Used cali's

[thesquirrelpatrol]

To add to that you can't have it both ways ie expect these not to depreciate but want to buy a year old one for 30% off list.

Also given that I've priced the same spec as mine up in the t6 and it has a list price of over £47k makes it, I think, even more attract to someone debating a t5 vs a t6. That and the ad blue thing

 

[Gavinskii]

To add to that you can't have it both ways ie expect these not to depreciate but want to buy a year old one for 30% off list.

Also given that I've priced the same spec as mine up in the t6 and it has a list price of over £47k makes it, I think, even more attract to someone debating a t5 vs a t6. That and the ad blue thing

I tend to agree with this. Having played in the Motorhome market a few years back I noted that the medium age vehicles value certainly got lifted by the latest reincarnation in subsequent years.
Based on the pound tanking against the Euro since Brexit came on the radar, a stronger Euro will almost certainly push up UK list prices and firm up used prices if sustained.

 

[David Lapping]

We have been looking for over four months now and will always ask the seller if they will take an offer, I am surprised at the amount that do not even reply to me, I think many of the adverts are just on there hoping someone stupid will come along who has not done their research. I personally think the adverts should time out to combat this

 

[larrylamb]

I tend to agree with this. Having played in the Motorhome market a few years back I noted that the medium age vehicles value certainly got lifted by the latest reincarnation in subsequent years.
Based on the pound tanking against the Euro since Brexit came on the radar, a stronger Euro will almost certainly push up UK list prices and firm up used prices if sustained.

The large increase in road tax next year coupled with potential price increases may keep used prices buoyant. These babies new are only going upwards and so is the popularity/ demand.

 

[hirsty]

A very well specced T6 Beach I fancied was snapped-up yesterday at 10% off List + options = £40,700

Delivery miles only, new model pre-registered on a '16 plate, VW Dealership ...

 

[larrylamb]

A very well specced T6 Beach I fancied was snapped-up yesterday at 10% off List + options = £40,700

Delivery miles only, new model pre-registered on a '16 plate, VW Dealership ...

How long had the dealer had it? Discount for a showroom model this time of the year sounds about right.

 

[applejack]

I have just been looking at the Cali's for sale and some of the prices are truely laughable!

 

[Geezso]

I have just been looking at the Cali's for sale and some of the prices are truely laughable!

I disagree I'm afraid. Feel that the prices are well founded.

 

[hirsty]

I've kept an eye on things for a while, but got serious this last week when I provisionally sold my T5 conversion on Sunday. I've sent a dozen polite emails & made about five phone calls this week across the full span of oldest to newest used Beaches.

I drove to see a Dealer with a pre-registered delivery miles T5.1 - he looked at me like I was a Martian when I told him I was debating a well priced T5.1 versus a bit of a budget stretch for a T6 & did he have any room for manoeuvre on his price? Said he'd dropped it twice already!

Today I called a different Dealer out of the blue at 10.30AM about his T6 pre-reg'd demo - advertised with broadly same spec, same price, new model. He called me back at 1.30PM with 9-point-odd% off list, I paid the deposit over the phone & am collecting it tomorrow - everyone is happy.

I fully expect Dealer #1 will still have his demo he pre-registered last July till this July ...

 

[WelshGas]

I have just been looking at the Cali's for sale and some of the prices are truely laughable!

No more laughable than the Dealers price for a New vehicle.
Everyone on this Forum looking to purchase a New T6 or ex-demo T5.1 is expecting a discount of, it seems, at least 7-8% of list price or more. This makes everyone happy. The purchaser goes away with a smile and the Dealer has a quit smile in the backroom having, probably made 12% profit compared with his bottom line of 10%, the vehicle being priced at 20% over cost to begin with.
Likewise with private sellers. Their vehicles are probably priced with + 10% to allow for negotiation IF they want to sell.
I do believe that For Sale adverts should have a Lifespan, as this would decrease the time wasters and mean the Seller has to re-appraise the advert on a regular basis and cough up if he/she wishes to keep it For Sale.
2 to 4 weeks maximum would be sufficient time to test the market or find a buyer.

 

[Bibs]

Got to agree with Welshgas. The adverts should automatically be removed after say 4 weeks with the seller having to re apply to advertise. Although there is a function to separate trade/private sales, I think that the actual advert should also state if the seller is a trader or private seller.

 

[Bibs]

I have just been looking at the Cali's for sale and some of the prices are truely laughable!

What is laughable is all these people trying to talk down the used value of the Cali's. It will be hilarious to see their change in attitude when they come to sell them. Part of the reason I purchased my second Cali was not only is it a great vehicle but it is also one of the least depreciating vehicles on the road. My first one depreciated only £5k over 5 years and that was selling to a dealer.
It appears looking at some of the threads that a lot of people are clueless when it comes to buying and selling vehicles.

 

[applejack]

I disagree I'm afraid. Feel that the prices are well founded.

I disagree, if they were worth these stupid prices surely they would of been snapped up, quite a few of them up for sale have been on this website since before Christmas, when vans do come up for sale at the correct price they sell instantly. Why would anyone in their right frame of mind pay over £41k for a 2012 SE? This probably has little or no warranty remaining.

We have paid less than £7k more than this for a brand new T6 with a 5 year warranty !

NO BRAINER!

 

[Borris]

After decades of development, the VW California has become an iconic design and IMO is rightly seen as the gold standard amongst camper vans. A Cali promises its owner another life of spontaneity, freedom, flexibility and adventure at a moments notice and all within a well appointed, warm, dry, comfortable and superbly made VW package. So given most peoples' complicated and busy modern lives, it is not that surprising that the Cali has a very strong following of people aspiring to some day own one.

However, unless I am mistaken, VW continue to produce Calis in relatively small numbers. Therefore unless you have access to sufficient spare funds and are patient enough to be able to order a new one to your own spec, anyone looking for a second hand example may have to wait a long time before finding one that matches their requirements. (Finding a second hand Beach with a parking heater being a good example). So the second hand prices being asked come down to supply verses demand but with one big complication.

Personally, in the very short time that we have owned it, our Cali has become much more to us than an expensive three tonne car and if we were advertising it today, I too would be wanting top dollar for it as well or I just wouldn't sell it. Like many others, it isn't our only car and it is used purely for leisure. The changes on the T6 don't effect the purpose of the vehicle or the design of the living area and IMO are not significant enough to drive many owners to change. Therefore, this is the main reason why the used prices aren't likely to drop much. People just get very attached to them and often don't have to or want to sell unless the price is right.

I think that the prices being asked are entirely valid and the value of used Calis will continue to remain high for the foreseable future for these and other financial and political reasons already mentioned in other posts.

You just cannot compare the way Cali's depreciate to that of other vehicles.

Just my opinion and observations.

 

[applejack]

Sorry I have to disagree again.

I have been monitoring the used market for over twelve months now and where we are today is the most used Cali's I have ever seen for sale, I would say it is up by over 300% compared to this time last year. Several dealers also told me they have seen the biggest year for new California sales and many were using up their allocation. This in turn will mean we will see more and more for sale and once the quantity goes up the prices will have to come down, I see the biggest price drop in used vans in the autumn as this tends to be when you asee the majority come up for sale.

It will then become a buyers market

 

[hirsty]

Absolutely agree with half of that Borris - you'd want top dollar (as we all would) but you're not personally wanting to sell are you? As someone posted above, the Classifieds here are clogged with under-motivated sellers, some of whom may well be as emotionally invested as they are financially.

As is often the way with forum discussions - without benefit of face-to-face nuance - we're all both agreeing on the main point but ignoring a few of the details. I've perhaps made it look like I'm more invested than I really am "in real life", but to me the issue of the broad spread of used prices from the 'perfectly reasonable' through to the 'just plain daft' that's the problem.

The two conclusions I've drawn are:

- most of the contributors above would prefer to see time-limited Classifieds on this site (which may focus Sellers minds on whether they really want to sell?)

- I fully accept that any vehicle depreciates rapidly over the first three-years before then slowing a little & also agree that California's are amongst the slowest depreciators. I personally bought my replacement van for the sheer fun of it rather than as an investment & I fully intend to drive the wheels off it with a full size grin at all times - it's a steel box, albeit a magical one, that enables a good time for me.

All the best.

 

[GrannyJen]

I think the proposal by Gassy is sound, have a finite lifetime for an advert, otherwise they just accumulate with no real action being taken to remove when sold or when no demand prompts a rethink.

It would also deter those who would post an advert based more on speculation than motivation to sell, i.e. "If someone is prepared to pay this for it then I will sell otherwise happy to keep".

As with anything it is a compromise on what someone is prepared to accept and what someone is prepared to give so I never take the advertised value of anything as definitive.

 

[2into1]

Approx 16 months ago, I was brave enough to try and work out a formula to price used Cali's!
https://vwcaliforniaclub.com/threads/how-to-price-your-cali.8438/

The starting point (16months ago) in those calculations was a reasonable spec 140hp SE at a couple of months old was worth £40k. It explains how to adjust for higher spec, DSG, and allow for depreciation. A 6 month old 180 DSG was £44k.
Compare that to the prices being asked now, and you'll see the source of the differences being debated here.

Clearly the list prices have increased since then (and increases to the list price are a massive driver of residuals).

 

[Borris]

Sorry I have to disagree again.

I have been monitoring the used market for over twelve months now and where we are today is the most used Cali's I have ever seen for sale, I would say it is up by over 300% compared to this time last year. Several dealers also told me they have seen the biggest year for new California sales and many were using up their allocation. This in turn will mean we will see more and more for sale and once the quantity goes up the prices will have to come down, I see the biggest price drop in used vans in the autumn as this tends to be when you asee the majority come up for sale.

It will then become a buyers market

Well you may be right but we shall see.

Second hand Cali's "Up by over 300% compared to this time last year" and "many (dealers) using up there allocation" sounds impressive but no mention of actual numbers? Unless VW increase production, dealers using up their allocations translates into shortages of supply and therefore firm second hand prices.
However as the discussion is about used Cali prices, how many have you seen for sale at what you would consider to be a sensible price?

When looking at motorhomes before buying our Cali I was also told by a dealer that there has been a rise in demand right accross the caravan, motorhome, campervan market due in part, I am sure, to the hassle attached to foriegn air travel and the numerous acts of terrorism worldwide to name but two possible reasons. Apparently, more and more of us Brits are now holidaying in the UK. With the rise in demand for new vehicles of this type there will also be a rise in demand for second hand vehicles. Not everyone can afford a new one. An extra £7k for a new one will put ownership beyond many people, so second hand, albeit a relatively expensive option, might be their only choice.

In adition, the approaching crippling changes in the VED will no doubt affect new car sales and is likely, for a short while at least, to strengthen second hand prices. There is also going to be uncertainty over how Brexit will effect the pound and correspondingly, new car prices. It may become more expensive to buy new and therefore more cost effective to buy second hand.

You may be right but it's my guess that used prices will continue to remain firm.

 

[snowy55]

Not only has the new prices gone up, the Ocean now has a very low specification and an awful lot of stuff that was standard on the SE has now got to be ordered as an extra on an Ocean putting the price up even further.

 

[calimera]

Not only has the new prices gone up, the Ocean now has a very low specification and an awful lot of stuff that was standard on the SE has now got to be ordered as an extra on an Ocean putting the price up even further.

Not sure you are correct
Cruise is not standard but

Now standard on Ocean
Climatronic 3 zone A/C
Bluetooth
DAB
Interior light concept, lights in boots,dimming lights in roof etc.
One of the reason we went for the Ocean.

We are also getting a higher spec van & cheaper price than the price we were going to pay for T5 demo last summer.
Big plus is the extended warranty, service plan & £750 .

 

[Borris]

Absolutely agree with half of that Borris - you'd want top dollar (as we all would) but you're not personally wanting to sell are you? As someone posted above, the Classifieds here are clogged with under-motivated sellers, some of whom may well be as emotionally invested as they are financially.

As is often the way with forum discussions - without benefit of face-to-face nuance - we're all both agreeing on the main point but ignoring a few of the details. I've perhaps made it look like I'm more invested than I really am "in real life", but to me the issue of the broad spread of used prices from the 'perfectly reasonable' through to the 'just plain daft' that's the problem.

The two conclusions I've drawn are:

- most of the contributors above would prefer to see time-limited Classifieds on this site (which may focus Sellers minds on whether they really want to sell?)

- I fully accept that any vehicle depreciates rapidly over the first three-years before then slowing a little & also agree that California's are amongst the slowest depreciators. I personally bought my replacement van for the sheer fun of it rather than as an investment & I fully intend to drive the wheels off it with a full size grin at all times - it's a steel box, albeit a magical one, that enables a good time for me.

All the best.

I agree with everything that you have said with the exception of the following: " but to me the issue of the broad spread of used prices from the 'perfectly reasonable' through to the 'just plain daft' that's the problem."
I completely agree that adverts on the forum should only run for a set period and then expire and have said so elsewhere on this forum but the broad spread of asking prices is just a fact of life. Unless some form of pricing censorship is introduced and I am not sugesting that, then people must be left to ask what ever they want to, however daft it might seem and irrespective of their motives.

We too, purchased our Cali to use and it was never intended as any form of financial investment which most modern vehicles clearly are not.

 

[Martin]

From this weekend for sale adverts will only run for a maximum of 6 weeks

 

[WelshGas]

I disagree, if they were worth these stupid prices surely they would of been snapped up, quite a few of them up for sale have been on this website since before Christmas, when vans do come up for sale at the correct price they sell instantly. Why would anyone in their right frame of mind pay over £41k for a 2012 SE? This probably has little or no warranty remaining.

We have paid less than £7k more than this for a brand new T6 with a 5 year warranty !

NO BRAINER!

The T6 has yet to show it's teething problems - if any. Better the devil you know!

 

[muttley]

We sold our 3 year old Cali last summer (you can tell how reluctant I was to do that, given that I still browse the forum occasionally!) and it was unlike any car sale I have experienced. We priced it based on others offered on the forum, and I had more than 20 calls in the first two days. I was even receiving offers well over the asking price from people who hadn't yet seen it. Naturally I felt I must have under-priced it, but I think the lack of availability of the T6 at the time was the key factor. I am most surprised to hear that there are so many available now - I guess a few T5 owners must fancy a T6.

I am now looking for an old splitty, so give me a wave as you pass me stranded on the hard shoulder ...

Simon