VW California T5 ONLY Roof Corrosion - General Discussion

T6 CFO said:

I'm going to pick up my first Cali in a few days so have no experience of this issue. Yet!
From what I've read on here over the last year I can't see there being much choice other than legal action.
I suspect there are many people out there who simply have no idea about this issue and VW are going to be liable for a great many more repairs if and when they find out.
I suspect there was a willingness at one stage to correct this fault but it seems that the fix is either not working too expensive or both and they are kicking the issue down the road.
Good luck and my sympathies.


Mike

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In response to the request for an update, my 2008 Cali had the bubbles/paint affected on the front panel long before I had heard of the corrosion issue - I didn't understand why it had occurred but as it was a fairly small area I had it repaired by a local body shop that is good. No sign of anything else so far .....

I am becoming increasingly concerned that VW are going to wash their hands of this and leave many of us high and dry with corroding vans we can't fix.

Think back to the start of this saga - there was a major repair, no expense spared. Our vans were going to be picked up on a low-loader from our homes and courtesy campers dropped off for the duration.

Now the affected vans are a few years old (4 in my case) we've had our accepted claims cancelled, been told to get a new claim on the system and get in another queue for a new quick repair that puts a load of primer and a patch over the faulty part. According to posts above, we have to take our vans to the body shop or dealer ourselves and don't get courtesy vehicles.

It seems clear to me VW have strung this out until it's older news, older vans, many 2nd or 3rd owners and they can scale down their response accordingly. They've repeatedly kicked the ball into the long grass and now seem to be walking away. By the time I get repaired (if at all) my van will be well out of warranty with no comeback if it fails.

I think the suggestion of trying BBC Watchdog is a good one. I've had a look and it's quite simple to log a story to investigate. I'll do mine. I think the more people who also do it, the more likely it is that the BBC will investigate.

Here's a link to the suggestion page: https://ssl.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b006mg74/contact

I have also contacted Trading Standards. Link: Citizens Advice consumer service on 03454 04 05 06.

They advised that there are two legal approaches.

Firstly - we can make a claim against a specific warranty. I believe we would have a good case here since many of us have had our claims accepted at some time by VW. I think we'd have to get a Solicitor to follow this up. I've got some legal advice as part of insurance so will investigate that next week.

Secondly - we can make a claim to the company that sold us our vehicles under the Sales Of Goods Act 1979. It states that our vans must be of satisfactory quality and fit for purpose. Clearly paint flaking off is not satisfactory quality so we can ask for either a repair, replacement or refund. (The time we've been using our vans may become a factor in refund or replacement).

So I've been advised to write (recorded delivery) to the dealer who sold me the vehicle stating the problem and that it doesn't meet the quality requirement of the Sale Of Goods Act 1979 and ask for the action I want - and stipulate when I want the reply by. In my case, I will ask for them to reply within 10 working days with a repair date within 1 month. If I don't get a satisfactory resolution I am to go back to the Trading Standards on the number above with my ref. no and they'll take it up.

It was longer to write all that than to make the call to the number above.

Again - the more people who contact the Trading Standards on the number above and log a problem, the higher profile it will become.

Sorry for the long post but I think we've got more chance of ensuring VW honour their commitment if we act together and these two links give relatively easy ways to do that I think.

Well I've done the Watchdog submission - it was very quick and easy.
I've mentioned that lots of vans have been affected.
Hopefully if more people submit similar stories they'll be looking out for them.
Regards

Watchdog Link: https://ssl.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b006mg74/contact

Just thought I'd give you an update on my roof corrosion experience, which has been a lot easier than some I've read about on this forum.

I have a 2009 California 174bhp. I noticed a small amount of roof corrosion when the van was between 4 and 5 years old. Only later and after I read about the corrosion issues on this forum did I realise this was a far bigger problem than just on my California.

When the van was 5 years and 4 months old in, August 2014, I took it to my local dealer, Breeze Southampton, who took some pictures and submitted my claim to VW. My claim was for both the front panel which had a couple of very small areas of corrosion and the roof which had more along both sides just above the rubber seal. On 22nd September I heard from AB Crush panel craft that I was in the queue to have the corrosion sorted by them. At the time I mentioned that I did not need a replacement California while they were repairing mine (I read on the forum they may complete the work quicker if I did this) and I have a car to use while the California is away (although that's a Golf with the dirty diesel engine -but that's another story).

In June 2015 I received a call from AB Crush offering to repair the corrosion the second week of July 2015. On the Friday before the scheduled repair they arranged for the AA to pick up the California from my house. Ten days later My California arrived back home, on the back of a recovery lorry, fully repaired and gleaming like new.
AB Crush kept me informed during the repair process, they also repaired a small scratch on the sliding door trim and passenger door mirror while they had the vehicle. The corrosion is no longer there and hasn't resurfaced in the past 12 months. The roof canvas seems even better and more taught than when I sent it to them and it came back having had a full clean up and polish.

Thanks to the Forum for making me aware I should get VW to repair the roof corrosion under warranty, and to get it done within 6 years, thanks to Breeze for processing the claim so quickly and to AB Crush for doing a fantastic repair job. You would never know it's been repaired and painted and all this was completed in 9 months from start to finish.

Maybe I was just lucky, but I have no complaints.

Chris

chrislilp said:

AB Crush for doing a fantastic repair job.

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Although we had a long wait I can not fault the actual work under taken by AB Crush. I consider myself lucky it was done before the quicker fix was put place

Has a formal club complaint been made to VW in Germany? I ask as anything on the BBC will ruin your trade in value if broadcast to the whole world. I think the problem here is the useless VWUK customer service which doesn't seem to have competent staff. Sorry should read staffed by incompetent and uninterested individuals.

Personally I would not worry about trade-in values.

This stink is disgraceful, it will emerge and that will taint residuals anyway.

I had a separate and comparatively minor issue last year and can wholly sympathise as I found customer service to be dilatory, arrogant, ineffectual and dismissive.

Paul is totally right. BBC, every motoring mag, local MP, trade minister, prime minister,

600 stories of what we read here should get a reaction somewhere.

1 complaint to the BBC is a disgruntled customer, 2 complaints is 2 disgruntled customers, 10 is interesting and 100 is worthy of investigation and a 1000 hits the headlines.
The problem is known and accepted by VW and a supposed fix is available BUT 3 years of shambolic customer service is not. They sorted out the emmisions scandal and compensation in the USA in short order.
Maybe they should give everyone who has lodged a claim £5000 and let the owner sort it themselves.

+1 for contatcting Watchdog, I am doing this now, it is very simple to do: https://ssl.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b006mg74/contact

Sod trade in values, VW would love us to just roll over, from what I have read people have tried everything so next step media

As @Custardtart posted here is the link again https://ssl.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b006mg74/contact

I also would not be concerned about trade in values. If this makes VW come up with a proper, well implemented solution, then buyers will be confident that the vehicle has been repaired correctly with associated paperwork to prove it. With the current cheap repair, VW are the winners by forcing customers to accept a far from satisfactory cover up that is not implemented on brand new vehicles. This has to be fought by all affected and as in the USA, VW will have to do the right thing.

So people still waiting for the fix, what are the main reasons we are unhappy? The way I see it:

Length of time to have problem fixed ( some people over 2.5 years)
Having to re submit claims
New cheaper fix
No longer getting our vehicles collected and returned
No loan California
Terrible service from VWCS

On top of this I have never had anything in writing about my claim, I am also a bit peed off we no longer get a new bellows ( that is a side issue though)

Also, does anyone know what the situation is in Germany?

If different, despite us STILL being part of the EU for at least 2 years then this is just not acceptable.

MadMechanic said:

So people still waiting for the fix, what are the main reasons we are unhappy? The way I see it:

Length of time to have problem fixed ( some people over 2.5 years)
Having to re submit claims
New cheaper fix
No longer getting our vehicles collected and returned
No loan California
Terrible service from VWCS

On top of this I have never had anything in writing about my claim, I am also a bit peed off we no longer get a new bellows ( that is a side issue though)

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For me the priority is to get a top quality repair as soon as possible.

I would however also add to the list compensation for years of hassle and worry and years of driving around in a rusty van despite buying new with warranty to avoid just this scenario.

Strange how many people disagree re description of VWUK customer service
(I think the problem here is the useless VWUK customer service which doesn't seem to have competent staff. Sorry should read staffed by incompetent and uninterested individuals).
or that residuals may be compromised.

I understand bitterness towards VW. I had many issues with leaking windows in my earlier T5 and eventually contacted the manufacture direct and resolved the problem. Again have we contacted the German directors as a club?

VWCS are possibly the worst customer service I have ever dealt with, they never phone back, they talk to you like you as if you are an idiot, it is a total contrast to my wife who has a Mercedes ( not an expensive one) their customer service is brilliant, all calls followed up with call back, you even get a survey after you called them and all problems are actually resolved . I think the problem with VWCS that we use it is the COMMERCIAL division, they think we are all builders or couriers who don't give a stuff, they dont realise we have £60k vehicles.

California's need a dedicated customer services team just for California's - even if it is a one man team this wouldmake all the difference

Digger said:

Strange how many people disagree re description of VWUK customer service
(I think the problem here is the useless VWUK customer service which doesn't seem to have competent staff. Sorry should read staffed by incompetent and uninterested individuals).
or that residuals may be compromised.

I understand bitterness towards VW. I had many issues with leaking windows in my earlier T5 and eventually contacted the manufacture direct and resolved the problem. Again have we contacted the German directors as a club?

Click to expand...

I see your point but this goes further than VWUK. Someone way up the pay scale is pulling the strings here to see what they can get away with without due consideration to their customers. Regarding residuals, try picking up a rusted out splitty for low money of a beat up synchro. We have iconic vehicles and they are going to be around for a long time despite a bit of corrosion.

had the front panel corrosion for over two years, after logging it had a letter confirming it ad been approved, 2 years to the day later no news so rang VWCS and was told the wording of the letter was wrong, but they took my details and promised to call me back the same day. they did that and offered me two options it could be taken the following week and would take 1-2 weeks to fix or i could wait 6 weeks and have a loan Cali, as i didn't need to loaner at that time I took the first option. a few days later the garage rang me to confirm the arrange the collection. it was collected and a week later returned as new again, you could see the repair and the new parts much better than the original even had a new canvass top part that was for the new T6 and is better than what was the original. For me one phone call fixed the problem with great ease and WVCS were very good.

I've reported the problem to watchdog now using the link at the top of the thread.

The response of VW on this issue is appalling. If I don't get a repair date arranged by the end of the year I'm going to start investigating what legal action can be taken, my daughter has just got a job with one of the biggest law firms in the world, so I'll start there and see what she can suggest. Between now and then I'm going to consider what would be reasonable recompense for the situation, that's not easy but I think it would fall into two categories:

1) Compensation for loss of enjoyment of the vehicle, time spent chasing the problem and the stress incured. An amount per unit of time since the problem was reported would seem appropriate. Current thinking, about £50 a week since the problem was reported.

2) Compensation for loss of resale value. The difference in value between a vehicle without a corroded roof and one with. Current thinking, about £5,000.

At those values I'd bee looking at about £14,000. Multiply by about 300 people in the UK and you get to a cost to VW of about £4,200,000 plus legal fees.

I'm generally quite forgiving regarding problems with manufacturing complex items, mistakes happen, but the manufactures must take responsibility for those problems, fixing them is included in the price paid for the item. In this case we've been fobbed off for two long and they should not be allowed to treat their customers in this way.

Hi all,

Like everyone else, I'm on the waiting list and have been since may 2014! I rang VW and all they can say is I'm near the top of the queue, but have no idea when it will be fixed. It seems the repair work has been substantially reduced to save time and cost,so many parts that are pulled off will not be renewed like the first repairs. The corrosion has now spread to the main roof- another 2+ year wait for that??? I love the Cali, but VW are by far the very worst company for customer service I've ever come across (except for those you see on watch dog or rogue trailers!

Have written to watchdog now.

Colin

By the way if anyone is up for court action then count me in. Is there a barrister on the forum perhaps? If not the I could ask a friend who to use for consumer law. I've had enough now and like many, don't believe the repair will last more than a couple of years.

Hi

Are there any photo's on here of the problem? Can check mine then...

Did see there is a white line on the back of the front panel where the roof meets it like the paint has rubber off.

Thanks

Shaun

most likely it is the only way to achieve a satisfactory outcome. Does anyone know a specialist in this area? Either way, not a quick venture. Anyone considered taking their vehicle back to VW and just demanding a refund as it wasn't what you agreed to pay for?

Hi all,
Just a quick update on our experience of the new style roof repair work. Having waited 18 months, we had our date for the vehicle booked in, only to be cancelled a few days before by SMG Tonbridge because VW had changed the roof repair process!!! bit annoying, but they (David Powell) did come back to us within the week assuring us we would be first on the "new list".
Within two weeks we had another date for AB Crush in Canterbury, we had heard good reviews regarding this paint shop and hoped they would be given the opportunity for the new repair works.
SMG Tonbridge organised a curtesy car for duration of repairs, and we must say our overall experience with them has been excellent.
Plus we've kept the original canvas.
Time will tell, but at the moment the finished job looks first class. Hope everyone else who's still waiting has the same favourable outcome as us.

T140
(Steve & Pat)