Mileage discrepancy 1971 VW bus!! What to do???

[Scoobyboy5555]

Hi guys/gals im in need of some help, I went to view a UK/RHD 1971 VW bay-window bus the weekend and left a deposit(£200) The bus was very clean and had lots of money spent on it(No rust/Rot) and boxes of invoices and everything was mint on it, So I agreed a price which for the condition and mileage (55k) was above what you would pay (£16k) as there seem to be quite a few which looked OK for £2k less, but this van stood out from the rest.

Anyway I did a HPi check when I got home and it says there is a mileage discrepancy, and says as follows:

Date recorded	Recorded by	Mileage reading	Total
14/07/1995	NMR	60000	60000
26/07/1995	NMR	63000	63000
03/10/2003	DVLA	20000	20000
20/04/2023	VOSA	55554	55554

All the MOT's all match up with the mileage from 2006 onwards, and a online MOT check also shows all miles/dates match, but obviously before it was all recorded by VOSA at MOT stations, back in the 90's it showed more miles then it has now as you can see above.

What would you do??? My head is saying leave it and its £200 lost, As if I come to sell in the future would I have the same problem when someone does HPi check.

Is this a common problem with old vehicles(never bought something this old) will I be having the same thing with other vans I view as most seem to be quite low mileage for there age!!!

 

[Perfectos]

Have you asked the owner for a full explanation?
if so what was the explanation?

 

[Mr T]

Hi guys/gals im in need of some help, I went to view a UK/RHD 1971 VW bay-window bus the weekend and left a deposit(£200) The bus was very clean and had lots of money spent on it(No rust/Rot) and boxes of invoices and everything was mint on it, So I agreed a price which for the condition and mileage (55k) was above what you would pay (£16k) as there seem to be quite a few which looked OK for £2k less, but this van stood out from the rest.

Anyway I did a HPi check when I got home and it says there is a mileage discrepancy, and says as follows:

Date recorded	Recorded by	Mileage reading	Total
14/07/1995	NMR	60000	60000
26/07/1995	NMR	63000	63000
03/10/2003	DVLA	20000	20000
20/04/2023	VOSA	55554	55554

All the MOT's all match up with the mileage from 2006 onwards, and a online MOT check also shows all miles/dates match, but obviously before it was all recorded by VOSA at MOT stations, back in the 90's it showed more miles then it has now as you can see above.

What would you do??? My head is saying leave it and its £200 lost, As if I come to sell in the future would I have the same problem when someone does HPi check.

Is this a common problem with old vehicles(never bought something this old) will I be having the same thing with other vans I view as most seem to be quite low mileage for there age!!!

How many digits on the odometer? Some early vehicles only had 5, so it is possible that it hit 99,999 and then went back to zero. I haven’t had a T2 for a number of years so can’t remember, but I wouldn’t be too worried on a vehicle of this age.

 

[sidepod]

Even if it only had 55k on the clock, you’re going to fully re fresh the engine/box anyway?

Ask the question and try for a reduction in price.

At the end of the day, on a vehicle like this, mileage is meaningless unless it’s concourse which the price suggests not.

 

[Blueeyedboy]

I personally wouldn’t be too concerned from
Memory once they do reach 99999 they go back to zero. More importantly an early bay is the expensive jobs , sills, floor pans, engine etc.
Make sure all panels line up, steering box is okay no leaks or tightness.
I still miss ours even 12 years since we sold for a California.
Sounds to me like you have done your homework go for it.

 

[Calimili]

On a 52 years old car mileage is irrelevant, same as proves of maintainance in a VW authorised dealer...
I can also think the simpler explanation is that it reached 99.999 and than went to zero. So this bus has 100,000 miles more that its odometer shows, which, given the age of the vehicle , is better than if it only had 55k miles

 

[andyinluton]

At 52 years the mileage is irrelevant, buy on condition only.

 

[Scoobyboy5555]

Thanks guys, mostly positive replies and its not like im buying a 2 year old van its 52 years old, so buying on condition is more important, and this has had a full restoration, inc gearbox/engine, panels/paint etc etc so id be surprised anything is original on it.

Yes the odometer goes upto 99,999, so im guessing in 1995 it had 63k and 11 years later it was on 20k there is a good chance it went over and did 60k miles in that time.

What do you think about if I come to sell for some sort of reason in a few years, would I struggle to sell with the mileage discrepancy or just be upfront and honest?

 

[sidepod]

What do you think about if I come to sell for some sort of reason in a few years, would I struggle to sell with the mileage discrepancy or just be upfront and honest?

You did read the replies above?

 

[Lambeth Cali]

Didn’t some people reset odometers when they fitted new engines? Not sure if that’s legitimate but it may explain discrepancy.

 

[Scoobyboy5555]

You did read the replies above?

I had just woke up. and wrote it out quickly!! Had some toast and a Coffee now!

Just re-read (mind at ease now)

Thanks again for taking the time to reply!!! Never bought anything this old, its not like buying a brand new California where your only concern is if the added extras you paid for are on there.

 

[Perfectos]

The reason for my previous question is / was, I would image the current owner can account for their ownership and possibly a period of time in history , possibly backed up by some of the vehicles historic paperwork.

remember your not trying to maintain a warranty on the vehicle, you are simply checking it is sound for roadworthiness and what you want to do with it & hopefully limiting your future spend on repairs!

If the bodywork / chassis is good and has been repaired (it will have extensively ) to a high standard , the engine is a relatively inexpensive an easy thing to fix on the T2.
if you intend to keep it for a long time I would refurb the engine, in particular the heads which are prone to the Plug hole thread wearing out and not sealing properly resulting in loss of power.

to drop and engine on a T2 is pretty easy compared to modern vehicle.

You have to remember it’s an Antique, it’s going to have had lots of history and lots of work required to repair rotten panels to keep it on the road for so long.
if those repairs have been done to a high standard then that’s 9/10th of the potential costly issues sorted.

IMO an HPI check on a vehicle of that age means very little other than checking out the “Not stolen “ status for purely peace of mind that you have done all you can insofar as due diligence.

If you are confident in the above, and you have carried out the usual checks , I can see no reason not to go for it & enjoy the high and lows of ownership (mainly highs, backed up by a full Wallet)

post some photos when you have her in your grasp.

 

[Scoobyboy5555]

The reason for my previous question is / was, I would image the current owner can account for their ownership and possibly a period of time in history , possibly backed up by some of the vehicles historic paperwork.

remember your not trying to maintain a warranty on the vehicle, you are simply checking it is sound for roadworthiness and what you want to do with it & hopefully limiting your future spend on repairs!

If the bodywork / chassis is good and has been repaired (it will have extensively ) to a high standard , the engine is a relatively inexpensive an easy thing to fix on the T2.
if you intend to keep it for a long time I would refurb the engine, in particular the heads which are prone to the Plug hole thread wearing out and not sealing properly resulting in loss of power.

to drop and engine on a T2 is pretty easy compared to modern vehicle.

You have to remember it’s an Antique, it’s going to have had lots of history and lots of work required to repair rotten panels to keep it on the road for so long.
if those repairs have been done to a high standard then that’s 9/10th of the potential costly issues sorted.

IMO an HPI check on a vehicle of that age means very little other than checking out the “Not stolen “ status for purely peace of mind that your done all you can insofar as due diligence.

If you are confident in the above, and you have carried out the usual checks , I can see no reason not to go for it & enjoy the high and lows of ownership (mainly highs, backed up by a full Wallet)

post some photos when you have her in your grasp.

Thank you for your reply, As soon as I pick her up i'll get some photos up of her(hopefully not on the hard shoulder with the AA truck in the background) I honestly went to bed last night thinking that I might have to look for another van, but what everyone has already said has put my mind at ease.

Good thing is this van can sit on the drive and be used as a fun toy to go to shows and the occasional camping trip, as we have other vehicles for everything else, I just always wanted a old classic bus, I know I'm unexperienced with them but looking forward to learning including the pit falls of owning one!!!

 

[Calimili]

Thank you for your reply, As soon as I pick her up i'll get some photos up of her(hopefully not on the hard shoulder with the AA truck in the background) I honestly went to bed last night thinking that I might have to look for another van, but what everyone has already said has put my mind at ease.

Good thing is this van can sit on the drive and be used as a fun toy to go to shows and the occasional camping trip, as we have other vehicles for everything else, I just always wanted a old classic bus, I know I'm unexperienced with them but looking forward to learning including the pit falls of owning one!!!

you should keep in your mind a , in my personal view, reasonable option to look for a 1,9l diesel (golf) engine to put in there. it will considerably increase the reliability and fuel consumption, allowing you to use it more often and/or more piece of mind...

 

[Perfectos]

you should keep in your mind a , in my personal view, reasonable option to look for a 1,9l diesel (golf) engine to put in there. it will considerably increase the reliability and fuel consumption, allowing you to use it more often and/or more piece of mind...

For gods sake, if you think about this option, change the brake though, they are horrendous on a T2.

I once got a speeding ticket, hand held camera, cop jumped out between parked cars, me going down hill, I saw him applied the brake and continued to sale past him by about 50 yards with the Anchors full on !

he was chuckling whilst he wrote out my ticket for doing 35 in a 30 limit !

 

[Vagophile]

I know I'm unexperienced with them but looking forward to learning including the pit falls of owning one!!!

And your annual expenses should be reduced by not paying VED and, hopefully, classic vehicle insurance. No MoT either, but annual check advised.
I'm envious!
Photos reqired in due course.

 

[Pineweasel]

I had a 1973 Westfalia Continental for five years before I got my Cali, and it was great fun. We toured all over the UK and France with only one breakdown (clutch cable broke, but I had a spare on board). It's such a simple vehicle, so you can easily understand, maintain and fix everything, and there's tons of great info and advice out there. I quite miss mine... good luck!

 

[Lambeth Cali]

Whilst it might be unfair to suggest one of the great advantages of owning a California is to cruise past these dimwits whilst they are lifted onto a low loader at the side of the road, @Pineweasel raises a good point above.

Are you capable of fitting a clutch cable? Or other similar basic maintenance tasks?

I’ve always thought ownership of such a vehicle, whilst very tempting, is unwise if you can’t do basic mechanical stuff.

 

[rod_vw]

you should keep in your mind a , in my personal view, reasonable option to look for a 1,9l diesel (golf) engine to put in there. it will considerably increase the reliability and fuel consumption, allowing you to use it more often and/or more piece of mind...

You can't put a Golf engine in a Bay Window van (T2) it's only the Type 25 (T3) that you can do that with. A Subaru flat four water cooled may be an option but not a cheap conversion although the rear chassis rails of a 1971 are closer together than on a 1972 onwards so may preclude this. The same may apply to fitting the later larger 1700cc - 2000cc option as that was why the chassis was altered in August 1972.
Also don't forget if the engine is changed for anything that was not available as an OEM option (or very much the same design) then the vehicle still requires an annual MOT regardless of its age / 'Historic Vehicle' status.

 

[Scoobyboy5555]

Here are a few pics stolen from the for sale advert.

Totally different beast to my T6.1 Ocean, and the slowest/oldest vehicle I will probably own ever

 

[Ozzy Pete]

Could it be that the speedo has been replaced . I can imaging that most things on a 52 year old vehicle have been either repaired or replaced at some time.

 

[Lambeth Cali]

Hi guys/gals im in need of some help, I went to view a UK/RHD 1971 VW bay-window bus the weekend and left a deposit(£200) The bus was very clean and had lots of money spent on it(No rust/Rot) and boxes of invoices and everything was mint on it, So I agreed a price which for the condition and mileage (55k) was above what you would pay (£16k) as there seem to be quite a few which looked OK for £2k less, but this van stood out from the rest.

Anyway I did a HPi check when I got home and it says there is a mileage discrepancy, and says as follows:

Date recorded	Recorded by	Mileage reading	Total
14/07/1995	NMR	60000	60000
26/07/1995	NMR	63000	63000
03/10/2003	DVLA	20000	20000
20/04/2023	VOSA	55554	55554

All the MOT's all match up with the mileage from 2006 onwards, and a online MOT check also shows all miles/dates match, but obviously before it was all recorded by VOSA at MOT stations, back in the 90's it showed more miles then it has now as you can see above.

What would you do??? My head is saying leave it and its £200 lost, As if I come to sell in the future would I have the same problem when someone does HPi check.

Is this a common problem with old vehicles(never bought something this old) will I be having the same thing with other vans I view as most seem to be quite low mileage for there age!!!

How did it do 3000 miles in 12 days in 1995??

 

[Ozzy Pete]

H

Here are a few pics stolen from the for sale advert.

Totally different beast to my T6.1 Ocean, and the slowest/oldest vehicle I will probably own ever

View attachment 110628

View attachment 110629

View attachment 110630

This was the the sloooooowest oldest thirstiest and most unreliable
vehicle we ever owned.

 

[Ch1pbutty]

Whilst it might be unfair to suggest one of the great advantages of owning a California is to cruise past these dimwits whilst they are lifted onto a low loader at the side of the road, @Pineweasel raises a good point above.

Are you capable of fitting a clutch cable? Or other similar basic maintenance tasks?

I’ve always thought ownership of such a vehicle, whilst very tempting, is unwise if you can’t do basic mechanical stuff.

Haha…older vans can by fixed any proper mechanic as they are super simple, there is far less to go wrong; biggest issue is fighting rust.

Newer Calis just need a monkey and a diagnostic machine. Then they just replace, they don’t fix anything. If that dosn’t fix the issue, they just replace another part, then repeat…”computer says no”…

 

[Scoobyboy5555]

H


This was the the sloooooowest oldest thirstiest View attachment 110632and most unreliable
vehicle we ever owned.

Wow, what a great photo, What year was this?? Guessing it was in OZ??

The guy selling the T2 said it averages 25mpg, on the way back from viewing it, I managed to average 33mpg in my BMW M4 comp So if thats the case its also the most thirstiest vehicle on the drive.