Snow chains vs snow tyres question

[Lambeth Cali]

Just a very basic question. Having watched a video comparing snow chains, snow socks, various rubbish cheap alternatives and snow tyres, I have some pretty decent Thule snow chains arriving today. I just have Continental VanContact tyres.

But my question is, if you buy snow tyres, do you need to buy 4? Will front 2 suffice?

The reason I ask is, obviously, chains etcetera come in pairs and just go on the front.

 

[briwy]

No, you need to have them all round. Even though we have a 4Motion chains only go on the front. Have you checked that the chains are OK on the wheels/tyres you have? You need to have the right combination for clearances.
Steer well clear of snow socks. They are fine driving slowly on snow but if you hit a patch of tarmac they will just tear and can wrap around the drive shafts and hubs.

 

[WelshGas]

Just a very basic question. Having watched a video comparing snow chains, snow socks, various rubbish cheap alternatives and snow tyres, I have some pretty decent Thule snow chains arriving today. I just have Continental VanContact tyres.

But my question is, if you buy snow tyres, do you need to buy 4? Will front 2 suffice?

The reason I ask is, obviously, chains etcetera come in pairs and just go on the front.

Snow tyres x 4.

Michelin advise Snow Chains on ALL 4 wheels to maintain Stability . Those on the driving wheels, FWD or RWD , provide stability and Traction.
Snow chains come in pairs because some vehicles have to have different size or type on different axles.

 

[briwy]

Snow tyres x 4.

Michelin advise Snow Chains on ALL 4 wheels to maintain Stability . Those on the driving wheels, FWD or RWD , provide stability and Traction.
Snow chains come in pairs because some vehicles have to have different size or type on different axles.

The manual for our van says front only. Makes sense to me as on a 4Motion the rears aren't driving all the time.

 

[WelshGas]

The manual for our van says front only. Makes sense to me as on a 4Motion the rears aren't driving all the time.

On the front will give front traction and stability, but what is going to provide stability on the rear?

 

[briwy]

Me

 

[RockinNRollin]

Snow socks are emergency measures only; think stuck in a car park somewhere and you need to move 50m onto a clear road. Snow chains are heavy duty for heavy duty weather; untreated roads in remote snowy parts of Europe, pretty much no use in the UK I'd argue as even in the wildest bits of Scotland you're unlikely to be on enough snow for long enough to warrant it.

Snow tyres (or even "just" proper winter tyres, but NOT "all season" which are "lite" by comparison) will give you the ability to travel on snow, ice and bare road surfaces easily. Always keep all four wheels with the same tyre type; if you only put grippy winter tyres on the front and keep all season/summer tyres on the back, you'll need to be learning to correct oversteer very quickly.

Don't underestimate the capability of proper winter tyres; it won't turn a 2WD vehicle into an overland monster, but it will keep you moving on most roads and more importantly, will allow you to come to a stop far more quickly.

 

[Lambeth Cali]

I should have said we are heading to 2000 metres in the Alps. But at Easter.

As I said, I have bought snow chains. No snow socks.

Just trying to avoid the £500+ cost of 4 snow tyres. I’ll have to think about it. Anyone got good winter tyre recommendations!?

 

[briwy]

I should have said we are heading to 2000 metres in the Alps. But at Easter.

As I said, I have bought snow chains. No snow socks.

Just trying to avoid the £500+ cost of 4 snow tyres. I’ll have to think about it. Anyone got good winter tyre recommendations!?

My avatar is our van at Easter outside our house in the Pyrenees. It can snow anytime at that height.

 

[bvddobb]

Just trying to avoid the £500+ cost of 4 snow tyres. I’ll have to think about it.

Don’t think too hard. Economising on good winter tyres in a relatively heavy and expensive car like a loaded Cali when you are likely to meet wintery conditions sits in the category pennywise poundfoolish!

 

[CaliforniaSeb]

The manual for our van says front only. Makes sense to me as on a 4Motion the rears aren't driving all the time.

I lived in Switzerland for 8 years. Winter tyres all round. I also had to use chains quite often. Legally I only needed to put chains on the front tyres (front wheel drive). Chains are used when conditions are bad, therefore I would strongly recommend chains on all the wheels.

 

[Ch1pbutty]

Might be cheaper to leave the Cali at home and take the plane, train, taxi transfer to destination

 

[CaliforniaSeb]

Might be cheaper to leave the Cali at home and take the plane, train, taxi transfer to destination

A Cali is the best form of transport and accommodation. It's a no brainer really.

 

[Lambeth Cali]

£550 for Cross Climates or £380 for Kumho WinterCraft.
I don’t like to scrimp. Dunno. Are these both suitable for van weight etc?

 

[Nand0]

Snow tyres (or even "just" proper winter tyres, but NOT "all season" which are "lite" by comparison) will give you the ability to travel on snow, ice and bare road surfaces easily.

Good luck on ice, unless you have chains or ice tyres with metal studs. Winter tyres will give you more traction than summer tyres on ice, but the difference will be from zero traction to just barely enough to give you a brown pants day

However, on snow, the difference between summer and winter tyres is night and day. Winter tyres also use a softer rubber, which gives you much better traction on clean but cold (< 6C) tarmac. Think reduced breaking distances

If you are heading for the alps on summer tyres, you can get lucky, but if it snows on the day you arrive or on the day you intend to leave, you will have to readjust your plans. Chains will let you drive, relatively slowly. On summer tyres you should be OK as long as the roads are clear and temperatures above freezing point.

@Lambeth Cali If you are planning to go to the Alps multiple times in your Cali, I would suggest you get a set of cheap steel rims and slap on some winter tyres. Peace of mind

 

[TomVT]

Just a question as I'm having difficulties seeing the tree through the woods. (if that's correct in English? )
What type of snow chains are ok for a T6.1 with 4 motion and 235/55-17" wheels? (and preferably ok for Austria as they have quite strict regulations?)
I have all season/winter tires, but if I need to buy chains anyway, I want to make sure at least they'll fit and don't damage the wheels.
Any recommendations?

 

[Tarquers]

£550 for Cross Climates or £380 for Kumho WinterCraft.
I don’t like to scrimp. Dunno. Are these both suitable for van weight etc?

i had the agilis cross climates through 2 winters and they are ok but they are not a substitute for snow tyres. Fine as a 3 season tyre but save your money for winter.

We currently have 10:cm of snow and do go to the mountains most weekends in winter so slightly biased.

 

[RockinNRollin]

Good luck on ice, unless you have chains or ice tyres with metal studs. Winter tyres will give you more traction than summer tyres on ice, but the difference will be from zero traction to just barely enough to give you a brown pants day

Agree, on ice winter tyres won't make you invincible, but they are just about passable in my experience (admittedly not in a Cali, but in a car) - my experience is ice tends to be patches or short stretches, vs snow which can be extensive. I find winter tyres will "get you over" the ice patches then back onto snow where they'll bite.

 

[andyinluton]

£550 for Cross Climates or £380 for Kumho WinterCraft.
I don’t like to scrimp. Dunno. Are these both suitable for van weight etc?

The Kumho are not suitable - 98 load rating is too low.
The cross climates are open to debate, sticker on my van ( drivers side door shut) shows 103 as the lowest rated tyres but working purely on axle weights 102 is just about OK, there are many many pages of lively discussion on earlier threads about load ratings.

215/65/16 can take snow chains with links no more than 15mm thick.

You need matching tyres both ends of the van but VW state to only put chains on the front.

 

[Lambeth Cali]

Having trawled the internet looking for tyres and not being completely clear what is a winter tyre and what is a 3/4 season tyre, I am still thinking of going with summer tyres and snow chains. Not ideal so will keep on looking/dithering.

Part of the issue is that my VanContact tyres are due for replacement anyway - not due to wear but due to the fact they are 8 yrs old. I suppose that is pushing me towards a Cross Climate-style all seasons tyre.

 

[andyinluton]

Having trawled the internet looking for tyres and not being completely clear what is a winter tyre and what is a 3/4 season tyre, I am still thinking of going with summer tyres and snow chains. Not ideal so will keep on looking/dithering.

Using summer tyres in the mountains when almost everyone else is on winters is asking for trouble, your stopping distances will be miles worse.
In deep snow you would be ok as you can use the chains & then you will be crawling around in the same situation as everyone else.
Your problem will be on a just ploughed road or where there's only say 10mm of snow - use chains there & they won't last long, you don't want them making contact with tarmac unless its unavoidable.

 

[Tarquers]

Having trawled the internet looking for tyres and not being completely clear what is a winter tyre and what is a 3/4 season tyre, I am still thinking of going with summer tyres and snow chains. Not ideal so will keep on looking/dithering.

Part of the issue is that my VanContact tyres are due for replacement anyway - not due to wear but due to the fact they are 8 yrs old. I suppose that is pushing me towards a Cross Climate-style all seasons tyre.

The Cross Climate will be fine for most of the time and are fine on snow but braking is nowhere near as good as a proper winter tyre. if you are doing a single trip to the alps and have chains, you will be fine, if you are off a metaled surface in deep snow, they are not. My disappointment with them is the braking distance and as I am in snow a lot, winters prove better value. Hope this helps.

 

[Lambeth Cali]

Using summer tyres in the mountains when almost everyone else is on winters is asking for trouble, your stopping distances will be miles worse.
In deep snow you would be ok as you can use the chains & then you will be crawling around in the same situation as everyone else.
Your problem will be on a just ploughed road or where there's only say 10mm of snow - use chains there & they won't last long, you don't want them making contact with tarmac unless its unavoidable.

The other factor that is making me think (possibly foolishly) this will all be fine is big coaches go to this resort to drop off clients with luggage etc etc so I am (naively??) assuming the road will be clear apart from possibly a dusting of snow - exactly as you describe above.

So buy snow tyres!!

I haven’t been skiing for 10 years. Never driven before. My kids have never been before. I hope that we will go again but it’s possible we won’t. Hence my resistance to buy a set of wheels and snow tyres. Otherwise I would definitely.

So buy all season tyres!!

 

[lohr500]

@Lambeth Cali

How many miles do you do a year ?

I know it is not recommended to use winter tyres in the summer, due to greater wear and longer stopping distances, etc but we have done so on my wife's SUV for ten years now. She does less than 5000 miles a year so wear in't a big factor.

Also, having driven on a skiing holiday to the French Alps a few years ago in an Audi A3 Quattro fitted with summer tyres, I would NEVER do the same again. On the packed down snow, it was a scary experience even with the Quattro giving some additional traction up the hills. On the flat and downhill, it was like permanently being on sheet ice. I had a set of chains for the front wheels, but found them impractical to keep fitting and removing between stretches of treated and untreated road on the long journey back down the mountains to the valley bottom.

In comparison, when we got there and used my godfather's beaten up front wheel drive VW Golf fitted with proper winter tyres all round, it was a completely different experience. In the summer he used to leave the winter tyres on the Golf which he kept at the resort.

 

[B J G]

@Lambeth Cali

How many miles do you do a year ?

I know it is not recommended to use winter tyres in the summer, due to greater wear and longer stopping distances, etc but we have done so on my wife's SUV for ten years now. She does less than 5000 miles a year so wear in't a big factor.

Also, having driven on a skiing holiday to the French Alps a few years ago in an Audi A3 Quattro fitted with summer tyres, I would NEVER do the same again. On the packed down snow, it was a scary experience even with the Quattro giving some additional traction up the hills. On the flat and downhill, it was like permanently being on sheet ice. I had a set of chains for the front wheels, but found them impractical to keep fitting and removing between stretches of treated and untreated road on the long journey back down the mountains to the valley bottom.

In comparison, when we got there and used my godfather's beaten up front wheel drive VW Golf fitted with proper winter tyres all round, it was a completely different experience. In the summer he used to leave the winter tyres on the Golf which he kept at the resort.

There are many areas of Europe where tyres with the 3Peak/Snowflake symbol must be fitted during winter months making it illegal to enter these areas with only summer rated tyres fitted. Additionally snow chains or socks must be carried in some more Alpine areas.
Check carewfully before making travel plans as to what the regulations are.