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Cyclists: Scourge of the streets?

I would say if you are correct then we are doomed because humans will not change on mass to cure the problem, and I would think it’s too late anyway.

I choose to believe that we will change enough to stop polluting and technology will help us adapt to the results of global climate change.
Humans changed massively in the 80s and 90s to eliminate fluorocarbon refrigeration and spray can gasses that were destroying the ozone layer. We listened to the scientists. Why can’t we change now? What has changed to stop us from listening to the advice of scientists?
 
Humans changed massively in the 80s and 90s to eliminate fluorocarbon refrigeration and spray can gasses that were destroying the ozone layer. We listened to the scientists. Why can’t we change now? What has changed to stop us from listening to the advice of scientists?
Not to get political but I believe it’s Socialist dogma. Click bait media does not help, couching every thing as a drama. Look how much science has changed this Country since the 60s, even the poorest live far better lives now. We need to be schooled in positivity rather than negativity, the world would be a much happier place.
 
Not to get political but I believe it’s Socialist dogma. Click bait media does not help, couching every thing as a drama. Look how much science has changed this Country since the 60s, even the poorest live far better lives now. We need to be schooled in positivity rather than negativity, the world would be a much happier place.
So you’re saying we we should not listen to the scientists because their message is too negative?
 
Sorry, I wasn’t clear. No not at all, but if we take the case for climate change being blamed on human activity by scientists. I worry the science is not conclusive to prove either point. I would like to see the finest minds on both sides of the argument be employed by say the The G21 to provide independent science that can then be examined by an independent body of with no skin in the game, who’s job it is to come up with solutions based solely on facts. At the moment both sides of this argument have lied and exaggerated so neither side are credible. Sorry for rambling on..
 
Sorry, I wasn’t clear. No not at all, but if we take the case for climate change being blamed on human activity by scientists. I worry the science is not conclusive to prove either point. I would like to see the finest minds on both sides of the argument be employed by say the The G21 to provide independent science that can then be examined by an independent body of with no skin in the game, who’s job it is to come up with solutions based solely on facts. At the moment both sides of this argument have lied and exaggerated so neither side are credible. Sorry for rambling on..
So, just to be clear, you’re saying climate scientists have lied and exaggerated.
 
You can prove anything with facts. I think climate change is very real. BUT it is a natural phenomena that happens over 1000s of years slowly but surely due to the irregular orbit of earth around its parent star. It doesn't happen in 20 years like they seem to say. Humans do need to stop littering like the idiots they seem to be these days and they need to stop lopping down forests. Unfortunately they won't so we are still doomed. Oh back on topic. I took the train today and cycled home the wrong way down a one way street.
 
No, I am saying scientists on both side of the debate have lied and exaggerated both their findings and the accuracy of their climate models. Both seem to refuse to accept the validity of any of the others arguments.
 
You can prove anything with facts. I think climate change is very real. BUT it is a natural phenomena that happens over 1000s of years slowly but surely due to the irregular orbit of earth around its parent star. It doesn't happen in 20 years like they seem to say. Humans do need to stop littering like the idiots they seem to be these days and they need to stop lopping down forests. Unfortunately they won't so we are still doomed. Oh back on topic. I took the train today and cycled home the wrong way down a one way street.

This would be my likely conclusion, but I am open to be persuaded otherwise. With regard to cycling the wrong way down a one way street, you should turn yourself into the police immediately or alternatively donate to a save the Amazon fund.
 
This would be my likely conclusion, but I am open to be persuaded otherwise. With regard to cycling the wrong way down a one way street, you should turn yourself into the police immediately or alternatively donate to a save the Amazon fund.
There's a joke there about buying some ink cartridges but I won't use it. I saved the rain forest today using my bike. 1 step at a time people
 
You can prove anything with facts. I think climate change is very real. BUT it is a natural phenomena that happens over 1000s of years slowly but surely due to the irregular orbit of earth around its parent star. It doesn't happen in 20 years like they seem to say. Humans do need to stop littering like the idiots they seem to be these days and they need to stop lopping down forests. Unfortunately they won't so we are still doomed. Oh back on topic. I took the train today and cycled home the wrong way down a one way street.
Well, you’ve certainly taken a position. I have to admit, it’s kind of breathtaking to see it laid out like that.
 
Some old man on his bike doing 20mph shouted at my wife and 6 year for getting in his way "get out my way, i could have knocked you over" on a nice old railway track converted to a cycle path. Wifes reply "slow down then you idiot, she's only 6!"
That old man are the reason cyclists get a bad rep, but he would be the same driving, walking, shopping. Some people are just miserable gits!
View attachment 49442

Sadly he colours the popular opinion that many have of cyclists. Whilst this thread refers to "cyclists v motorists" and the "war" between them" many pedestrians, walkers, runners will believe the war is "cyclists v them".

Its bonkers really. Cycling is a great means of transport, a great means of keeping fit and our sports cyclists have conferred enormous prestige and glory on our country, southing we should be basking in.
 
In Australia where we visit, the cycle/pedestrian tracks have central white lines and signs encouraging users to keep to the Left and this is enforced by the local police on foot/cycle patrols with a quiet word or sometimes not so quiet.
Although I'll probably get shouted down I have some sympathy for the OLD man. Both pedestrians and cyclists should have some awareness of those in front AND those behind them. In that photogaph the cyclists have no idea of anyone approaching from behind.
 
Sympathy for that old man, seriously!!? My 6 year old daughter could barely stay on the tarmac as she has only been riding for a few weeks, never mind strictly to one side. Should I then start teaching my daughter to shout at all the dog walkers that let their dogs off the lead and cross her path so when she grows up, she can be like that miserable old git! No, its for sharing with everyone! Its not a pavement, its just a tarmac path going through some woods. What next, Drawing white lines and setting rules, with signs 'experienced cyclists only' with a wire fence put up. Sorry, not having any sympathy for that old guy whatsoever!
You'll be his age one day.
Wether your daughter can ride or not is immaterial you were in a Public Place so it was your responsibility to ensure she was safe and so were others using that shared space.
 
It costs absolutely nothing to treat your fellow human being with respect and manners and that apllies to whether you're old or young. Being older doesnt mean you then have the absolute right to be rude and aggressive, especially to younger children. His age was irrelevant anyhow, so I will change miserable old git, to miserable git and then im not being ageist (he was most probably a miserable young git as well!). And as for it was immaterial whether she could ride or not, oh please @WelshGas. You sound like the person who sounds your car horn behind a learner driver!
Bournemouth has introduced more and more restrictions on the seafront because of idiot cyclists who wanted to achieve their best times though people ambling with their children, the rules are now as follows.
"The new signs are on top of existing signage informing cyclists of the 10mph speed limit and that pedestrians have the right of way. As well as the speed limit, the prom is also subject to a bylaw that bans cycling in July and August between 10am and 6pm. The signs change to show 'no cycling' during the summer ban".12 Nov 2018
 
Stockholm is struggling too, bike paths are thankfully mostly separated from road and pedestrians on my commute, but the challenge is the varied speeds of cyclists also scooters / electric bikes etc.

The respect here is generally present and it’s ok to chat with people when you spot some dangerous moves, but I can see it getting worse and a lot can be attributed to people metricizing their rides, such as avg speed, power or going for KOMs on Strava. I train on quiet roads before 6am or indoors / off-road to avoid this phenomenon, but the boy racers are at large on the commuter scene now and often turn out to be older than you might imagine
 
It costs absolutely nothing to treat your fellow human being with respect and manners and that apllies to whether you're old or young. Being older doesnt mean you then have the absolute right to be rude and aggressive, especially to younger children. His age was irrelevant anyhow, so I will change miserable old git, to miserable git and then im not being ageist (he was most probably a miserable young git as well!). And as for it was immaterial whether she could ride or not, oh please @WelshGas. You sound like the person who sounds your car horn behind a learner driver!
Incorrect. The Learner Driver is under instruction and therefore aware of what is going on around them as is the instructer. Were you? as the Instructor or is it perfectly all right for you to take up the whole width of the cycle way because it is your Right, with no consideration for other users?.
Remember, the cycle path is not just for you, there are other users. You cant hope to received consideration if you don't give it in return.
 
I was going to respond and then didn't but now I have to!

There is a condition called Swinley, Strava or Rapha "man". They have all the kit and as such no one is allowed to overtake them. It's typically middle-age men with income. MTBs will be Santa Cruzs or a Yeti (boutique brands) , really deep sections wheels on road bikes, and the lightest frames even though they may be carrying quite a few extra Kgs. MTB will typically be over-biked. You will find them in all walks and when you come up behind them on a trail they will not move over to let you pass. They usually defeat themselves with minimal input.

In this situation my concern would always be the child's safety. So I wouldn't overtake until your Wife moved over and or your child stopped. I have to say children are pretty aware, parents less so, but can be wobbly and drawn to where they look.
 
What a load of rubbish @WelshGas. He could have easily slowed down, said excuse me or rang his bell and then be on his jolly way enjoying the fresh air and his bike ride. It is a very straight path so he would have seen very far away that she obviously wobbling because she is 6 year old and didn't want to fall in the nettles, hence her Mum was by her side. He was and is just an idiot!!!
So you say.
 
Maybe the answer is, smaller bikes would mean more could happily fit on a sinlge lane
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I cycle a lot but my issue is with the club cyclists riding two or three abreast as they seem to becoming more arrogant. I was down visiting a friend and had to overtake a group of 20 plus cyclist in a tight group and they took up almost half the road width - and that was on a road with a 60 mph limit.
 
I took my boys (ages 4 & 5) and Meg on the two tunnels greenway outside bath. We had a very enjoyable day out and one I shall remember with fondness.

The only difficult decision we faced was wether to ignore signs banning dogs from the shared use greenway or take a four and five year old on a national speed limit road which has no provision for cyclists.
 
I'm a road cyclist. But I've not been out for over a year, as we got a WattBike Atom to use at home and we hook it up to Strava and Zwift. It's brilliant. Super safe, no risk of aggressive or dangerous drivers (a minority, I know but enough to put me off) and can cycle whenever I like as it's super time-efficient.

I'm hoping to go back out onto the real roads soon but I've lost my confidence a little. We live in the city suburbs, so it's about 10 miles before we can get to the quieter lanes.

My hubby goes out a lot and is training hard for a mountain trip next month. As I'm not on the same level, it wouldn't be fair to go out with him right now. Once he's back home, I'll probably do a few road cycles in October...to get back into it.

He got the bug 10 years ago from his Dad. His Dad used to ride competitively, so taught both of us everything he knows about cycling. Bikes, bike maintenance, training and best of all, how to be safe on the road and use it properly. I.e. Be respectful of everyone else, drivers included. But keep in mind those times when we might need to put our own safety first.

Riding side by side is often very necessary. It forces drivers to see cyclists as they would another vehicle and thus give them more room and courtesy when overtaking. I appreciate how annoying it can be. As I'm a driver myself, but patience is key in these situations.

Another thing I've been taught is to not ride in the gutter of the road. It's where potholes tend to be. Debris. Leaves and branches etc. So I've been told it's safer to just ride out a little bit from the pavement. Not be so close. I can see why drivers who don't cycle might get frustrated with this. But it also smartly makes them automatically give me more room. Safety, you see. Both for me and the driver.

Thing is, we tend to go out early on Saturday or (ideally) Sunday mornings. When there are fewer cars on the road and it's safer. (And we're less likely to annoy anyone!!) But even so, I get so anxious before I leave the house.

I've experienced a combination of mainly courteous drivers with just the odd disappointment. Sadly, those bad experiences do shake me to the core.

It began when I was a teen. When a man got out of his car and screamed at me and a friend on a narrow country lane as we were riding side by side (we do this for safety). He was shouting how dangerous it was. He went to his boot and got out a baseball bat and started waving it at me and my friend. As a teen, I calmly said, "If you cared about our safety so much, why are you waving a bat in my face?" It worked and he left without saying a word. It still haunts me to this day.

This was my first experience of the bad eggs who drive cars. And like other people have said, it's a minority, not the majority. Most people are great.

Amongst the usual abuse (I've been called some nasty things, once whilst they were driving along next to me on a busy road) and dangerous manoeuvres (driving too close behind or overtaking too close), more recently, I had an old gentleman go crazy angry at me, my hubby and father-in-law for cycling side-by-side on a narrow road. Guess where? In a private country park with a 10mph limit. We were doing 18mph, I think. He deliberately kept putting his foot on the accelerator, jerking his car forward in an aggressive manner – as if he implied to run us over. I know there are always two sides to every story but this all happened very fast. I can assure you we were not being a pain and moved safely over to let him pass.

It's scary out there. I'm telling you. In France, where I've enjoyed road cycling once, I couldn't believe the difference in attitudes. The respect you get is unbelievable. The roads are quieter, in better shape and motorists just give you such a wide berth and are really friendly.

One of the reasons we got the VW Cali is so we can leave the UK as much as possible to enjoy safer cycling in France and beyond. I really can't wait.

One last point, there are some terrible drivers out there who don't understand the rules of cycling or how to share the road. That is true.

But there are some horrendous cyclists, too. Who give the rest of us a very bad name. I think both sides should be reminded of a few rules, so we can all use the road safely together. I'm not sure how we'd go about doing this – but it could start in schools and then why not make every driver, as part of their driving test/lessons, learn about cycling, too?

Maybe they'll have a little more compassion for cyclists and remember they're human flesh and bones. A daughter, a sister, a wife... Instead of just an inconvenience that's getting in the way?
 
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I too love my cycling and think clubs are really good and becoming more popular, but do have concerns when im driving and they do take up half the road on a 60mph county lane. Feel that then becomes a massive hazard for everyone concerned, because you can overtake a slow car but if theres enough in a group, it can essentially become a massive long moving obstacle to overtake.

Which is more dangerous to overtake:
1. A 120 metre long peloton of cyclist in single file, or;
2. A 40 metre long peloton of cyclists in triple file?

Hint - the stopping distance on a national speed limit road is estimated at 73 metres.
 
Robot cars are due soon, so maybe the answer is get rid of us humans and have robots on bikes instead, sure they would get on better, maybe, even work together! Imagine working together, as one! These robots could teach us humans so much.
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