Saggy Bum

[Abx]

Sorry, if that’s level then the ground is sloping.
View attachment 86161

Perspective plus a gravel footing, trust me it’s spot on, well when being used as a daily, full tank and a weeks kit in the back it will obviously move.

 

[Abx]

I live your Cali, but if it’s been setup 100% level
I would take it back and get them to set it up properly.

Nice looking van
Might not be quite level…

Thanks, in this pic there is some perspective going on plus a gravel footing, trust me it’s spot on, well for being a daily, full tank and a weeks kit in the back it will obviously move.

 

[Abx]

Sorry on mobile out shopping and waiting for my daughter to stop clothes shopping so struggling to make one post. I had this set up at Transporter HQ with half a tank of fuel and the sort of stuff I carry about all the time so is level ‘’most’ of the time, particularly when driven daily or once I’ve unpacked and set up, driving to site and with a full tank the rear may sit a little lower. But to be honest even with a full load it’s not massively noticeable.

 

[soulstyledevon]

Saw this on Instagram.
I wonder where this Spanish guy got his setup from.
Looks 100% level to me…

 

[66tim99]

Personally my gripes with the my California is a lightness at the front going into roundabouts and strong curves at speed such as motorways, most unsettling. A certain wallowing feeling from side to side

Although I’m yet to fully test it on my new California, 70
miles with the DCC noticeably reduces this, and weights up the steering too

 

[soulstyledevon]

Update.

MOT time today and had those pesky spacers removed.
The van feels so much better. I can’t convey how unsettling it felt with those spacers installed on the back of the van.
I measure them to be 15mm. Doesn’t sound a lot, but the angle it creates on the geometry is 100% noticeable.

Just to be clear.
I’m not having a pop at CRS Performance. With regards to communication, installation and workmanship. Steve does a good job. I just think his ideas with regards to the set-up of the California isn’t quite there…
So if this is an avenue you wish to travel down. Lowered van. The Koni shocks and H&R springs weren’t bad, just wasn’t for me and my California. And remember, insist on no spacers if you want the ride level



The van is half empty. No water or clothes etc.
This is how it sits without spacers. Still room to load up, which should bring it 100% level.

 

[Mr T]

Spacers only needed if the rims have a high Offset number and used to get close to production wheel number.

eg original wheel 7"x17" with 55 Offset -- new wheel 7"x17" with 65 Offset would need a 10mm spacer to get back to 55 Offset.
Only case that I've seen for spacers is when fitting LandRover wheels to Tx vehicles as the LR Offset is wrong.

Using spacers on standard wheels causes extra loading on wheel bearings and due to basic physics also increases the leverage on the road springs causing body lowering. If on the front it also alters the steering geometry.

The post above from @soulstyledevon has nothing to do with wheel spacers.

 

[B J G]

The post above from @soulstyledevon has nothing to do with wheel spac

 

[soulstyledevon]

Sorry, just to clarify.
Shock spacers not wheel spacers

 

[Mr T]

He took then for those reasons, which confirmed why not to fit them.

Eh?

 

[tedgina]

so this is our t6 with the spacers in and koni shocks along with h&r anti roll bars fitted by CRS as you can see it about the same as yours,i must say that the van handles really well no roll into bends no under over/ steer i feel that the upgrades enhance the vehicle and it is a pleasure to drive now

 

[soulstyledevon]

Looks pretty level.
I wonder what was setup differently between your van and mine…?
Because your van now sits similar to mine, but I’ve had the spacers removed? Best thing I’ve done, because the van is now more planted. When the spacers were installed, the spirit level sat three quarters over the line…?

Glad you like the H&R lowering springs, personally not for me, it’s smoother without

 

[tedgina]

Looks pretty level.
I wonder what was setup differently between your van and mine…?
Because your van now sits similar to mine, but I’ve had the spacers removed? Best thing I’ve done, because the van is now more planted. When the spacers were installed, the spirit level sat three quarters over the line…?

Glad you like the H&R lowering springs, personally not for me, it’s smoother without

hi no lowering springs ride height is stock + rear spacers the H&R ARBS and T32 springs. at the rear and the Koni shocks

 

[soulstyledevon]

hi no lowering springs ride height is stock + rear spacers the H&R ARBS and T32 springs. at the rear and the Koni shocks

Ok
So you’ve kept the springs standard.
Have you paid for T32 springs…?
My van came from the factory with T32 springs.
What size spring spacers do you have…

 

[andyinluton]

so this is our t6 with the spacers in and koni shocks along with h&r anti roll bars fitted by CRS as you can see it about the same as yours,i must say that the van handles really well no roll into bends no under over/ steer i feel that the upgrades enhance the vehicle and it is a pleasure to drive now

Any Idea how high it is overall now?

 

[tedgina]

Ok
So you’ve kept the springs standard.
Have you paid for T32 springs…?
My van came from the factory with T32 springs.
What size spring spacers do you have…

Springs were free as CRS had some in stock, I cannot remember if the spacers are 10mm or 15mm

 

[tedgina]

Any Idea how high it is overall now?

Yes it is 2010mm empty at the rear

 

[soulstyledevon]

Springs were free as CRS had some in stock, I cannot remember if the spacers are 10mm or 15mm

So the lighter 150 Ocean has unknown springs, spacers added and is level...?
Although, now sits at over 2m...?
My 204 Ocean, just over half loaded, no spacers, Koni shocks, standard T32 springs comes in at 1975mm.

Confusing...
Plus why would you want the van over 2m...?

 

[tedgina]

So the lighter 150 Ocean has unknown springs, spacers added and is level...?
Although, now sits at over 2m...?
My 204 Ocean, just over half loaded, no spacers, Koni shocks, standard T32 springs comes in at 1975mm.

Confusing...
Plus why would you want the van over 2m...?

2meters does not worry me at all, it all must be variation in within production parameters I presume

 

[BrendanJ]

I have no doubt that VW have designed a vehicle for a wide variety of uses, loads and driving styles, not to mention the range of vans from Transporter through to full California with all the extras.
Equally if it where possible to speak with a proper VW expert, we would here the immortal words, that It is in specification, in tolerance and that the handling and characteristics will vary on usage but also completely safe and in spec.
However as Customers we are all different, as evidenced by this thread
Some seem obsessed with it looking right, however they define that and measure that
Others , me included are not entirely happy with its ride and handling, but have to accept it is most likely within the parameters designed by VW. Leaving us with lots of options on how to improve it more to our “Personal liking” for which I respectfully suggest we talk to proper specialists than take too much attention to “a forums talking heads”
Personally my gripes with the my California is a lightness at the front going into roundabouts and strong curves at speed such as motorways, most unsettling. A certain wallowing feeling from side to side especially at the back and bouncy-ness which has led at times to passengers in the back and also my dog to suffer travel sickness. ( not good in the Yorkshire dales, Lake District or the south west I expect)
I am aware that as my daily drive is a BMW 5 series I may be somewhat spoilt and for sure cannot expect a fully laden camper van to behave the same way, I am however looking for some mitigation which will almost certainly involve some compromises even on ride height which it seems impossible to square the round of either level at wheel arches or level at floor level ( and bed level)
I have consulted with specialists and without revealing details and thus entering into the nonsense debate of what is good and what is bad for which I am not qualified ( and I suspect neither are most of you) I will shortly be going ahead with their recommendations and will let you know the outcome at that time. Hopefully it will solve my problems and meet my requirements. Which again as evidenced by this thread varies so much from person to person and van to van.

So today was the big day and many thanks to the boys at CRS, only complaint is I didn’t get a tea shirt
So to the actions and results
Koni special active shocks front and back, H&R Arb front and back and rear end raised by approx 20mm with the infamous spacer additions.
The results so far after an hour and half return journey on both motorways and A roads is transformational
My non technical explanation as follows, (I will leave the technical to Steve)
Firstly front end feels Much more planted and secure on the road, gone is that feeling of lightness and under steer most obvious on roundabouts where I was previously slowing down to the annoyance of those behind me. More confidence on motorway sloping curving slip roads at speed which always felt like I was going to lose control, and even in straight lines on motorways being pushed sideways by lorries, the lightness of steering again and the tendency to sway at slightest provocation.
The shocks and arbs are providing stability both sideways, longways and up and down and even the atrocious road conditions recent years and pot holes have been smoothed out, still there and felt but much smoother
The result as I gradually re learned to drive the van with more confidence, speed in all conditions was thoroughly enjoyable to experience
The much debated lifting of the back end by 20mm is now in my mind a non issue. Frankly the appearance is barely noticeable
The bubble on the spirit level on the sink barely moves
Try it for yourself with 2 bits of decking under the rear wheels which I did and you will see how insignificant visually the change is, but the functionality so much better
I am quite sure I am not going to fall out of bed
It is very interesting to hear that Vw must have heard all the feedback and has made similar changes to the T6.1 which is all the proof we need
I look forward to now training my border terrier to enjoy the back seat again; hopefully
Again many thanks to the two Steve’s for a job well done and very glad I took there expert advice

 

[tedgina]

So today was the big day and many thanks to the boys at CRS, only complaint is I didn’t get a tea shirt
So to the actions and results
Koni special active shocks front and back, H&R Arb front and back and rear end raised by approx 20mm with the infamous spacer additions.
The results so far after an hour and half return journey on both motorways and A roads is transformational
My non technical explanation as follows, (I will leave the technical to Steve)
Firstly front end feels Much more planted and secure on the road, gone is that feeling of lightness and under steer most obvious on roundabouts where I was previously slowing down to the annoyance of those behind me. More confidence on motorway sloping curving slip roads at speed which always felt like I was going to lose control, and even in straight lines on motorways being pushed sideways by lorries, the lightness of steering again and the tendency to sway at slightest provocation.
The shocks and arbs are providing stability both sideways, longways and up and down and even the atrocious road conditions recent years and pot holes have been smoothed out, still there and felt but much smoother
The result as I gradually re learned to drive the van with more confidence, speed in all conditions was thoroughly enjoyable to experience
The much debated lifting of the back end by 20mm is now in my mind a non issue. Frankly the appearance is barely noticeable
The bubble on the spirit level on the sink barely moves
Try it for yourself with 2 bits of decking under the rear wheels which I did and you will see how insignificant visually the change is, but the functionality so much better
I am quite sure I am not going to fall out of bed
It is very interesting to hear that Vw must have heard all the feedback and has made similar changes to the T6.1 which is all the proof we need
I look forward to now training my border terrier to enjoy the back seat again; hopefully
Again many thanks to the two Steve’s for a job well done and very glad I took there expert advice

welcome to the converted club

 

[BrendanJ]

welcome to the converted club

Don’t you mean the “I’ve had me rear end done by Steve” club

 

[soulstyledevon]

welcome to the converted club

Or the sleeping upside down in the roof club…

 

[tedgina]

Yep we all know that Steve has done his job well

 

[Phoenix387]

Yep we all know that Steve has done his job well

Went to see Steve @CRS last week. Took the van 80% loaded to get the set up right. T30 original springs retained, new spacers and Koni active dampers all round. It’s a real transformation and makes the van handle like it did prior to being converted. Bump absorption is far more compliant with less rattling from the various components of the conversion. This is still running the original Davenport 17” alloys (which will be replaced with 19” alloys when the budget allows). The handling in corners is markedly improved and I did give it a bit of stick on the way home with less understeer than before but had to slow down after the pan set flew out the cupboard!

Hopefully the before and after pictures do it justice and show the change in ride height at the rear. I know some detractors will point out that it sits higher at the back now but we have set it up to be level when carrying a bit more weight than shown here and parked up on a campsite with boxes under the bed, a full water and lpg tank and our family of 4 sleeping in it. With this set up, the van now sits level without wheel ramps needed. It also removes the nail biting tension of scraping the underside when going over speed humps and festival fields fully laden.

I am very pleased with the service received from Steve and his colleague and am happy to recommend their services to other Transporter owners. Obviously this set up is no good for those who love to lower their vans but it’s worth noting that Steve can set up your van any way you choose. The more thought you give to what you actually want to achieve and take the time to explain this to Steve, the more likely you are to be satisfied with the end result. Don’t just say “cure the sag” and expect a massive change other than rear ride height. I wanted a level van when loaded, improved ride comfort and better bump absorption. A lowered appearance, body roll and sporty handling were not a priority. Steve delivered on that brief with the bonus of better handling as a result. Also, if you do plan to use them, loading the van up to the weight where you wish to see the biggest improvement is a real help in getting much closer to your desired outcome.

Before and after pics. The first one does look level but the spirit level on the kitchen said otherwise. The after pic has the benefit of low winter sunlight ruining the effect but hopefully you can see the change at the rear.