

Welcome btw on your first post!

 

[Days out]

Agree with HC. It's not a sports car at the end of the day but it's genuinely not underpowered. I think if you were just about to put your order in and could afford the 204 then I would have said go for it. But the risk of not getting the van before the tax changes would swing it with me to stick to 150 horses.

 

[Teejay]

Not sure this is going to be of help, but we tested the 204ps over several days and have ordered it. One of our reasons is that it's going to be the only family vehicle and used daily. We felt that 204x4 was going to give us the best flexibility. I'm pretty sure that if this was to be a second or third car it would have been 150ps 2wd.

 

[bigmac77]

We have the 140ps model T5 and we do load it up with full water tank, 4 people, bike rack with 4 bikes, loads of camping stuff and food and we find it perfectly fine. This summer we went on a 2000 mile trip to France and back and we find It is in no way underpowered. We cruised at over 130km/h on the toll roads no problem.

I second @Days out comments, our other vehicle is 3 litre 310bhp, if I want to go fast I drive that, a bigger engine in the Cali would not alter how I drive it. It is a campervan and I drive it in a relaxed way.

It's your choice though if you feel that you will always be wishing you had the 204 then just buy it you only live once.

 

[MattBW]

I personally think you will be fine, I find the 114 fine and very rarely crave more power.

Ok sometimes I do wish I had the 140 for getting on at slip roads but it is after all a van not a sports car and a relaxing driving experience is what its all about for me. If you are the kind of driver who likes to "make progress" on the road, then maybe you would wish for the 204 instead but I think from my experience of the 114 that 150 would be very good?

I came from a 210bhp car, so the difference was pretty big but it was never painful.

Once my warranty has ran out I might consider chipping mine which will reportedly go upto 148.

 

[Stolly]

My order (a week 48 build date touch wood) was for a 150 too, although I've gone for the 4motion option as we live quite high in the Yorkshire Dales (3 Peaks country) and can get a fair smattering of snow each winter, with our main road not especially a high priority when it comes to snow ploughing and gritting. I'm quite happy with the power and don't expect to be hammering it on any journeys in our Cali when it comes anyway

 

[WelshGas]

I have been on this forum for a few months and found it to be a goldmine of useful information and advice. Right now I am on the horns of a dilemma, so my first post is a request for opinions from more learned, wiser and experienced owners.

I have an Ocean 150 DSG on order with a current provisional production date of Week 47. When I placed the order I was wearing my sensible head and opted for the 150 rather than the 204. The logic being that the power was sufficient, running costs were lower and long term reliability was likely to be better than the more complex biturbo version. I was also influenced by reviews (MMM, Camper Van Magazine, What Motorhome and AutoExpress) which suggested (at the risk of offending 204 owners) that the 150 was smoother to drive and the better overall option. I concluded that as it will only used by my wife and myself, with no plans to load it with lots of extra 'stuff' on our travels and without the extra weight of 4motion hardware the 150 was the solution for me.

Since placing the order, my heart has kept nagging at me that I should have gone for the greater power of the 204. Currently I can still amend the order, but the advice from the dealer on delivery time is that the impact will be unknown and I am very keen to avoid the delivery date slipping to April and into the clutches of the anticipated new VED costs.

I don't believe that short test drives in unloaded demonstrators will really answer the question as to whether the power of the 204 is truly needed. So I am seeking advice from existing owners on the capabilities of the 150 based on their real world day to day and touring experience. I note that many 204 owners have also opted for 4motion and wonder if, apart from the obvious benefits in snow and mud etc, a factor in their choice was the need to offset any tendency of the 204 to lose traction due to its greater power.

I also look for advice on the impact on delivery times from anyone who has amended their order. I appreciate that each case will be different in complexity and impact, but it might help me to form a view on the risk of an amendment from 150 to 204 resulting in delivery of my eagerly awaited California slipping into April or even beyond.

There is no real reason for changing your order as the various comments above illustrate, BUT you have to be happy with your choice. Are you going to be punishing yourself everytime you change down a gear on a hill, " If only I'd bought the ******** ". That would take some of the enjoyment out of it. This has to be balanced against a delay in delivery, possibly.
If you are going to sell it on in 3 yrs or so then it doesn't really matter, but if it is going to be a long term keeper then ? heart over head?
Oh and

 

[Broch Hunter]

Many thanks for all the comments and opinions expressed, they have been extremely useful. I conclude that my original 'sensible head' reasoning was correct and the 150 will comfortably meet my needs.

Plus, after further discussions today it appears highly unlikely that the dealer/VW will be able to give me a reasonably confident assurance that an order amendment to 204 made this week will still result in delivery and registration prior to 1 April.

So decision confirmed, my California will be a 150, provisionally named as iVan.

Thanks again to all for your input.

BH

 

[Swissian]

A bit late to the party I know, but I have a 150 Ocean and I've done around 12000km in Switzerland, Germany, Austria and surrounding countries. Not exactly flat terrain
I can honestly say that the 150 performs amazingly, from joining German motorways at +130kmh to climbing 1600m or more up mountains passes. It is so smooth and has plenty of acceleration for an almost 3 ton vehicle.

 

[Broch Hunter]

A bit late to the party I know, but I have a 150 Ocean and I've done around 12000km in Switzerland, Germany, Austria and surrounding countries. Not exactly flat terrain
I can honestly say that the 150 performs amazingly, from joining German motorways at +130kmh to climbing 1600m or more up mountains passes. It is so smooth and has plenty of acceleration for an almost 3 ton vehicle.

that makes me feel even happier

 

[Vincent123]

When we were purchasing our Cali, I was in the camp of this being a one off purchase of a lifetime and I honestly didn't even consider anything less than the 204bhp engine.
Having never previously driven a 3 tonne van - only capable saloon cars, I found myself learning to drive in a different way.
The engine has effortless power and I have found it really useful when you occasionally find yourself forced in to the outside lane of a busy motorway. A blip of the throttle and you are wafted away and back in to the comfort of the inside lane before you know it. The DSG box is a constant pleasure and I considered lots of torque to get the 3 tonne mass moving and through the gears a must.
Sorry to turn your head but better to make your decisions now than years of if only...

 

[Mickm]

I have a 180 DSG T5.1 but, having nearly got stuck a couple of times on wet campsites, I regretted not buying 4 motion. It has plenty of power and can cruise at 130kph on the French autoroutes effortlessly all day. However, I am picking up my red T7 204 DSG 4 motion on Thursday! 5 more sleeps!

 

[daveyboydanger]

I have a 180 DSG T5.1 but, having nearly got stuck a couple of times on wet campsites, I regretted not buying 4 motion. It has plenty of power and can cruise at 130kph on the French autoroutes effortlessly all day. However, I am picking up my red T7 204 DSG 4 motion on Thursday! 5 more sleeps!

T7? You lucky devil!

 

[shudycamps]

I have been on this forum for a few months and found it to be a goldmine of useful information and advice. Right now I am on the horns of a dilemma, so my first post is a request for opinions from more learned, wiser and experienced owners.

I have an Ocean 150 DSG on order with a current provisional production date of Week 47. When I placed the order I was wearing my sensible head and opted for the 150 rather than the 204. The logic being that the power was sufficient, running costs were lower and long term reliability was likely to be better than the more complex biturbo version. I was also influenced by reviews (MMM, Camper Van Magazine, What Motorhome and AutoExpress) which suggested (at the risk of offending 204 owners) that the 150 was smoother to drive and the better overall option. I concluded that as it will only used by my wife and myself, with no plans to load it with lots of extra 'stuff' on our travels and without the extra weight of 4motion hardware the 150 was the solution for me.

Since placing the order, my heart has kept nagging at me that I should have gone for the greater power of the 204. Currently I can still amend the order, but the advice from the dealer on delivery time is that the impact will be unknown and I am very keen to avoid the delivery date slipping to April and into the clutches of the anticipated new VED costs.

I don't believe that short test drives in unloaded demonstrators will really answer the question as to whether the power of the 204 is truly needed. So I am seeking advice from existing owners on the capabilities of the 150 based on their real world day to day and touring experience. I note that many 204 owners have also opted for 4motion and wonder if, apart from the obvious benefits in snow and mud etc, a factor in their choice was the need to offset any tendency of the 204 to lose traction due to its greater power.

I also look for advice on the impact on delivery times from anyone who has amended their order. I appreciate that each case will be different in complexity and impact, but it might help me to form a view on the risk of an amendment from 150 to 204 resulting in delivery of my eagerly awaited California slipping into April or even beyond.

It's a man thing with power in my opinion. We have the Cali with 180 and it's loaded to capacity a'comin and a'goin. Sometimes the husband grunts we could do with more power going up steeper hills, but Zulicampi just keeps on trucking.

 

[Dominiek]

I had a test in both. I feel that the difference is there above 80 km/h. Speeding up from 80 to 120 is going faster in the 204 bhp. Below 80 km/h the 150 bhp manages well. The torque is there almost from 1000 rpm also on the 150 bhp. This engine is probebly the best more senseble choise. Never the less i went for the 204 because of the 4motion. The 150 is no boring car and copes verry well.

 

[Del Boy]

You don't order a new van every day! Making the right choices is most important, clearly there is some doubt already. We have a 204 with 4 motion , just back from a trip around Europe last week and got to use some extra power on the autobahn, with 4motion useful in the snow in the alps .
All worked well and van drove a treat , only gripe is with the suspension, even with heavy duty anti roll bars . Too much roll on the corners !

 

[Loz]

T7? You lucky devil!

I think he meant a T6 MY17