Roof lowering wonky

[koups]

Hi, first time using van this year. Roof is up but I cannot
Lower it as one side comes down but the other doesn't. It may be coming down a bit but very assymmetrical.

Has anyone had this before? Not sure how we will get home if roof stuck up. I guess I might need to manually drop down.

Any thoughts or advice?

Thanks!

 

[koups]

Managed to get the roof down with the motor but one side went down much faster than the other and there was a clonk near the bottom- had to go back up a little then down again. Sounds like it needs a visit to the garage to checkover. Not ideal though as was planning on going away this weekend!

:-(

 

[Nomad]

Hi, I used the van last week in half term (2006 Cali) one owner from new 60,000 miles.
After raising roof it was noticed that the right hand side was not as tight as should be so extended again in case I had released button too early. During day roof descended significantly. I did a google search and read a good description of possible jack failure on RHS. What did I do? Well I raised roof again a used a strap to hold roof in up position for next 3 days until time to leave site. On departure day I attempted to lower roof automatically but there was no way this would be possible as RHS fell very quickly and there was a significant danger of damaging structure.
I had read about manual drop down and attempted IAW the manual page 20!!!
Advice was not available from any of the 3 dealers I phoned within 50 miles no one had ever done it.
What did I learn?
1. Remove sunglass holder and then remove lighting panel is fairly easy and not stressful.
2. To remove control panel the manual suggests using a screwdriver and easing out the panel, what you need is two not one tools and NOT a screwdriver. the panel is held by the old type car radio flexible tabs, what you need is 2 thin metal strips, one each side to allow forward and then downward movement of the panel...gently.. I used cutlery two thin knives worked well.
3.the diagram in the book is useless. The panel only has to move out 2-3 mm to be clear of the locking tabs it can then be gently rotated fwd and down, hard to describe but two people helped one on each tab.
4. Once the panel is out, there isn't a lot of free space all you can see is a 8cm-6cm shiney plate, no fixings and to the right a flat headed crew. you rotate the screw anti clockwise as directed, I did half turns waiting for something to happen and did prep upstairs and bellows for lowering, What you need is 2 or 3 FULL turns then roof descends quite quickly.
5. Now where is the tie down kit that I got with the van when new? Velcro straps and plastic attachment for roof rail slots and awning rail.....Found and used Max 60kmph...
and home slowly.
I am going to replace jack myself £100 labour to people who don't know what they are doing and in my recent experience enjoy leaving oily hand prints every where is to be avoided. Any body done it? (jack£300inc)
Help please

 

[koups]

Have a similar problem. Van currently in VW who are trying to work out what the problem is. I suspect that they will replace the hydraulics on one side. Not sure if that is the same as the jack. Will post the cost required to replace once I know!

 

[koups]

Hmm £670 to replace one hydraulic ram that is causing the roof to drop down.

Ouch...the price of having an electric roof...

 

[bvddobb]

What if one would simply rip out the electro-hydraulic stuff, and replace it by a simple hand powered system like in the T4 Westfalia's? That never breaks down. And seems a lot cheaper.

Has anyone ever done that?

 

[koups]

That's what we've been discussing. Need to find someone who could do it. Probably based on the beach roof architecture.

 

[Calicliff]

Can anyone help with an understanding of bleeding the hydraulic system.

 

[WelshGas]

Can anyone help with an understanding of bleeding the hydraulic system.

This Forum post maybe of use.

https://vwcaliforniaclub.com/threads/changing-roof-elevating-jack-roof-dropping-on-one-side.7172/

 

[sidepod]

What if one would simply rip out the electro-hydraulic stuff, and replace it by a simple hand powered system like in the T4 Westfalia's? That never breaks down. And seems a lot cheaper.

Has anyone ever done that?

The T4 system is so beautifully simple and easy.
How many threads are there on T4 roof raising/lowering issues ? Exactly.

VW solved a problem that didn't exist.

 

[WelshGas]

The T4 system is so beautifully simple and easy.
How many threads are there on T4 roof raising/lowering issues ? Exactly.

VW solved a problem that didn't exist.

And how many T4's are actually members on this Forum?

 

[sidepod]

WG, even applying proportional representation I think the number would still be zero.

As stated elsewhere, it's a bonkers, power hungry solution to a non existent problem.

I was only picking up on bvddobb's question.
I'll get back in my pram

 

[Hotel California]

@sidepod , you are totaly right .
If the roof gets wonky on your T4 you are probaly giving the best of yourselfs up there.....
The automatic roof on 5-6ers is a nice thing on its own....if you don't have issues.

 

[WelshGas]

As with most things designed to be used, non-use can cause all manner of problems.
VW probably tested the roof a 1000 or 10,000 times going up and down. But some vehicles, not all, have barely covered any milage and by inference the roof hydraulics have barely been used.
These systems rarely like being left idle for months at a time.seals dry out etc:.
Yes the T5/T6 system is more complicated and more expensive, but the hydraulic components aren't very specialised and are probably used in other applications to good effect and the hinge system is very similar to the Beach system.
I believe you are more likely to get problems from lack of use rather than overuse, and nowhere have I read in the Handbook that the vehicle should be left undisturbed for 6 months every year.

 

[caligraphy]

I had a T4 Cali with manual roof for many years. The roof was used almost daily by the first owner (a travelling salesman who slept in the van) and I used it extensively, even in the Sahara. Finally, at 260,000km, the catch needed replacing, £10 for the part, a Mk4 Golf bonnet catch. It was fast, simple to operate (spring v. gravity) and as reliable as could be. Westfalia had been doing this kind of roof for years and they knew campers. So along comes the T5. VW copy everything else from the Westfalia built T4 but, trying to go one better, they put in an electric/hydraulic roof. Why ? Why couldn't they leave it alone ? My grandmother could have popped the roof on a T4 while sipping tea in a fraction of the time it takes for a T5 roof to raise. It took no effort and was a thing of simplicty and elegance. Once I rather absent-mindedly drove it for some miles in Spain with the roof still up (boy, did I feel like a turkey). I sold that van with roughly 280,000km (almost 180,000 miles) on the dial and it was still driving like a new car. Then I bought a T5....

So the other day I decide to raise the roof on my T5. The only problem is I haven't raised the roof for some time. The roof gets almost to the top and stops, the canvas hanging as limp as a tired old lettuce. The panel says it's up. So I go to close it and it refuses. No message, no sound, just a flat refusal. I follow the manual's instructions (really not difficult to do by oneself but perhaps a bit intimidating). I locate the screw and lower the roof manually. It's a bit reluctant at first but eventually comes down. Now I get all sorts of warnings that the roof isn't lowered, the control panel won't turn off, a siren is screaming when I drive and the manual is telling me to tie it down and take it to a dealer (ker-ching ££££). There's no hydraulic or electrical failure that I can see and I suspect the problem is merely that the roof jacks are sticking, but I can see a big repair bill coming up. So I take a can of WD40 and, being careful not to overspray onto the canvas, I give all the hinges a little lube. Resetting the control panel was easy as it was already out so I simply removed and re-inserted the big connector on the back to cycle the power to the unit. All came back to normal. A few movements half-way up and down to work in the WD40 and it's as good as new. Comes straight up to full height and retracts quickly with no problems at all.

My advice : Carry some WD40, particularly if you haven't used the roof for a while. Don't pay out more money to Volk$wagen for their poorly designed roof. Even better would be to lobby VW to offer a manual roof as standard. Leave the electric roof for anyone silly enough to think it would make life easier (impress friends, etc). For me, an electric roof is just another point of failure. It adds weight, cost and complexity with no justification. Might as well have an electric bonnet opener as opening the bonnet is about as difficult as opening a manual roof. Oh, crikey, I should have said nothing. I can just see VW putting an electric bonnet on the T7. Driver's door ? Hey VW, that's also an option. What about the glove compartment ?

 

[caligraphy]

As with most things designed to be used, non-use can cause all manner of problems.
VW probably tested the roof a 1000 or 10,000 times going up and down. But some vehicles, not all, have barely covered any milage and by inference the roof hydraulics have barely been used.
These systems rarely like being left idle for months at a time.seals dry out etc:.
Yes the T5/T6 system is more complicated and more expensive, but the hydraulic components aren't very specialised and are probably used in other applications to good effect and the hinge system is very similar to the Beach system.
I believe you are more likely to get problems from lack of use rather than overuse, and nowhere have I read in the Handbook that the vehicle should be left undisturbed for 6 months every year.

You're dead right

 

[Hotel California]

@caligraphy , what have we learnt....

1st : WD40 is a great invention
2nd: T4 roof is basic and more reliable
3th: you need to sleep more often in the Cali

 

[sidepod]

I think WD40 may be beyond most users capability.

 

[caligraphy]

@caligraphy , what have we learnt....

1st : WD40 is a great invention
2nd: T4 roof is basic and more reliable
3th: you need to sleep more often in the Cali

Agree on all counts.

Good to see you're in Antwerp. My T4 was a Belgian registered van. It served as a lovely warm office in the park during many years of Brussels winters, complete with coffee maker and WiFi. As a whole the T4 was a more reliable unit. Not as flash as the T5 (nor as fast) but the only one I'd drive around the planet with complete confidence.

 

[CarrieCali]

Morning all! An... "Does this look normal to you?" question.

After 35 nights way in our Cali, with no issues in the last 4 months, we've had a bit of a scare. Over the weekend the roof was lowered three times when we moved about. One time it was early morning and cool with no issues. The latter two times it was the hottest it's been when we've lowered it. One time it came down without fully closing on one corner. Resolved by opening and carefully closing. The second morning, it got halfway down and was super wonky. Up and down again, no issues.

Lesson learned.. check before closing final inches. But is this normal?

(ps. Holy thread resurrection, batman...)

 

[calimera]

Newer thread

https://vwcaliforniaclub.com/threads/wonky-roof-lowering.25391/

Not normal ,ours was fixed under warranty.

 

[CarrieCali]

Thanks @calimera - really useful information. Not sure how me doing a search for 'wonky' and 'roof' didn't turn that one up!

 

[CarrieCali]

Well. Went to pick up the Cali today after they replaced the hydraulic pump as there eventual fix for the wonky lowering... and on collection after an hour drive not only did I find an oily streak on one of the seats, but the roof opened fine. And then wouldn't close all the way on the front corner. Not a happy boy!

Back home in the courtesy Caddy as a result. It appears that the front awning bracket is preventing it from closing fully.

Two questions.

1 - Could anyone take a photo from in front/above of their awning bracket please when the roof is closed?
2 - Can anyone confirm if I'm right in thinking that I don't have to use the servicing department of the Centre I purchased the van from please?

Much obliged.

 

[Loz]

I don’t see how the bracket could interfere there is no movement available.
Its more likely that the slider is jamming or the hook where the 2 scissors interlock is catching and riding over.

2. You can take it anywhere but now the dealer has started the work you need to give them the opertuity to put it right.

This is the front bracket with the roof up so you can see how it mounts.

I wonder if they have left a nut or something in the track where the stainless rail drops into?

 

[CarrieCali]

Thanks @Loz, appreciate the picture and answer. You're absolutely right about giving them the chance to fix it, I'm more considering future work!

We checked the runners were going smooth. There's also a big imprint against the rubber strip where the front awning bracket has been pushing against the roof seal, and I recall seeing this from Day 1 and thinking it an odd design quirk!

When you get a chance, do you mind taking a photo taken from the front and from above showing the gap between bracket and seal when the roof is closed please?