Folding chair broken

[ArunAlec]

As the saying goes.....If the cap fits......

Or even if the seat does not fit....

 

[GSX1300R]

Blaming the owners for these breakages is a cop out. Any reference to the weight of the occupants is rather beside the point. These chairs are designed to fit in with the California lifestyle and within reason, they should be fit for purpose for a wide range of owners sizes and weights reflecting their customer base.

The problem we are discussing here is the failure of a cheap plastic component that forms the lower part of the joint that connects the front chair frame to both arms. This component slides inside the front chair frame tubing and is secured by a rivet. The failure is always as a result of the weakness caused by the rivet hole in this cheap plastic part. If you think about it, this part is not load bearing and I suspect that it's premature failure has more to do with the way chair is used. Never the less, they should not break. IMO they only do so because of a poorly designed part costing tuppence ha-penny. Further more, I suspect that if there was no rivet hole and instead this part was bonded to the tubular leg, the problem would be resolved. Alternatively the manufacturer should use a different material.

I rarely use these chairs as I don't find them comfortable. Instead I either rotate and use one of the front seats or use one of our two fold up picnic chairs which I purchased from a motorway service station about twenty years ago. From memory they cost £15 each and are still as good as new.

This goes for everything in the van...We had our leisure batteries fail at 3 years...We had our awning come apart in 3and a half years. We had our roof repaired at 3and a half years...We are lucky many people have had many worse things happen compared to to us.. Don’t even think about bringing legal action against a company as big as VW because you’ve go no chance...You have more chance getting something done if you don’t threaten them..

 

[Amarillo]

Some have admitted to being heavier than 75kgms and the upper bed is supposed to have a maximum weight capacity of 150kgms, so I presume the chairs might have a similar restriction/chair.

The average British man is 5’9” and 13 stone 2 pounds (83.6 Kg).

I’m bigger than average in both respects. I’ve broken a chair but not the bed.

 

[Amarillo]

Don’t even think about bringing legal action against a company as big as VW because you’ve go no chance...You have more chance getting something done if you don’t threaten them..

Do you really think that VW would defend a small claim for a £120 picnic chair that probably costs them under £10?

So long as you are not making a vexatious claim I would expect a “goodwill gesture” without them admitting liability.

 

[WelshGas]

Blaming the owners for these breakages is a cop out. Any reference to the weight of the occupants is rather beside the point. These chairs are designed to fit in with the California lifestyle and within reason, they should be fit for purpose for a wide range of owners sizes and weights reflecting their customer base.

The problem we are discussing here is the failure of a cheap plastic component that forms the lower part of the joint that connects the front chair frame to both arms. This component slides inside the front chair frame tubing and is secured by a rivet. The failure is always as a result of the weakness caused by the rivet hole in this cheap plastic part. If you think about it, this part is not load bearing and I suspect that it's premature failure has more to do with the way chair is used. Never the less, they should not break. IMO they only do so because of a poorly designed part costing tuppence ha-penny. Further more, I suspect that if there was no rivet hole and instead this part was bonded to the tubular leg, the problem would be resolved. Alternatively the manufacturer should use a different material.

I rarely use these chairs as I don't find them comfortable. Instead I either rotate and use one of the front seats or use one of our two fold up picnic chairs which I purchased from a motorway service station about twenty years ago. From memory they cost £15 each and are still as good as new.

Correct. Upper bed has weight limit of 150kgms for 2 people + a probable safety margin. Likewise the seats I would have thought.
When calculating the MGW of a vehicle Drivers weight is presumed to be 75kgms.
When you say a design fault then it should be happening to most of the seats. It’s not so not a design fault. Possibly a periodic manufacturing fault which should appear during the warranty period but if rarely used then outside that period.

Something fails or is broken and immediately its “ a design fault” and “ not fit for purpose “ . No, it’s just Sods Law. Things break or fail and hence a warranty, but occasionally it happens outside the warranty. That’s life.

 

[Borris]

When you say a design fault then it should be happening to most of the seats. It’s not so not a design fault.

Something fails or is broken and immediately its “ a design fault” and “ not fit for purpose “ . No, it’s just Sods Law. Things break or fail and hence a warranty, but occasionally it happens outside the warranty. That’s life.

This issue has been reported too often to be dismissed as purely sods law. A picnic chair costing £120 should function as a picnic chair and should continue to do so. If it doesn't because of a faulty joint and then it isn't fit for purpose. Just because this issue is not happening to most seats doesn't mean there isn't a design fault.

One would hope that VW's supplier might see the worth in modifying this joint but so far, alas not. Clearly they are happy to receive regular returns and absorb the associated costs.

I can see no reason why this should be a periodic manufacturing fault. The item concerned is probably injection moulded so the quality should be consistent.

 

[Bazz Bash]

UPDATE to my dealing with Breeze at Havant and my email to VW customer care. I received a call where he talked about the material wearing out??? The agent proceeded to tell me that it was out of warranty so "no go". I explained it was a not the material but the joint. I explained again that the consumer rights act was quite clear that some action was expected under the six year limit. After going around in circles with him about the correct process (??), he asked me to take it to Havant (again!) for an estimate for repair. I then realised he didn't understand the product or maybe even what a California was. I explained the replacement was £120 and that I wasn't going to Havant again and that they had already seen it. He wanted me to call Havant and book it in! I told him that he should call Havant. He did keep saying that he wanted to resolve this again and again. He finally ( I think to get rid of me) said he would call Havant and get them to call me (to book it in!!!), That was last week.

Call today from their warranty guy. I'm getting a new one for half price.

I'm then going to do what everyone seems to do and that's put them in the garage and not use them, having bought two chairs that are smaller and more comfortable. I'll use the stowage in the door for other things.

Going back to the consumer rights act 2015. You don't get a six year warranty that's clear. But given the number of issues about the joint I've seen on this forum, there is an issue with it that is giving high levels of "forum reported" failures. In my view the fault is there from either manufacture or the design specification of the joint, before manufacture. My next step was going to be using a 'freedom of information request' about the number of these chairs that have been replaced under warranty. That would have been interesting if they have that data. But like a lot of people I'm just going to replace it.

 

[Wikke]

A member at the German Caliboard.de has built these bolts for repairing the arms:

https://www.caliboard.de/uploads/mo...humb.jpg.80e7529c1539be9138688a8073be6069.jpg

I ordered a set (4 for for both chairs) at 30 euro and put them in the van just in case the poor designed plastic construction fails. Maybe I replace them anyway, before tumbling on the campground.

You can only see the pictures on the site above after registration (worth to do that, they are very well informed). If I receive the bolts next week I can post a picture.

Regards from Amsterdam,

Marc.

Hey Marc kan je me het adres doorgeven waar je deze set bestelde, ik heb namelijk hetzelfde voor.
(hey Marc can you tell me where you got you set, I had the same problem)

 

[Wikke]

Hey Cali Fans,

here some more pictures...

Are you interested send me a privat message.

Greetings from Germany
Domi

View attachment 39764

View attachment 39765

View attachment 39766

View attachment 39767

I'm interested in a set how can I send private message?

 

[Meoncoast]

My next step was going to be using a 'freedom of information request' about the number of these chairs that have been replaced under warranty. That would have been interesting if they have that data. But like a lot of people I'm just going to replace it.

Do not think the FOIA will help. The Freedom of Information Act 2000 is an Act of the Parliament of the United Kingdom that creates a public "right of access" to information held by public authorities. It is the implementation of freedom of information legislation in the United Kingdom on a national level.

 

[Wikke]

One more picture...

View attachment 40158

 

[kurienp]

@Wikke , send Domi and email at d.baeurle@gmx.de and his paypal address is also the same. Once Domi replies, make a paypal payment and he will ship them within a week. Very well machined parts.

 

[flying banana]

Well both my ocean chairs have now failed at the same spot . No warranty. Going to attempt a fix myself but how do you undo this pin? I've already drilled out the rivet

 

[Jodalo]

Well both my ocean chairs have now failed at the same spot . No warranty. Going to attempt a fix myself but how do you undo this pin? I've already drilled out the rivet

View attachment 64432

The photo is slightly blurred, is it not the other end of the rivet? Can you not tap the rivet out with a centre punch or similar from the drilled side?

 

[flying banana]

The photo is slightly blurred, is it not the other end of the rivet? Can you not tap the rivet out with a centre punch or similar from the drilled side?

I can get it to turn but cant stop the other end spinning as it's too flat. I thought it was like a pin and a special recessed nut. Is it just a rivet? If so I'll have to drill it. Problem is if you replace it with a nut and bolt the chairs arm won't go over the head of the bolt

 

[Jodalo]

I can get it to turn but cant stop the other end spinning as it's too flat. I thought it was like a pin and a special recessed nut. Is it just a rivet? If so I'll have to drill it. Problem is if you replace it with a nut and bolt the chairs arm won't go over the head of the bolt

View attachment 64434

View attachment 64435

Sorry, I thought you said you had already drilled out the rivet. I’m unfamiliar with this connection. Your photo is still blurred, is that a Torx screw where your screwdriver is? If it is, cut a slot in the other side with a hacksaw and then you can hold against it with a screwdriver.

 

[flying banana]

Sorry, I thought you said you had already drilled out the rivet. I’m unfamiliar with this connection. Your photo is still blurred, is that a Torx screw where your screwdriver is? If it is, cut a slot in the other side with a hacksaw and then you can hold against it with a screwdriver.

i drilled out the little pop rivet already yes.

 

[flying banana]

i drilled out the little pop rivet already yes.

This one

 

[Jodalo]

i drilled out the little pop rivet already yes.

Sorry, we’re talking at cross purposes. I don’t know how that pin comes out, it looks quite substantial. Angle grinder? File? VW probably have a special tool for it!!

 

[flying banana]

Sorry, we’re talking at cross purposes. I don’t know how that pin comes out, it looks quite substantial. Angle grinder? File? VW probably have a special tool for it!!

vw would just replace the whole chair. looks like i'm going to have to drill it and find something to replace it with

 

[SailSki]

Hi, I had a chair fail at the same point a few weeks ago (2016 Cali) and ordered a set of 4 replacement parts from Domi. Very happy with the quality but took a while for them to arrive even after he notified they had been sent.
The bolts he uses have very thin heads and nuts so they fit within the space inside the arm rests.
Apologies for the quality of the photos

 

[flying banana]

View attachment 64440View attachment 64441Hi, I had a chair fail at the same point a few weeks ago (2016 Cali) and ordered a set of 4 replacement parts from Domi. Very happy with the quality but took a while for them to arrive even after he notified they had been sent.
The bolts he uses have very thin heads and nuts so they fit within the space inside the arm rests.
Apologies for the quality of the photos

so you do have to drill out that pin ?

 

[Spotlight Kid]

I fitted Domi's replacement parts a while ago when my seat failed and they are a splendid upgrade. Yes, you need to drill out the rivets.

 

[flying banana]

I drilled out that pin. Made a part using some 22mm copper pipe and hammered a roll pin back through. Seems to work a treat. I'll see how long it lasts and may still order doms parts or go get some made at an engineering firm

 

[flying banana]

You can use a bolt. I found this in the shed and sawed it through