Leaking pop tops on 2023 California Oceans

[Barry Chuckle]

I have had a go at creating a poll specifically to gather data on the 04S A bellow failure rate.

It can be found in the Polls section of the forum.

If your Cali has 04S A bellows fitted, please can you take time to take part in the poll, even if you do not have any leaks or if you have attempted a DIY waterproofing fix.

Thanks.

I've competed it, mine can leak like a 04S bellows leak like a sieve in the right (or wrong!) conditions. As I've already got a guaranteed trade in value for them, I'm mindful that if I register this as a fault it may flag up somewhere and affect my trade in.

 

[GreenMissile]

Well, we already know @markbrown83 reported previously.…

I have been speaking with him over the last few weeks after I reported to my dealer following the test I undertook on 14.03.24. As previously mentioned mine are 04S dates 15.11.23 so should have been fit for purpose, which they are absolutely not.
I also have to take the van in to confirm that they are leaking, but here is the kicker. If confirmed that they leak (they will!) the dealer would fit new bellows if they have them in stock or order and fit within 28 days. Now forgive me but I do not have sufficient faith that 04S at this time that they are the definitive solution. I also do not want to subject the van to multiple fittings of new bellows as that increases the possibility of damage when in with the dealer.
Until there is more definitive confidence in what is being fitted is water tight I will be holding off taking that step. I genuinely fear that the numbers of 04S leakers will increase as more owners start to utilise their new vans as we move through the season (I hope I am wrong). So I will play the waiting game I think at this time.

 

[lohr500]

I have been speaking with him over the last few weeks after I reported to my dealer following the test I undertook on 14.03.24. As previously mentioned mine are 04S dates 15.11.23 so should have been fit for purpose, which they are absolutely not.
I also have to take the van in to confirm that they are leaking, but here is the kicker. If confirmed that they leak (they will!) the dealer would fit new bellows if they have them in stock or order and fit within 28 days. Now forgive me but I do not have sufficient faith that 04S at this time that they are the definitive solution. I also do not want to subject the van to multiple fittings of new bellows as that increases the possibility of damage when in with the dealer.
Until there is more definitive confidence in what is being fitted is water tight I will be holding off taking that step. I genuinely fear that the numbers of 04S leakers will increase as more owners start to utilise their new vans as we move through the season (I hope I am wrong). So I will play the waiting game I think at this time.

My thoughts are exactly the same as yours. No point getting the belows changed for another set of 04S bellows at this point in time. And every bellows swap comes with the risk of collateral damage to the van through clumsy workshop fitters or just the nature of the process to swap them out.

I also fear that the reported failure rate will increase as more new vans are delivered and more owners use their vans through the season.

From the few failures reported on the forum so far there does seem to be a pattern emerging.
Most, if not all are leaking from the vertical seams to the rear of the two large vertical front zips.
And in some cases, through the zip seams as well.
@Elmo3 photo also shows a running leak from a different area that I can't quite locate.

Given that all of us with problems are seeing the water ingress through those seams, there must surely be a generic design flaw, or a batch of bellows have been manufactured incorrectly. Either way I think we are only seeing the tip of the iceberg so far

 

[Elmo3]

@Elmo3 photo also shows a running leak from a different area that I can't quite locate.

That‘s running down the front above the control panel, underneath the window, showing that horizontal seams fail as well as vertical.

 

[RockinNRollin]

So had a few wet and breezy nights now (both with rain to the front and to the sides) with our Nov 23 04S and so far not a drop, even after some pretty heavy and extensive rain. It’s not the worst rain ever so maybe it may yet happen but so far so good.

 

[Jimmylondon07]

So had a few wet and breezy nights now (both with rain to the front and to the sides) with our Nov 23 04S and so far not a drop, even after some pretty heavy and extensive rain. It’s not the worst rain ever so maybe it may yet happen but so far so good.

Which dealer fitted it mate?

 

[PAL299]

Been raining so put up pop top and mine leaks not clear from the picture but quite a lot of water on offside by front.

 

[PAL299]

pick up Cali on 4th March

 

[RockinNRollin]

Which dealer fitted it mate?

Manchester

 

[OooOooTheMonkey]

Been raining so put up pop top and mine leaks not clear from the picture but quite a lot of water on offside by front.

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There is definitely a pattern forming here.

 

[P600BOO]

There is definitely a pattern forming here.

Mine yesterday in pouring rain.
100% dry but I have sprayed all the stitched seams with Isabella Aqua Tex

 

[lohr500]

pick up Cali on 4th March

Sorry to see yours are affected as well. Similar failures to others, including mine.

Can I suggest you insist your dealer puts you in contact with Adrian at the VW Executive Office.. He is on leave next week, but he is handling all the leaking bellows claims and he needs to be aware.

If you don't mind, please could you take part in the poll if you haven't done so already as this will help all of us to demonstrate that there is clearly a problem.

You can change your vote if your case changes and as far as I can establish your vote is anonymous.

04S Bellow review poll.

Unfortunately I can't edit the poll title. For clarity I am discussing 04S bellows manufactured after 9th November 2023. On behalf of all of those affected, I'm wanting to build a picture on the performance of the latest 04S bellows fitted after 9th November 2023, based on members' real life...

vwcaliforniaclub.com

Thanks.

 

[markbrown83]

Manchester

Same dealer as me.

 

[myvanrodney]

Mine yesterday in pouring rain.
100% dry but I have sprayed all the stitched seams with Isabella Aqua Tex

View attachment 121146

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This is great. Notwithstanding we shouldnt have to treat the bellows, at least you seem to have found a fix. I wonder if what you have done can help hone in on the exact cause - the seams?, the fabric itself?.. both?

 

[Corradobrit]

This is great. Notwithstanding we shouldnt have to treat the bellows, at least you seem to have found a fix. I wonder if what you have done can help hone in on the exact cause - the seams?, the fabric itself?.. both?

It's all seams. More specifically capillary action through the seams.

 

[Corradobrit]

More positive experiences with 04S on the Calibord forum. One owner had the bellows up for 3 days with continuous saturating rain and only noticed condensation inside.

 

[RockinNRollin]

It’s worth noting mine has got wet (externally only!) maybe 3 or 4 times now at least - maybe there’s something in it “bedding in”? I will still be cautious but so far so good.

More positive experiences with 04S on the Calibord forum. One owner had the bellows up for 3 days with continuous saturating rain and only noticed condensation inside.

 

[myvanrodney]

More positive experiences with 04S on the Calibord forum. One owner had the bellows up for 3 days with continuous saturating rain and only noticed condensation inside.

i blame brexit

 

[bullibuskombi]

In case what?
Vw start up an investigation team to find out who you are on the forum and what vehicle you have!
Don’t be silly)))

They do read it.

 

[Corradobrit]

i blame brexit

Leaking bellows are not Brexit bonus. 2 new reports today of leaking 04S bellows in Germany.

 

[Ch1pbutty]

More positive experiences with 04S on the Calibord forum. One owner had the bellows up for 3 days with continuous saturating rain and only noticed condensation inside.

Are they employed by VW?

 

[duckyfluffy]

Been following this thread for a while and I must post our experiences. Our Ocean had leaking bellows replaced with an 03S back in November last year. On the first rain, after 15 minutes, they leaked all along the horizontal seam below the semi-circle front window.

I was really upset and VW immediately said they would swap them for the latest 04 which they said had something added to that seam.

Thing is, we are still waiting. But, after that day of rain and it drying out, the 03S ones have been absolutely waterproof. They have been exposed to driving rain, wind and truly torrential rain of biblical proportions and they haven't leaked since. That's about 8 days of solid rain and not a single drop.

Could there really be something in them sealing after repeated wet and dry cycles?

And what do we do with waterproof 03S bellows but an open warranty claim for 04S ones?

 

[myvanrodney]

Been following this thread for a while and I must post our experiences. Our Ocean had leaking bellows replaced with an 03S back in November last year. On the first rain, after 15 minutes, they leaked all along the horizontal seam below the semi-circle front window.

I was really upset and VW immediately said they would swap them for the latest 04 which they said had something added to that seam.

Thing is, we are still waiting. But, after that day of rain and it drying out, the 03S ones have been absolutely waterproof. They have been exposed to driving rain, wind and truly torrential rain of biblical proportions and they haven't leaked since. That's about 8 days of solid rain and not a single drop.

Could there really be something in them sealing after repeated wet and dry cycles?

And what do we do with waterproof 03S bellows but an open warranty claim for 04S ones?

Wow! now theres a twist in the plot if I ever saw one.

We have 03S bellows and are patiently waiting till theres a proven fix.

Ours leaked in the first 3 hrs of light drizzle (first exposure to rain from new). We raised the claim with our dealer straight away and have bought a wrap to tide us over until we press go on the fix.

Now Im wondering if I should test again...

 

[OooOooTheMonkey]

Been following this thread for a while and I must post our experiences. Our Ocean had leaking bellows replaced with an 03S back in November last year. On the first rain, after 15 minutes, they leaked all along the horizontal seam below the semi-circle front window.

I was really upset and VW immediately said they would swap them for the latest 04 which they said had something added to that seam.

Thing is, we are still waiting. But, after that day of rain and it drying out, the 03S ones have been absolutely waterproof. They have been exposed to driving rain, wind and truly torrential rain of biblical proportions and they haven't leaked since. That's about 8 days of solid rain and not a single drop.

Could there really be something in them sealing after repeated wet and dry cycles?

And what do we do with waterproof 03S bellows but an open warranty claim for 04S ones?

Thanks so much for posting. Wouldn’t it be amazing if after all this you’ve just solved the bellows conundrum.

 

[WelshGas]

Been following this thread for a while and I must post our experiences. Our Ocean had leaking bellows replaced with an 03S back in November last year. On the first rain, after 15 minutes, they leaked all along the horizontal seam below the semi-circle front window.

I was really upset and VW immediately said they would swap them for the latest 04 which they said had something added to that seam.

Thing is, we are still waiting. But, after that day of rain and it drying out, the 03S ones have been absolutely waterproof. They have been exposed to driving rain, wind and truly torrential rain of biblical proportions and they haven't leaked since. That's about 8 days of solid rain and not a single drop.

Could there really be something in them sealing after repeated wet and dry cycles?

And what do we do with waterproof 03S bellows but an open warranty claim for 04S ones?

Exactly what happened to my bellows in 2014. 1st wetting, water leaking in a few places. Dried, 2nd outing nothing and has remained so. Stitch holes that were visible initially disappeared as stitching thread expanded.