Too Big, Too Small

[calibusje]

May I ask what “real camping” is please? That shouts “tent” to me.

I didn't think this needed an explanation as we're not talking about a tent here at all. You can decide for yourself what real camping is with a California

 

[SpuffingtonMe]

I don’t have any experience of the GC but have had three motorhomes, ranging from 6.4m through to 9m long and 3.5-6.5t heavy. The largest of those I travelled the length and breadth of the U.K., NC500, S France and Austrian Alps with zero issues and very few places I was desperate to go and couldn’t get to. I rarely used campsites, was totally self-sufficient and rarely stayed in one place more than a night or two.

The only reason I sold the last Motorhome was the lack of time I spent using it recently versus time & money spent on maintenance as the thing got older (a 2005 van I’d had for 4yrs from 2017).

I‘ve now had my Cali Ocean for 4months and genuinely loving the ownership proposition in terms of balancing the ability to get away on an impromptu basis and have it as a daily driver but it’s also just as much of a compromise as the motorhomes were. There are very few of the places I went to in the motorhomes which I would genuinely seek to revisit, primarily due to the lack of on board facilities. I also find it a faff with any more than just me to make up beds and get things sorted, especially in inclement weather. Having head height, space to move, lots of storage makes life so much easier.

All that said, for the moment the Cali is perfect for my needs. I can see us in future buying another Motorhome when funds allow, but running it alongside the Cali to offset the compromises of both. I realise that’s a huge luxury but I find the two vehicles very difficult to accurately compare as they’re so different from eachother and offer very different things.

If you think you want/need onboard facilities, pre-made bed, more comfort in terms of insulation, heating etc then you probably do and will enjoy it.

One thing I wanted to comment on was that just because motorhomes are bigger, I want to dispel the myth that is frequently peddled on here that somehow your life would be so much more restricted and almost impossible to tour. That is simply not true unless you’re trapsing across a dirt track with huge overhanging trees or frequently parking up in height restricted areas (of which I very rarely have come across where I’d wanted to stop).

I’m not anti Cali but there is some very strong anti Motorhome sentiment on here which I think needs rebalancing.

 

[calibusje]

Touchy much? Was I responding to you? Someone has sensitivity issues

At the time of your reaction, there were few so yes, you also responded at mine.
Touchy? Me?
You refer to the fact that people are not allowed to have a different opinion because of -amongst- me and this is not the case, hence my response.
But it's a beautiful day today and Father's Day here in Belgium and this afternoon passes the ‘Elfstedenronde’ (cycling race) where I live and I am enjoying the day and will continue to do so. You try to enjoy yours. Bye

 

[The Yorkshireman]

Not sure if this is the right place to post but here goes,
We have been the proud owner of a T6.1 Ocean for about 8 months and have "Loved" every second of the experience.
The ease of driving, the split colour and digital dash makes her a real honour to own.

We have made the decision ( We think ) to move on up to the Grand California 600 , looks like it will fit the need for that extra bit of space without loosing too much of that pack up and go ultimate drive.
Not ready yet to do motorhome sit in a field , we want to explore the Europe and the UK.

Just having to join the que to make the change as have sourced an ex demo but will not be released until December 2022
What are your experiences if you have made the change , do you regret or are you in love

Now look what you’ve started

 

[itsSteve]

A fixed bed has always been important for us, and a loo offering both easy access and privacy. We like to wild camp on our way to European campsites, have enough space to bring a few cases of wine home, the potential to sleep four people if necessary and the wherewithal to transport furniture and to take sacks of garden waste to the tip. We have a second vehicle so the 'van is not needed day to day. No surprise then, that we are about to replace our Ducato with a GC 600. A Cali doesn't tick our boxes, but it will tick other people's. I only offer two pieces of advice to prospective motorhomers; try before you buy if you can, borrow or hire a vehicle, and then get the biggest inside and the smallest outside that works for you

 

[calibusje]

I’m not anti Cali but there is some very strong anti Motorhome sentiment on here which I think needs rebalancing.

well, you try it on a forum with generally fans of a california and which most of them make this choice well-considered. This is not a motorhome, although you can camp with it perfectly. We've been doing it for over 10 years.
It therefore seems a bit bizarre, your reaction; a bit like complaining to the environment forum that they are not so positive about large diesel engines versus electric. You have to make choices and learn to deal with their consequences and understand why others do not follow you.

 

[Holidaymaker]

I am have before Califorina and now i am Grand Califorina.

Is 1 solution only can make you pleasure:-

You are must have 1 California and also must have 1 Grand California.

California = instant go away car, can also be utilise go supermarket and takes childrens to schoolings, easy parkings every place - same than regular passat station wagon size and easy drivings.
California such quiet pleasure driving also.

Grand California only convenience and easy is ready always bed.

Is better for go many month touring to europe and something short middle betweeens.

Of course, you have quick to go toilet and shower washings.
Winter time Vw is not tells to you - is have automatic water dispose and so must keeping inside warm always and must fit Dometic winter warm kit for boiler - vw not gives you this equipment.

Take much inconvenience you must each time make water tank full use winter.

Living area very little when is table up.
Most 1 wunderbar Grand California is bed ready all times can rest and sleepings immediately.

Grand California terrible drivings experience - is very slow make early movings and bad noises from motor - is very heavy near 7m long machine and is Vw polo can having more powerful motor.

1 time i must stop red light steep mounitain hill. when is green light arrives, Grand California makes big difficult going again - car back to me think i am broken car and is honkings hooters to me go faster, but is Grand California too much heavy. Car such size high long and heavy than Grand California is better haves 5L motor and not 2L.

When is go around corner - if you know french car Citroen 2CV - Grand California look same - we feeling will going fall down side when is go road roundings!.

Is bad combination and not pleasure comes driving such long high bus and mini car motor. Must be make loud radio not hearings noise!.

You coming big bad surprise when is driving not mirror glass road. Grand California is talkings and shoutings to you - every cupboards doors bang bang bang together and makes to you Grand California own music - I am now this normal sound familiar!. Is very noise make machine, regular California is super quiet.

This my me experience, and is Grand California is not give convenient ( like is regular California everything easy) and is not gives to you space and luxury you can experience nice motorhome.
You must see soon is big Compromise.

Grand California take much pleasure aways and only give back is only bed always ready - may this be perfect to you also?

For some peoples bed always ready is all such peoples require super holiday, For some peoples is needing more than is only bed ready - for such peoples Grand California can be bad choice.

I am keep my Grand California and is soon buy also another regular California make covenient and easy drivings daytimes.

Vw has make big outside car and little inside place.

Opposite direction to you great british designer Alec Issigonis - he make very amaze little mini car and maximum place inside - i can be hear he laughing very loud Vw Grand California!. -)))

 

[Holidaymaker]

A fixed bed has always been important for us, and a loo offering both easy access and privacy. We like to wild camp on our way to European campsites, have enough space to bring a few cases of wine home, the potential to sleep four people if necessary and the wherewithal to transport furniture and to take sacks of garden waste to the tip. We have a second vehicle so the 'van is not needed day to day. No surprise then, that we are about to replace our Ducato with a GC 600. A Cali doesn't tick our boxes, but it will tick other people's. I only offer two pieces of advice to prospective motorhomers; try before you buy if you can, borrow or hire a vehicle, and then get the biggest inside and the smallest outside that works for you

Is must be you having very small furnitures transport - such than can be find nice children doll house size!.
Grand California very tiny inside - toilet shower kitchen makes miniture corridor walk to bed only. I am souvenire holiday - black and blue bruise come home each time make journey my Gc!.

 

[Holidaymaker]

I don't own a GC but I have made the transition to another, larger vehicle.

I was dreading some aspects which have proved to be illusory fears.

Being wider, longer and higher was going to restrict where I go, and my Cali took me everywhere, off road, off grid and definitely narrow. Well, my fear that would all go has not proved correct. I'm having a ball currently exploring places and so far have not been handicapped by size once. I just spend more time planning.

The toilet area is not a waste of space. It's somewhere to keep my rubbish bag, my laundry bag, my wash bag and what would have been an ugly and cumbersome porta-potti sliding around the lounge area. When not a wash room thanks to a convenient drop-down rail its also a highly effective drying room, much needed in my last trip cycling through a mendip monsoon.

You say exact true - toilet area. I am agree!

I am use toilet place keeping MicroOven when is travel. I am can close door and is keep oven toilet floor safe for movings times.
Toilet is big cupboard safe and good usings!.

 

[GrannyJen]

Now look what you’ve started

It's not yet remotely reached the intensity of "Beach v SE" debates.

 

[The Yorkshireman]

well, you try it on a forum with generally fans of a california and which most of them make this choice well-considered. This is not a motorhome, although you can camp with it perfectly. We've been doing it for over 10 years.
It therefore seems a bit bizarre, your reaction; a bit like complaining to the environment forum that they are not so positive about large diesel engines versus electric). You have to make choices and learn to deal with their consequences and understand why others do not follow you.

Just filled up from Morris £116.98 perhaps we should have stuck with the TENT for CAMPING in!!

You go for it Holidaymaker

 

[calibusje]

So funny reading the comments of those who've never owned one

I've owned several Transporter vans in various guises, with and without pop top roof, and 3 other motorhomes too, and now a GC.

I'll say it how it is, as of course there are pro's as well as cons.

They won't suit everyone, they aren't nearly as easy to drive in tight lanes and there will be some parking sports you can't get in to. The lounge area when at max capacity is bigger in a standard Cali/transporter.

However, an on-board bathroom is a must for me, and my two girls, I really don't like the condition of most 'shower blocks' plus we can stop anywhere anytime and of course go to the loo in the night.

Driving the GC is a real pleasure and although we have the 600, can park in just about any space. It isn't too much wider than a cali, although you have to pay attention to low bridges and in Europe roads can have low barriers on them.

The driving range is poor at around 400/450 miles as it only has a 75 litre tank.

You can jump into bed at any time, and the extra storage space is not to be missed, as it has a very large capacity compared to a standard cali, which always frustrated me packing everything away just to move. In the GC if it's raining or you're lazy you can literally just throw everything into the garage.

The LPG storage is huge and you could go weeks before refilling.

The standing height is a real boon too whether you've just pulled over or have parked up, it's instantly there.

Finally, we moved away from a pop-top as we like to travel around and when it's 20 degrees in the day in Spain late in the year, it can be 5 overnight and it was just too cold to use. Not so with the GC.

They'll be plenty of people who'll tell you, you don't need a bathroom and what they own is better, but only you can decide what's right for you.

Unfortunately most people argue a debate from their perspective, and will post laughing emojis or try negate your point if you disagree with them, because god forbid anyone should have a different point of view, but their life could be vastly different to yours. They could be single, a couple, retired, have pets with them, a family of 6 etc. etc. No two situations are the same and no two vans suit the same people.

So, you react as you see and experience it? Well, this is certainly possible and o.k. but… others are not allowed to do this? And presents all reactions that differ from yours as negative in advance.
“Unfortunately most people argue a debate from their perspective, and will post laughing emojis or try negate your point if you disagree with them, because god forbid anyone should have a different point of view, but their life could be vastly different to yours.”, you wrote.
Rather pathetic (sorry, English isn't my native language so maybe there is a better, more nuanced word for pathetic).

 

[Keith Smith]

Can I ask anyone with a GC600 where they store the larger kitchen paraphernalia like plates, pans and kettle? We’ve just been looking at one and there looked to be lots of small item storage but less room for the bigger stuff that we would want to have easy access to.

 

[BeeBee]

Wow, I’ve learned lots from this thread. What some options have and others don’t have. We’ve had our Ocean just over 3 years now and we did ‘loads’ of research and looking before buying, including joining this forum. I’ve often ogled at others vans when pitched up and I’m sure there’s always something else one of them has that ours doesn’t, but it’s what the ‘best fit for you’ comes down to and that can change over time too. But as auld man Jagger sings “you can’t always get what you want, but if you try sometimes, you may just find you get what you need”
Happy camping, it’s what we do x

 

[andyinluton]

Ridge Monkey, collapsible gas kettle, small plates, bowls & pasta bowls ( which we tend to use instead of dinner plates) fit in the bottom under sink draw. Tea, coffee, mugs and glasses go in the top draw.

We leave the boards that block the underbed space at home & use a large plastic lidded box on the floor there - it takes the bigger saucepan, frying pan, electric kettle, electric toaster, coffee machine & dinner plates. It's restrained by a couple of bungee straps to eyelets in the floor rails. A couple of tea towels & the lid on top stops any rattles.

We have also removed the door off the underbed cupboard closest to the shower, that makes room for another couple of boxes that can easily be reached from inside the van we keep heavier food there tins of tuna etc. It also makes the big red on off switch a lot more accessible.

Eggs go in the first top locker over the bed, there's a lip on the shelf about egg height, a tray of 15 fits there perfectly with no risk of falling out, bread and other light food like bread biscuits etc gos in there as well.

The only thing we have to get out of the van for is the microwave, that sits on the floor in the rear under the shower outlet facing outwards, there's a 240v socket there. It means we can use it whilst the boot is fully loaded without having to get it out & put it on a table etc.

Ice creams & frozen jacket potatoes ( the only thing that our 12 year old decided she would eat at short notice, hence needing the microwave) go in the freezer.

We use the other six overbed lockers for clothes - they are not huge but we can fit eight towels in the rear one - I put in four & the wife put in another four in error. We put what we think we are going to need in the next day or two in there, with a further bag for more clothes in the boot.

Its taken a couple of trips to get the packing / loading nearly right. Our aim has been to be able to prepare food & drink for a quick stop without having to get out the van or unpack stuff, similarly for a single night stop the only thing we need to unpack from the boot area is the hookup cable, that lives inside one of the camping chairs mounted on the back doors.

With the huge amount of space available its tempting to take far too much.

 

[Keith Smith]

Andy thanks for the comprehensive reply, much appreciated. We possibly wouldn’t go for the overhead bed which would then give us a ton of unused space and we could end up a bit spoiled for choice of where to put things. It takes time to get sorted, this is our seventh year with a Cali and we are still re jigging storage.

 

[dominichayhoe]

So, you react as you see and experience it? Well, this is certainly possible and o.k. but… others are not allowed to do this? And presents all reactions that differ from yours as negative in advance.
“Unfortunately most people argue a debate from their perspective, and will post laughing emojis or try negate your point if you disagree with them, because god forbid anyone should have a different point of view, but their life could be vastly different to yours.”, you wrote.
Rather pathetic (sorry, English isn't my native language so maybe there is a better, more nuanced word for pathetic).

Yes that was exactly the point I was making.

 

[dominichayhoe]

Can I ask anyone with a GC600 where they store the larger kitchen paraphernalia like plates, pans and kettle? We’ve just been looking at one and there looked to be lots of small item storage but less room for the bigger stuff that we would want to have easy access to.

I use the collapsible pans and kettle, so easy to store anywhere.

 

[The Yorkshireman]

Andy thanks for the comprehensive reply, much appreciated. We possibly wouldn’t go for the overhead bed which would then give us a ton of unused space and we could end up a bit spoiled for choice of where to put things. It takes time to get sorted, this is our seventh year with a Cali and we are still re jigging storage.

Hi here’s our storage, as time goes on we might have to replate the van to 3.88.The kitchen draws are deep and take the plates, pots and pans. We have the overhead bed but use it for storage. IKEA boxes for cloths, grill and induction cooker. Kettles toaster in smaller boxes. Coats spare bedding in the rear locker, clothes in the central ones.
Good luck

 

[Keith Smith]

Thanks very much, it looks like we just have to be organised in a different way than with the Cali.I think we may hire one and have a late autumn trip to Scotland. The Cali is great when the weather is good or reasonable but once the dog gets wet my happiness dissipates rapidly. Not sure I’d use the shower but having somewhere to hang wet coats would be a real bonus and having a massive dog den under the bed would be priceless.

 

[calibusje]

Thanks very much, it looks like we just have to be organised in a different way than with the Cali.I think we may hire one and have a late autumn trip to Scotland. The Cali is great when the weather is good or reasonable but once the dog gets wet my happiness dissipates rapidly. Not sure I’d use the shower but having somewhere to hang wet coats would be a real bonus and having a massive dog den under the bed would be priceless.

Yes indeed, I also notice that it is mainly people who want to travel with their dog(s) in a California who find him unsuitable for that. So I guess a wet dog is not compatible with a cali Please note: I don’t make this up: read this several times. Hopefully I won't start a rounds of endless yes-no discussions with cali owners with a dog


Only joking of course
& I loooove dogs

 

[The Merle]

Thanks very much, it looks like we just have to be organised in a different way than with the Cali.I think we may hire one and have a late autumn trip to Scotland. The Cali is great when the weather is good or reasonable but once the dog gets wet my happiness dissipates rapidly. Not sure I’d use the shower but having somewhere to hang wet coats would be a real bonus and having a massive dog den under the bed would be priceless.

The two towel job and a kurgo seat cover that folds up is the trick. That’s what i did with my old Cali and still do that with joker.
Stand under tailgate, dry dog with first towel then wrap in 2nd towel and let them sit in kurgo or floor mats.

 

[Keith Smith]

The two towel job and a kurgo seat cover that folds up is the trick. That’s what i did with my old Cali and still do that with joker.
Stand under tailgate, dry dog with first towel then wrap in 2nd towel and let them sit in kurgo or floor mats.

We’ve obviously been far too soft with Jess, she wouldn’t tolerate being towelled dry in any effective sense and sits next to Mrs Smith on the back seat come what may. My excuse is she’s a rescue so we’ve had to spoil her but I think basically she’s smarter than me and life is just one big game for her.

 

[calibusje]

I found the opposite on van platforms I wanted. Almost all more expensive and ultra limited availability.

@Karlos and others: just for information, an advertising email I received today, not to demonstrate the pro and cons for converted small campervans; just some easy reading:

The Best Campervans for 2022 - Touring Magazine

Whether you want a quick weekend away, or a day by the beach, here’s Touring Magazine's pick of the best campervans available today.

touring.co.uk

 

[NeillyG]

Currently away for 18 nights. About 14 nights in. Previously had a camper king T5 lwb 4motion conversion.
We used to take the old van on occasional weekends and longer weekends and a couple of longer trips usually in France.
It’s just the two of us and 2 dogs.
Enjoyed the T5 but I think the reason we didn’t use it as much was because it was not that comfy. We slept up top and dogs slept downstairs. The rock and roll bed was fine but not that comfy and moving it all the time was a faff. I know from trips on a California T6 that they are much better when it comes to bed moving and front seat moving.
My T5 front seats were a nuisance to turn and the passenger double seat was not comfy for long journeys. Also on the LWB the space was great but you were very far apart.
The 4motion 177hp T5 was great and nothing stopped it snow or mud. In Scottish winters the up to sleeping could be ok the colder side.
The lwb was a good compromise i thoughts. Most places you could fit in you just stuck out a bit.
Anyway we decided that a bit more comfort would encourage more use. We had seen a bright green IH ducato based van once in Folkestone and had liked it just thought it seemed a lot of money.
We had bother with the engine on our T5 a couple of weeks before a summer holiday which requires a new engine and the bother with VW and the disinterest from camperking ended up with a rental T6 as vw could only offer us a panel van. Resulted in hours of calls to claim money back.
Enquired at vanworx but got nothing back. Enquired again and submitted enquiry but no reply. Too busy. Got some other quotes but ultimately from previous experience decided OEM route was safer. Bought 689 through drive the deal without ever seeing one. Big gamble.
Drive the deal. Big saver. Dealershit were exactly that. But a jaunt up the country with my dad was fun and got me used to the van and fuel stops hardly chipped into the £11k saving.
Having had the van almost a year we go away every second weekend for two nights and sometimes the other weekends. Get away for some 4-5 day trips and finally this summer trip to France.
We have used the 680 so much more than the T5 and that is down to comfort and usability. Especially in Scotland and the winter when you spend more time in the van. The toilet saves trips in the rain to a toilet block or nighttime pees in the dark and wet.
The crafter drives a lot better than the T5. The driving aids are brilliant.
Ok in narrow village streets it can be more of a challenge to manoeuvre and you need to be more aware of routes especially on sat nav.
The original mattress was a step up from the roof bed but the best thing we have done was get a proper mattress. Oh what a difference it makes. It might limit some functions with garage space but you make your call.
One of our dogs has a crate under the bed. The other sleeps on the back seats.
Other things I have learnt.
It might be 4 motion but it’s still a heavy beast and it’s not a match for the T5 4motion. Even with good year 4seasons I’ve had some issues though partly due to ground clearance.
I don’t think I would have gone for a 600
Purely for the sleeping issue as
We are both fairly tall.
Also the extra storage combined with the yescamper shelving is great. The T5 we had stuff everywhere and had to move it about for transit and then for comfort. Stuff fits away here great. I’m sure there are other vans that are better and I’ve had some minor issues but I do love it. This trip has really proven that.
That said I have been a bit unimpressed with the aircon. Not as effective as I would have imagined based on previously carting a stand alone unit to France in our T5 to battle 38 degree heat. This units all fine and that but not as effective as i would have imagined/ hoped. Still the other night with borderline heat stroke a couple of late night blasts helped. I was reluctant to get a white van. Wanted something bright. Must have been that green IH van I saw. I think the 680 in two tone looks longer like a coach and the grey looks great but wondered about France. Having been experiencing 34 degrees the last couple of days I am delighted to have a white van. Last van was a lovely dark metallic blue. Looked great. Got hot in the sun. I know I’m not away that much anywhere hot throughout the year but as I always kind of knew; there’s a reason when folk had white cars for decades in Europe and it wasn’t just the recent fashion.
Manouvering is ok with cameras etc but it is big. Pitches and spaces that were roomy with the lwb t5 are less so with the 680. Park assist is good. Used it a couple of times. There are some places it is just too big or high for the places you want to be I I tend to check sat nav or the likes first. An added hassle maybe.
As much as I like the wild camping thing my other half is not into it that much so we mainly use sites and I am fine with that. The toilet is still handy at night and in the rain.
For wild camping you probably need the sun to keep the fridge topped up for more than 36 hours if you’re not on the move.
There seems to be a fair bit of adapting that those more skill full than me have undertaken and in time I may try and add these things or get someone to do it.
Longwinded yes and sorry. Summary. For me the GC680 with some comfort and other tweaks has meant we go away much more often, we enjoy the stays more and could happily go on much longer trips in comfort. I would say from years of camping and canvas holiday tents and the T5, that the step up from transporter van to GC is like the step up from a big tent to and transporter. After all you can fit a tent in a bag and jump on public transport.