Side window security warning!!

[Bluestone]

Hi all

Just got back from an awesome trip which covered nearly 4000 miles - all the way down to Greece via Italy (sleep on board the ferry from Bari to Igoumenitsa) and back through Albania, Montenegro, Croatia, Bosnia & Herzegovina, Solvenia, Austria, Germany, Luxembourg, Belgium then finally France again to catch the ferry.

The California SE 180 4Motion performed perfectly through all the little up and down coast roads on the way back, and on some 'rough' roads in Greece, it was actually a pleasure to drive all that way

Overall I was very impressed with the Cali, however, there were a couple of bad points which really did put me off

Firstly in Italy we left the van for less than 5 mins and someone broke in through the side window - it was disappointing as it was so easy for them to literally pop it out!! It looks like they used a screwdriver to prize open a little and then pushed it all the way out - I think what was even worse from a design point of view was that we managed to pop it back in and it still worked (albeit with a small gap). It might well have been a plastic film it offered so little protection against a break in! Surely in this day and age VW must come up with a better solution for the side windows in such an expensive vehicle - these side windows are like the sliding windows from my old series 3 Landy!

Of course the stuff that got stolen is only material and can easily be replaced - but this was on day 2 of the trip and I never really felt safe - we didn't want to leave the Cali anywhere and explore. However, I will say that in Greece we felt totally safe - I even took a little inflatable boat (Honwave so not cheap) and left it on the beech in Greece (thank you Greece for being so friendly and safe )

The other thing is also related to the side windows - it's the screens - completely useless!! Don't fit very well, have gaps that allowed mozzies though (isn't that the point of the screen?!?!?), and a general pain in the backside.

Also in hot weather where there are a lot of mozzies, it's impossible to keep them out as at least the side door will be open at some point. Yes I'm sure there are solutions etc etc, but when spending this sort of money I want the solutions built in from VW. It seems that none of this was thought about by VW.

Well it's listed as I'm 'looking to buy' well sadly after this trip (I rented one), I am no longer looking to buy, there were too many small things which were at fault for the money the SE costs. For me I'm very glad I rented for this trip rather than buying one this year. When VW address all the little faults then I'll look to buy again.

Sometimes I feel (such as my love of Land Rovers) that people love the concept so much they are prepared to overlook all the issues like this (I see so many threads about stuff that doesn't work on them), for me personally, when spending that sort of money, the VW California SE isn't quite good enough - actually the side window issue alone has put me off

So one final note: Please be aware of the security issue with the side windows - they obviously knew how to get in very quickly (the alarm was of course useless as by the time I got back they were gone along with a bag full of goodies). Don't get me wrong I love the whole VW Camper thing and would hate to see other owners suffer the same fate.

I will be writing to VW to inform them of their side window issue as well, so maybe in the future a new side window will be fitted that can't be opened in less than 30 seconds with a simple screwdriver!! Then I'm all in again

 

[Skylark2.0]

Hi all

Just got back from an awesome trip which covered nearly 4000 miles - all the way down to Greece via Italy (sleep on board the ferry from Bari to Igoumenitsa) and back through Albania, Montenegro, Croatia, Bosnia & Herzegovina, Solvenia, Austria, Germany, Luxembourg, Belgium then finally France again to catch the ferry.

The California SE 180 4Motion performed perfectly through all the little up and down coast roads on the way back, and on some 'rough' roads in Greece, it was actually a pleasure to drive all that way

Overall I was very impressed with the Cali, however, there were a couple of bad points which really did put me off

Firstly in Italy we left the van for less than 5 mins and someone broke in through the side window - it was disappointing as it was so easy for them to literally pop it out!! It looks like they used a screwdriver to prize open a little and then pushed it all the way out - I think what was even worse from a design point of view was that we managed to pop it back in and it still worked (albeit with a small gap). It might well have been a plastic film it offered so little protection against a break in! Surely in this day and age VW must come up with a better solution for the side windows in such an expensive vehicle - these side windows are like the sliding windows from my old series 3 Landy!

Of course the stuff that got stolen is only material and can easily be replaced - but this was on day 2 of the trip and I never really felt safe - we didn't want to leave the Cali anywhere and explore. However, I will say that in Greece we felt totally safe - I even took a little inflatable boat (Honwave so not cheap) and left it on the beech in Greece (thank you Greece for being so friendly and safe )

The other thing is also related to the side windows - it's the screens - completely useless!! Don't fit very well, have gaps that allowed mozzies though (isn't that the point of the screen?!?!?), and a general pain in the backside.

Also in hot weather where there are a lot of mozzies, it's impossible to keep them out as at least the side door will be open at some point. Yes I'm sure there are solutions etc etc, but when spending this sort of money I want the solutions built in from VW. It seems that none of this was thought about by VW.

Well it's listed as I'm 'looking to buy' well sadly after this trip (I rented one), I am no longer looking to buy, there were too many small things which were at fault for the money the SE costs. For me I'm very glad I rented for this trip rather than buying one this year. When VW address all the little faults then I'll look to buy again.

Sometimes I feel (such as my love of Land Rovers) that people love the concept so much they are prepared to overlook all the issues like this (I see so many threads about stuff that doesn't work on them), for me personally, when spending that sort of money, the VW California SE isn't quite good enough - actually the side window issue alone has put me off

So one final note: Please be aware of the security issue with the side windows - they obviously knew how to get in very quickly (the alarm was of course useless as by the time I got back they were gone along with a bag full of goodies). Don't get me wrong I love the whole VW Camper thing and would hate to see other owners suffer the same fate.

I will be writing to VW to inform them of their side window issue as well, so maybe in the future a new side window will be fitted that can't be opened in less than 30 seconds with a simple screwdriver!! Then I'm all in again

The thing with a VW Cali is that they have most of the big things right unlike so many of the conversions.

Not impressed with the side window issue but I'm sure others have worse issues. Keep valuables on you at all times.

 

[Bluestone]

Hi Skylark, no real valuables were stolen, as we had them with us, didn't stop them 'having a look' though, and they stole a bag with more sentimental items rather than material valuable items.

And to be fair it was a great trip in a great vehicle - I would never consider a conversion for many reasons.

I think VW need to sort the side window thing out as it will only get worse as more petty thieves work out just how easy it is to get in them. Real shame, but I still think they are great It just munched the miles and was a real pleasure to drive, camp, and use

Here's a nice photo of camping in Parga, Greece (a gem of a camp site that people should visit if they get that far )

 

[WelshGas]

1. The screens for the side windows are FLY screens, not mosquito screens. You need a much finer screen mesh for mozzies.
2. As far as the side windows and security. Glass hammer is all you need. The same on ALL vehicles. Not confined to Californias.
3. To keep mosses out then you need full mossy screens for all open windows and side door etc: or use a natural Mozzie repellent within the vehicle.
And don't get me going on Land Rover security.!!!

 

[Alan]

Hi blue stone,
Really sorry for your bad experience with the sliding window issue.
Things like this happening can be worrying,especially if the van is going to be parked up for a length of time
These sliding windows are easily left slightly opened as I have experienced
(Not sujesting you did)
At the end of the day the window can just as easily be smashed if the thieves aren't worried about the alarm going off

Alan

 

[Hotel California]

Every car has his min- points .
The sliding window is indeed the best place to get in the Cali without a key ,
My dealer even told me that afther asking him what to do afther a possible lock out with the key inside , also a min- point on the Cali , he told me to force the sliding window instead breaking a side window...
For lock out with key in the Cali i got myself a much better soltion in the meantime...tipt by a fellow Cali owner here in Belgium.

Try and rent a big white camper , they are even more easyer to break in and effective do get more break in than campervans they got plastik windows and top ventilation and due to the fact in the big whiteones most got tv,and much more electric divices to steal and that is what most burglers in southern (read : poorer ) contries in europe are afther .
Phones,tablets,tv,....

Anyway , good for you that you rented one first , sad those things happend .
We did not ever had to deal with any kind of break in on any of my cars , and hopefully we won't have to deal with it , maybe i wil aslo talk diffrent then.

Edit : as Paul said LR are even easyer the break in .....just a tin-can opener will do
Owend a Def 90 for 10 years....

 

[Bluestone]

Hi guys

No the windows were tightly shut as it was a 5 min coffee stop on route

Welshgas, the side screens are still useless - they are ill fitting and I expected better from a £58K vehicle

Plus it is not the same on all vehicles as side window entry is pathetically easy - yes it is easy to smash a window (which I wish they had done as it wouldn't have left all the screwdriver marks of the inside of the window), but my point is the use of a 40 year old design on a modern vehicle, but as I wrote in my original text, it would appear that the love for California's seems to dismiss anything negative said about them, shame really as I said I love them, but wanted people to be aware of the problem.

I guess spending nearly £60K on a simple Camper such as this I expected more - perhaps the love of the Cali has lead to the demand and price - not too sure many others would except such poor design on such an expensive vehicle

When VW address this issue I'll be first on the list, and then if a window gets smashed with a hammer then it will be the same as any other vehicle.

Can I just add that there were NO valuables on display, yes there was a bag in the back, but it had NO valuables in it and it was open to display this, I sincerely doubt whether any other vehicle would've had the window smashed for this alone. Stuff was all over the place and they clearly had time to look around (despite the alarm going off), as Alan said, no one takes any notice of alarms, but people can take notice of smashing glass - this is so much worse as it's silent entry - as I said NOT the same as smashing a window!!!

 

[GrannyJen]

I agree with Bluestone, it is a crap design and sadly one that is common to many campers, caravans and motorhomes.

The thing can bristle with the latest tech anti theft devices but still have a vulnerable window entry point. Nearly every conversion that I have seen offers the same easy entry, my caravans - well, as Wim said, leave the keys inside or lose a key and easy, just open a window, no special tools or hammers needed if you know how.

Of course the vehicle is alarmed but then if the thief is unconcerned, just wants to make a quick snatch and off, then go ahead.

 

[Meoncoast]

Any scum back can get into any car and any van quickly as others have said and if you have a camper a home on wheels odds on there is going to be a few itmems of high value on board even if not on display.
Given the thousands of this type of window out there invent a lock and go on dragons den but I bet it would not sale. Over the years I have 2 cars broken into one by smashing the passenger window the other with a screw driver. Both cars alarmed.

 

[Hotel California]

Hi guys

No the windows were tightly shut as it was a 5 min coffee stop on route!!

Bluestone , do you got any pictures of the place they broke in and the visuale damage it left ?

This could help us Cali owners to keep an eye out and try to find a solution on how to prevent this on our Cali's
Would much appriciate sharing these pic's with us .
If not here then thru a PM.

Many thankx

 

[WelshGas]

Well I must have different fly screens then.

 

[Les]

So did they climb through the window to ransack the interior?

 

[Hotel California]

So did they climb through the window to ransack the interior?

No need to climb the window,
Once the sliding window is open you can reach the door latch on the inside....

 

[Alan]

I thought the fly screens were tricky to fit at first,but in the end managed to suss out the technic in fitting them,although hadn't had the need to for a couple of years, as Welshgas stated you still have to cover the sliding door when open
Thinking of visiting Scotland later in the year,.... might look on EBay for a space suit

 

[mordav]

Doesn't the dead lock stop the doors opening if locked with the key remote?

 

[Ajspicer]

Shame to be put off by such a small element of a vehicle that must be made up of so many thousands of parts.

Simple solution, don't have opening side windows, just have fixed glass. Plenty of other opening areas to keep a breeze blowing through when it's warm.

 

[WelshGas]

So, someone Disagree's with a post but do not have the courtesy to explain why!
If fitted correctly the fly screens fit without any gaps. They are just flyscreens and will not keep out anything smaller.

 

[motacyclist]

Doesn't the dead lock stop the doors opening if locked with the key remote?

Just checked this on our works Sportline, you cannot unlock the sliding door if the vehicle is locked with the key fob, it IS deadlocked.

I'll check the Cali when I get home ...

 

[Hotel California]

All that like, disagree ,....i just ignore it as most do not gives any contribution to the actual topic.

 

[GrannyJen]

Just checked this on our works Sportline, you cannot unlock the sliding door if the vehicle is locked with the key fob, it IS deadlocked.

I'll check the Cali when I get home ...

That's why you get the warning overtime you switch off the vehicle.

The opportunity is for smash and grab, not much more.

Bad enough. I pulled on to a services once, got out to meet someone, walked 50 yards to the hotel entrance, went in ... looked around .... came out and there was no side window in my Range Rover and my laptop had gone, in seconds.

 

[Bluestone]

No need to climb the window,
Once the sliding window is open you can reach the door latch on the inside....

It was really odd as yes they did go through the window and ransack the inside - it was weird as they went in and out through the window!!

 

[Bluestone]

Also, yes sorry I was a little angry about the break in and other little issues - sorry I didn't mean to offend anyone or be angry to anyone here (WelshGas ) but I still think the fly screens a relatively poor design - maybe I was getting it wrong, but the one in the sliding door kept coming out every time the door was opened, and the other one was almost impossible to put in by one person - it needed another person outside to help!

Also don't get me wrong - I love the Cali and think it is an awesome vehicle - however, I feel that if we all pull together as a community perhaps we can get VW to make changes to make it perfect for future releases of the vehicle.

I think one suggestion was to delete the sliding window - maybe something is needed for really good ventilation when cooking, but I'm sure they could fit a sliding (within itself) window that was electric and had the fly screen built in? OK sure a hammer will still get through, but as many people have pointed out this is the same for all vehicles so no one could have any complaints about a 'weak' point in the Cali

 

[motacyclist]

OK just got home and can confirm the Cali is deadlocked so they have to climb in through the window.

There are two solutions:-

1. Make sure everything you carry is too big to fit through the window
or
2. Prevent the window opening by dropping a metal rod into the channel as shown in the picture



Leave the cut end fairly sharp so that it grips the plastic at the end of the channel, if you file it smooth then it could slip out of the channel.

Do the same the other side.

The exact length to cut to is 438mm, this is a little longer than the visible channel as a small section slips under the window.

To remove the rod just use a fingernail or something.

Obviously a determined thief will still get in but it will slow them down.

(Or maybe we should just make it easy and leave the window open so they don't damage the van .....)

 

[GrannyJen]

Goodness!

I would rather just take my chances.

If I wanted all that security then I would hire an armoured vehicle from Brinks Mat. I go away to relax, not fret myself stupid and quite honestly if it can't be insured then don't take it.

 

[Bluestone]

Motorcyclist, they actually pushed and removed the window completely - we found a hole where the window once was and the window itself in the van - trust me, they are very easy to push out of the channels - which is why I think it's such a poor design - it was also pretty easy to fit back again with a screwdriver!