T6.1 Ocean - 13 days, 594 miles...

[subthree]

I’d reject that vehicle. Brand new engine running without / low on oil. Not something you’d want.

I’d get them to order you a new one and keep the one you have until it arrives.

I like that idea, good shout. I could then make the reg and VIN number of this one well known. Thank you.

 

[subthree]

Totally get your frustration, have you told VW that your holiday will be cancelled if the vehicle is not fixed immediately?
This somewhat ups the pressure on them as you are able to make a claim against them for consequential loss.

I would be surprised if I could claim consequential loss against VW UK.

I did terminate the second one hour call on Thursday to VW UK by saying "Do not send me a £20 M&S voucher when this is sorted. I am looking for at least £1k for all the hassle of the last 50 weeks".

 

[Legin]

Thanks Simon.

These are the images of the damage - could I ask you if you have any idea how it may have happened? The hole in the tyre is epic!



View attachment 63450

I would say thats fretting damage. If you look hard the writing has worn away. A cut would be the same thickness around the edges which it isnt. Something in transport has been rubbing it.

 

[Perfectos]

I would be surprised if I could claim consequential loss against VW UK.

I did terminate the second one hour call on Thursday to VW UK by saying "Do not send me a £20 M&S voucher when this is sorted. I am looking for at least £1k for all the hassle of the last 50 weeks".

Your loss is directly with the Dealer, where your contract is !

The loss of your Holiday, can be avoided, particularly if they lend you a Cali Or fix yours, If they fail to act and prevent the future loss, You can claim consequential loss. Particularly as the fault is with a Brand new Van.

Are you aware you only have a very limited time to reject the vehicle ! ( if that’s the route you go down) DYOR and dont leave it too long, the dealers are not beyond playing a time game so the Rejection cannot be made based on the rejection time having elapsed !

 

[Perfectos]

Hi Subthree

I feel your pain and utter frustration.

May I suggest you inform the dealer of your impending holiday and the potential loss, advising the costs for the whole holiday and your intention to claim that from them if they do not act to prevent that loss.

Consequential loss is a “special” loss, the dealer has to do all they can to limit your loss due to the “defective” product they provided you and lack of apparent action to inform you of the problem and find a suitable solution.

Their lack of action to correct the issue and avoid your “ future loss” and “ ongoing loss” of the lesuire vehicle you bought specifically for your personal enjoyment and that of your family, which has now resulted in a very stressful situation and potential loss of your family holiday, not to mention the massive inconvenience.
Get the cost to hire a new California your holiday and tell the dealer that is what you will do if they do not either fix yours appropriately in time or provide a replacement vehicle for the full duration of the Holiday, including insurance ( you can only have one vehicle insured on your policy presumably)

There are others special losses you could claim relating to the stress , loss of enjoyment etc.

Suggest you put everything in one long email and get it fired off to the Dealer, forget trying VW, the contract is with the dealer.

It’s a mine field when rejecting, you need to act very quickly otherwise the dealer wins.


Good luck, I don’t envy you the BS you will get over the next week or so, but you need to be firm and state what you expect the dealer to reasonably do to prevent your loss of Holiday and then what they intend to do to return your vehicle and to you and how much “ Goodwill” you expect being a reasonable customer!

 

[Perfectos]

From the web site link attached, have a read and get a feel for the approach you need to take

Damages in Car Cases - Gough Square Chambers

1. Damages where buyer has lawfully rejected the vehicle 1.1 Section 54 of the Sale of Goods Act 1979 (“SGA 1979”) provides: “Nothing in this Act affects the right of the buyer or seller to recover interest or special damages in any case where by law interest or special damages may be...

goughsq.co.uk

 

[AlisonF]

Following in from @Perfectos advice above, I would suggest letting dealer know you are also escalating with VWCS. Send the same email through to VWCS. In my own experience, where I have had a couple of nightmarish scenarios, there has then been discussion between the two and I have had a good resolution (more than a £20 M&S voucher). And all sorted professionally and amicably.
Good luck and I hope your situation is treated seriously as it deserves to be.

 

[subthree]

Hi Subthree

I feel your pain and utter frustration.

May I suggest you inform the dealer of your impending holiday and the potential loss, advising the costs for the whole holiday and your intention to claim that from them if they do not act to prevent that loss.

Consequential loss is a “special” loss, the dealer has to do all they can to limit your loss due to the “defective” product they provided you and lack of apparent action to inform you of the problem and find a suitable solution.

Their lack of action to correct the issue and avoid your “ future loss” and “ ongoing loss” of the lesuire vehicle you bought specifically for your personal enjoyment and that of your family, which has now resulted in a very stressful situation and potential loss of your family holiday, not to mention the massive inconvenience.
Get the cost to hire a new California your holiday and tell the dealer that is what you will do if they do not either fix yours appropriately in time or provide a replacement vehicle for the full duration of the Holiday, including insurance ( you can only have one vehicle insured on your policy presumably)

There are others special losses you could claim relating to the stress , loss of enjoyment etc.

Suggest you put everything in one long email and get it fired off to the Dealer, forget trying VW, the contract is with the dealer.

It’s a mine field when rejecting, you need to act very quickly otherwise the dealer wins.


Good luck, I don’t envy you the BS you will get over the next week or so, but you need to be firm and state what you expect the dealer to reasonably do to prevent your loss of Holiday and then what they intend to do to return your vehicle and to you and how much “ Goodwill” you expect being a reasonable customer!

I would just like to say a massive thank you for the time you have taken to respond. The fact that I am unlikely to ever meet you (although I also live in south Hertfordshire, near to a Roman city!) is testament to the amazing people on here who generously give their time for the benefit of others. You are very kind, thank you so much.

In fairness the dealer he has already stated that they are happy to refund our vehicle. However our kids are 8 & 6 and all we want to do is create some special times. We do not have time to deal with this nonsense.

Thank you, genuinely appreciated.

 

[subthree]

Following in from @Perfectos advice above, I would suggest letting dealer know you are also escalating with VWCS. Send the same email through to VWCS. In my own experience, where I have had a couple of nightmarish scenarios, there has then been discussion between the two and I have had a good resolution (more than a £20 M&S voucher). And all sorted professionally and amicably.
Good luck and I hope your situation is treated seriously as it deserves to be.

Alison, I would also like to say a big thank you to you for your input. Good luck with your new toy!

 

[Perfectos]

I would just like to say a massive thank you for the time you have taken to respond. The fact that I am unlikely to ever meet you (although I also live in south Hertfordshire, near to a Roman city!) is testament to the amazing people on here who generously give their time for the benefit of others. You are very kind, thank you so much.

In fairness the dealer he has already stated that they are happy to refund our vehicle. However our kids are 8 & 6 and all we want to do is create some special times. We do not have time to deal with this nonsense.

Thank you, genuinely appreciated.

Hi Subthree

I can only imagine how frustrated you must be and feeling let down, the time it took me to respond is nothing compared to the stress you must be feeling,

It’s what makes the Cali scene what it is, we’re better together, sometimes all you need is some support and understanding, which you will find in spades on this forum and in the VW community in general.

I know that Roman strong Hold Very well, just down the road from me.

Good luck in whatever you decide to do, don’t throw the baby out with the bath water. If this ones not for you, look again the kids will thank you for it in the future.

Hire one for the summer holiday?

 

[AlisonF]

I would just like to say a massive thank you for the time you have taken to respond. The fact that I am unlikely to ever meet you (although I also live in south Hertfordshire, near to a Roman city!) is testament to the amazing people on here who generously give their time for the benefit of others. You are very kind, thank you so much.

In fairness the dealer he has already stated that they are happy to refund our vehicle. However our kids are 8 & 6 and all we want to do is create some special times. We do not have time to deal with this nonsense.

Thank you, genuinely appreciated.

I sincerely hope you and the kids get to have your dream vehicle. Maybe look into other dealers and find one that is really interested in you and the personal contact. I read about many on here. (I know my own dealer is and trying to improve).
I just feel it would be so sad to give up on the dream for yourselves and the kids. I would advise looking for another dealer and trying to forget the passed year... hard though it may be...

 

[subthree]

From the web site link attached, have a read and get a feel for the approach you need to take

Damages in Car Cases - Gough Square Chambers

1. Damages where buyer has lawfully rejected the vehicle 1.1 Section 54 of the Sale of Goods Act 1979 (“SGA 1979”) provides: “Nothing in this Act affects the right of the buyer or seller to recover interest or special damages in any case where by law interest or special damages may be...

goughsq.co.uk

View attachment 63458

I know I need to do some research this evening. However, do you think, legally, it is reasonable to be "loaned" the current vehicle whilst a replacement is ordered from the factory?

Thank you again, very happy to drop off a case of something north of our lovely Roman city

 

[Perfectos]

I know I need to do some research this evening. However, do you think, legally, it is reasonable to be "loaned" the current vehicle whilst a replacement is ordered from the factory?

Thank you again, very happy to drop off a case of something north of our lovely Roman city

Enteriely reasonable given the circumstances and if the dealer wants to do the right thing, some on here have been allowed to keep a rejected vehicle whilst their new order is built and delivered

 

[Perfectos]

Hi Subthree

Your request would not be unreasonable to expect the use of a / the van for your holiday and until the new order could be fulfilled, it’s not a case of legality it a case of the right thing for the dealer / VWuk to do.

Particularly if you agree to a replacement vehicle ( new order)

Your offer is very kind, but unnecessary.

It comes down to the dealers own scruples, whether they do the right thing or not

 

[Jay20cali]

Hi subthree in 2011 I bought a pre Reg California from listers Worcester ...I had the van around a week and found out they had sold me a 180 not a 140 what I wanted? Thought it was a bit nippy
It may sound daft but for various reasons I didn’t want a 180.
Listers was very understanding and ordered me a new van to replace it,letting me keep the old van until it came.
I reluctantly didn’t want to use it incase it got damaged and they wouldn’t accept it back, so it sat on our driveway for 3months.
So they can let you use that van until a new van comes.i suppose it’s all down to your relationship with the dealership .
Either way the best of luck to you all.

 

[subthree]

Hi subthree in 2011 I bought a pre Reg California from listers Worcester ...I had the van around a week and found out they had sold me a 180 not a 140 what I wanted? Thought it was a bit nippy
It may sound daft but for various reasons I didn’t want a 180.
Listers was very understanding and ordered me a new van to replace it,letting me keep the old van until it came.
I reluctantly didn’t want to use it incase it got damaged and they wouldn’t accept it back, so it sat on our driveway for 3months.
So they can let you use that van until a new van comes.i suppose it’s all down to your relationship with the dealership .
Either way the best of luck to you all.

Thank you again.

This forum reaffirms that there are actually lots of very good people in the world who just want to help, a genuine big thank you.

 

[kurienp]

Thank you again.

This forum reaffirms that there are actually lots of very good people in the world who just want to help, a genuine big thank you.

Subthree, I can feel your frustration but hats off to your patience and the practical approach.

I was quite upset when the dealer lost my v5c and there was a five week delay before I could collect my van after the replacement v5c was issued. The next day, there was a loan Cali on my driveway to use until my v5c came in.

You deserve a loan Cali more than anything else, while the dealer works with vwcs to get you a replacement.

 

[subthree]

Just to reiterate how much both myself, and Mrs Subthree, have appreciated everyone's comments, suggestions and support. Mrs Subthree actually read the entire thread last night.

Just had an update that the oil leak was caused by a split in the "oil return pipe from the turbo". If that is the sole cause of the leak, which given the vast quantity of oil used in such a short period must point to some form of gross failure rather than internal oil consumption within the engine, would the general consensus be get it fixed and move on in life? It does have a 4-year warranty.

 

[WelshGas]

Just to reiterate how much both myself, and Mrs Subthree, have appreciated everyone's comments, suggestions and support. Mrs Subthree actually read the entire thread last night.

Just had an update that the oil leak was caused by a split in the "oil return pipe from the turbo". If that is the sole cause of the leak, which given the vast quantity of oil used in such a short period must point to some form of gross failure rather than internal oil consumption within the engine, would the general consensus be get it fixed and move on in life? It does have a 4-year warranty.

Yes. Unfortunately things happen that's why there is a warranty after all. The "low oil" monitoring system worked and the cause is outside of the engine and on the turbo return.
I had the EGR fail at 900 miles, replaced and now a shade short of 100k miles of happy motoring and many memories.

 

[Swissian]

This is so good hear.
As I said previously, I have not heard of engine issues on any forum and so I believe this is a one off.
I would get it fixed and move on, and live your dream with your family.
I would also push to get the warranty extended, either as good will from the dealer or preferably from VW.
If they refuse, I would escalate to VW personally.

 

[BeagleMum]

Just to reiterate how much both myself, and Mrs Subthree, have appreciated everyone's comments, suggestions and support. Mrs Subthree actually read the entire thread last night.

Just had an update that the oil leak was caused by a split in the "oil return pipe from the turbo". If that is the sole cause of the leak, which given the vast quantity of oil used in such a short period must point to some form of gross failure rather than internal oil consumption within the engine, would the general consensus be get it fixed and move on in life? It does have a 4-year warranty.

Personally yes, but fully understand if you decide not to. If you do, push dealer for a show of good faith, an extension to 5 years on your warranty and something you would like for the van. Mats, mattress, bike rack or similar for the inconvenience. Best of luck whatever your decision.

 

[kurienp]

Personally yes, but fully understand if you decide not to. If you do, push dealer for a show of good faith, an extension to 5 years on your warranty and something you would like for the van. Mats, mattress, bike rack or similar for the inconvenience. Best of luck whatever your decision.

I like this suggestion. The engine warning came on in time and the engine per-se would not have suffered any damage as you also filled in oil in time. As Swissian also says, the fault it outside of the engine, in the turbo return and once fixed, it will be fine again.

I would personally get it fixed and get on with it ... and as soon as you start to enjoy your travels, this will be a distant memory ...

 

[MattBW]

Thanks for your kind words.

TBH after 50 weeks of nonsense from VW I am quite happy to reject the vehicle, get a refund and forget the whole campervan dream. It's been nothing but hassle. VW UK aren't interested, they just push it back to the dealer all the time. Terrible performance when you are spending so much money.

Why are you selling your Ocean?

I am so sorry to hear your news, must be incredibly upsetting and frustrating and glad to hear its potentially something simple as a fix.


It reminds me of my last car. Before I got my cali, I really wanted an Alfa Romeo Brera. Everyone joked and said about how it will break down. I picked up my 2nd hand Alfa Romeo Red Brera, driving carefully home on the first day the engine light came on. The engine failed. I got a refund, service history was fake, ex lease car badly treated, but I still wanted a Brera.

A few months later I found a black brera, lower miles, cheaper and newer. That car was trouble free for 5 or 6 years. I loved it so much that I kept it longer than the 3 years I planned to. All the time everyone was surprised I risked it again but the day I sold it, it still had not let me down..

I guess the point Im trying to make is, VWs are generally reliable motors, they aren't Alfa's and I am so glad I didnt let the short term upset get in the way of the dream I had. I had 6 years of hugely enjoyable motoring in that Alfa, I sold it only to buy my california and I have had another 5 years of trouble free motoring too.

I don't blame you if you want to reject it, but I wouldn't give up on the dream entirely because it's so worth it!

 

[subthree]

I guess the point Im trying to make is, VWs are generally reliable motors, they aren't Alfa's and I am so glad I didnt let the short term upset get in the way of the dream I had. I had 6 years of hugely enjoyable motoring in that Alfa, I sold it only to buy my california and I have had another 5 years of trouble free motoring too.

I don't blame you if you want to reject it, but I wouldn't give up on the dream entirely because it's so worth it!

If it is just the split oil pipe then that should be the issue over with and we can move on. I used to have an Audi A4 TFSI which eventually drank 1 litre of oil per 1,000 miles. If I type "VW Transporter 2.0TDi oil consumption" in to Google I do not seem to get any engine issues reported. Also the level of mileage your typical Cali does, and the way it is probably pampered, is no doubt far lower level of abuse than the typical commercial Transporter run in a fleet.

Another reason I do not want to really reject the vehicle and go to another dealer with a new order is due to the level of discount on this T6.1. This was due to the damaged T6 which arrived last October. Subject to this van being correctly reclassified as PLG rather than a luxury car (sorry to be crass here and discuss cash) then we will have paid £55k for a vehicle with a current list of circa £68k. With a four-year warranty (current VW offer) as well I think we will be ok

 

[Kernowboy]

Yes, get it fixed and move on. It happens, and for me there is a big difference between a genuine manufacturing fault which it sounds like this is and avoidable process failure or poor dealer service which I would be much less inclined to forgive. You’ve had a catalogue of failings, which it sounds like you have at least been partially compensated for through the van cost. For me this is different, in that it sounds like a 1 off part failure without any longer term trend. So it really boils down to how the dealer has dealt with this - and if that is well then I wouldn’t be looking for anything more that increases the ever increasing ‘compensation culture’. So, if anything, a warranty extension would seem appropriate if you had any concern of potential lasting damage but I think that unlikely assuming it wasn’t run if the oil pressure low (red) warning was shown (vice the yellow low level).