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T4 clutch replacement rip off ?

Borris

Borris

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I am wondering if anyone can advise me on a clutch issue that my daughter and her husband have just experienced with their 2003 T4 Autosleeper motorhome. Jon our son in law has just telephoned to say that the said vehicle has been towed to their garage of choice after the clutch pedal went to the floor and he was unable to get it into gear.

The garage concerned have said that the vehicle requires a new clutch, dual mass flywheel and clutch slave cylinder. Since the clutch was working perfectly with no juddering up to the point of failure I cannot see why the vehicle would require either a new clutch or dual mass flywheel. I have had this same issue on other vehicles in the past and it was then purely a hydraulic failure resulting in a new clutch slave cylinder and fluid replacement.

This isn't the first time they have used this garage and it won't be the first time that they have been talked into having unessesary work done.

My questions are:
1. Does a 2003 2.5 Tdi manual T4 even have a dual mass flywheel?
2. Where is the clutch slave cylinder located and can it be replaced easily without stripping down the clutch assembly?

I am no mechanic but I do have some experience gathered over years of messing about with vehicles. Therefore I am rather sceptical about this garage's list of work required and am seeking advice from any knowleable T4 owners. The vehicle has low mileage for the year, sub 100,000 miles. From memory around 75,000.

Many thanks in advance. All comments gratefully received.

P.s They are due to go off to Scotland at the beginning of October so this hasn't happened at a very convenient time. I am wondering if it is just a slave cylinder that requires changing and if so whether it is a fairly straight forward job?
 
WelshGas

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I am wondering if anyone can advise me on a clutch issue that my daughter and her husband have just experienced with their 2003 T4 Autosleeper motorhome. Jon our son in law has just telephoned to say that the said vehicle has been towed to their garage of choice after the clutch pedal went to the floor and he was unable to get it into gear.

The garage concerned have said that the vehicle requires a new clutch, dual mass flywheel and clutch slave cylinder. Since the clutch was working perfectly with no juddering up to the point of failure I cannot see why the vehicle would require either a new clutch or dual mass flywheel. I have had this same issue on other vehicles in the past and it was then purely a hydraulic failure resulting in a new clutch slave cylinder and fluid replacement.

This isn't the first time they have used this garage and it won't be the first time that they have been talked into having unessesary work done.

My questions are:
1. Does a 2003 2.5 Tdi manual T4 even have a dual mass flywheel?
2. Where is the clutch slave cylinder located and can it be replaced easily without stripping down the clutch assembly?

I am no mechanic but I do have some experience gathered over years of messing about with vehicles. Therefore I am rather sceptical about this garage's list of work required and am seeking advice from any knowleable T4 owners. The vehicle has low mileage for the year, sub 100,000 miles. From memory around 75,000.

Many thanks in advance. All comments gratefully received.

P.s They are due to go off to Scotland at the beginning of October so this hasn't happened at a very convenient time. I am wondering if it is just a slave cylinder that requires changing and if so whether it is a fairly straight forward job?
Yes, there is a Dual Mass Flywheel.
I believe the clutch slave cylinder is within the bell housing. Often the clutch is contaminated so needs replacing and most people replace the DMF at the same time.

One other thing, the clutch peddle support can fail. Easier repair.

 
bxl_lad

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I'm not an expert, but recently had some problems with my slave cylinder leaking. My mechanic told me in the later T4s , the slave cylinder is within the transmission housing. The only way to get to it was to drop the gearbox out (and i think to some extent the engine - if I understood him well, my French isn't perfect!).
He said it would be a very labour intensive job and therfore costly. Luckily for me for the moment the leak isn't huge and can be contained by topping up the reservoir, but if this diagnosis is correct then maybe their garage is working on the basis that if they've got to do the transmission, then replace those parts while they're there...
Like I say I'm not an expert but just sharing my experience...
But I would suggest at the very least a second opinion from another garage.
Good luck
 
mrcheesbrough

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There are two hydraulic parts to a T4 clutch - they have a master cylinder too which is in the pedal cluster and the slave. The slave on these is found inside the bellhousing of the gearbox. Assuming it is the slave rather than the master cylinder it’s a gearbox out job making it about as expensive as changing the full clutch. A similar theory applies to the water pump change when getting the timing belt changed.

Dual Mass flywheel? Yes, they do indeed.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
 
Perfectos

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Some reading

edit:
 
Last edited:
Borris

Borris

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Thanks to @WelshGas, @bxl_lad and @mrcheesbrough for both your knowledge and assistance. I've been checking out Youtube videos on this subject and have noted that if its the clutch master cylinder that's gone then I may be able to change that and bleed the system for them. However, I wouldn't want to attempt the clutch, slave cylinder and dual mass flywheel replacement as that sounds like an awful lot of hassle. Also I don't really have the facilities and my grumbling knees wouldn't like it either.

So it looks as if the garage may be correct in their diagnosis and remedial action plan. If true, that won't be good news as it will swallow up their holiday fund and more and scupper their plans to tour Scotland next month. :headbang

Thanks again to you all for your prompt replies. :thumb
 
Borris

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Some reading

edit:
Thanks Perfectos,
Very useful information which will come in very useful.

It seems to me that the course of action should be as follows:
1. Check the pedal bracket isn't defective.
2. Fit the pedal bracket strengthener.
3. Replace the clutch master cylinder and bleed the system.
4. If it's still defective start getting other quotes.

Whilst it isn't my problem I really feel for them especially as a similar thing happened to their previous campervan just before an extended trip around Europe. This van is a low mileage example in excellent condition so was supposed to be a less costly replacement!

Anyway many thanks. :thumb
 
Perfectos

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Thanks Perfectos,
Very useful information which will come in very useful.

It seems to me that the course of action should be as follows:
1. Check the pedal bracket isn't defective.
2. Fit the pedal bracket strengthener.
3. Replace the clutch master cylinder and bleed the system.
4. If it's still defective start getting other quotes.

Whilst it isn't my problem I really feel for them especially as a similar thing happened to their previous campervan just before an extended trip around Europe. This van is a low mileage example in excellent condition so was supposed to be a less costly replacement!

Anyway many thanks. :thumb
Always start off with the least costly potential and easiest fix work guys toward the big ticket items / hassle

good luck Borris, bless you, your Fam are fortunate to have you
 
soulstyledevon

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If it helps.
I had mine replaced years back. Instead of going to VW for the clutch we went elsewhere and fitted the clutch/dmf from LUK. If I remember correctly, it was significantly cheaper and handled the additional 65bhp that we added with engine mods.
Worth a look.
 
Borris

Borris

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My son in law has just sent me the garage's estimate for the replacement clutch, dmfw and slave cylinder. All in with parts and labour, the estimate is just under £1400 which given the cost of parts and the time it will take, didn't strike me as being that bad. If the garage can do the work before they are due to go away then it's probably best just to tell them to get on with it. I'll even pay if it means our Cali stays here on our drive!

I would like to explore the faulty pedal bracket issue and master cylinder replacement first though.
 
sidepod

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First thing I would check is the the pedal/bracket hasn’t failed. Notorious on some VWs. Easy repair if it is.
I paid approx £1500 for a complete clutch/DM flywheel/slave cyl etc 5 years ago so price quoted looks ok.
 
BrugseB

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So it looks as if the garage may be correct in their diagnosis and remedial action plan. If true, that won't be good news as it will swallow up their holiday fund and more and scupper their plans to tour Scotland next month.
But then again, as loving caring father, you could consider an early Xmas present :happy
 
sidepod

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It seems unlikely a slave cyl would fail in a binary sense, they tend to get weak over time which makes me question the pedal.
If it is a slave cyl then it makes little sense to do the job and not replace the whole lot unless you can confirm the mileage/condition of the flywheel/clutch.
 
Borris

Borris

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It seems unlikely a slave cyl would fail in a binary sense, they tend to get weak over time which makes me question the pedal.
If it is a slave cyl then it makes little sense to do the job and not replace the whole lot unless you can confirm the mileage/condition of the flywheel/clutch.
Thanks @sidepod.
From the various Youtube videos I have watched it does look like that pedal bracket is the first thing to check. Number two being the clutch master cylinder.

Also, since I found out the the slave cylinder in the later models is located inside the clutch bell housing, I agree that if that has to come off then it would be daft not to do the whole lot at the same time. :thanks
 

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