Bristol propose to ban diesel vehicles by March 2021

[Lightning]

Taken from a story in the Telegraph
News

Bristol will ban all diesel vehicles from city under new proposal

Bristol could become the UK's first city to introduce a ban on diesel vehicles to boost air quality.

The vehicles will be prohibited from entering a central area of the city between 7am and 3pm every day under proposals by Bristol City Council.

A wider charging zone for commercial vehicles such as buses, taxis, vans and lorries which do not meet certain emissions standards is part of the measures which could be implemented by March 2021.

There is also a plan to launch a car scrappage scheme to help diesel car owners buy an alternative vehicle.

Concerns over emissions of nitrogen dioxide (NO2) have grown since Volkswagen was found in September 2015 to have cheated air pollution tests for 11 million diesel vehicles worldwide, including 1.2 million in the UK.

Bristol City Council said in 2017 it was one of 24 local authorities ordered by the Government to submit a plan for how it will comply with legal limits on NO2 by March 2021.

The Government has urged councils to exhaust other options before opting to impose charging zones.

Mayor of Bristol Marvin Rees said: "These ambitious plans demonstrate our commitment to tackling air pollution so we meet legal limits within the shortest time, without disproportionally affecting citizens on lower incomes which would happen with a blanket approach to charging vehicles.

"Protecting the most vulnerable people from pollution is central to these plans and we have ensured that all impacts have been carefully considered.

"If approved, mitigation measures will support those most affected, especially those living in the most deprived communities."

The council's cabinet is being asked to approve the Clean Air Zone proposal at a meeting on November 5.

If the plan is passed, the council would then work on developing the scheme with the Joint Air Quality Unit established by the Department for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs and the Department for Transport.

RAC head of roads policy Nicholas Lyes said: "We recognise that efforts must be made to clean up the city's air but as things stand, the impact of the proposals published today on people who currently drive diesel vehicles would be unprecedented.

"Major routes into, out of, and even around the city - like Temple Way and Brunel Way - would become out of bounds, with diesel vehicles forced on to other roads, which risks causing congestion problems where they don't exist at the moment."

Lawyer Katie Nield, of green legal group ClientEarth, said: "Bristol City Council is finally responding to residents' pollution worries and looking to strengthen its proposals, but while these new plans represent a step in the right direction, they once again stop short of ridding the city of its illegally toxic air with the necessary urgency."

Data published by the Society of Motor Manufacturers and Traders shows that during the first nine months of the year diesels held just 25.8% of the new car market, compared with 31.7% during the same period in 2018.

This is due to increases in the proportion of motorists buying petrol and alternatively-fuelled vehicles such as hybrids and battery electrics.

 

[Doorbundle]

"Major routes into, out of, and even around the city - like Temple Way and Brunel Way - would become out of bounds, with diesel vehicles forced on to other roads, which risks causing congestion problems where they don't exist at the moment."........So Bristol, bad enough already, will grind to a halt.

 

[Bellcrew]

"Major routes into, out of, and even around the city - like Temple Way and Brunel Way - would become out of bounds, with diesel vehicles forced on to other roads, which risks causing congestion problems where they don't exist at the moment."........So Bristol, bad enough already, will grind to a halt.

And no mention of differing grades of engine or wood burning stoves etc, classic gesture politics. I hope all of their ambulances and fire engines will be electric only operation.

 

[5i1ver8ack]

Bristol is my city of birth, although I haven't lived there for 30 years. I think it even less likely that I shall be returning.

The proposed area appears to include major routes into and out of the city, including part of the A4 and the M32. The area also includes major hospitals (including A&E), the main railway station, parts of Bristol University, schools etc.

 

[Georgiegirl]

Glad I got to try the CMC site at Baltic Wharf this year. It was on borrowed time with the redevelopment of the docks but now you won’t be able to get there without paying a fee either!

 

[MattBW]

"Major routes into, out of, and even around the city - like Temple Way and Brunel Way - would become out of bounds, with diesel vehicles forced on to other roads, which risks causing congestion problems where they don't exist at the moment."........So Bristol, bad enough already, will grind to a halt.

Congestion causes pollution, so it will be a counter productive move potentially.

 

[Borris]

"Major routes into, out of, and even around the city - like Temple Way and Brunel Way - would become out of bounds, with diesel vehicles forced on to other roads, which risks causing congestion problems where they don't exist at the moment."........So Bristol, bad enough already, will grind to a halt.

Yes and polution will almost certainly be higher as a result.

 

[AlanC]

We have moved now but until August this year we lived in the Harbourside which is bang in the middle of the 'No diesel vehicle zone'. so getting to and from our flat and parking space in the Cali would have become very expensive unless we came and went after 3pm and before 7am.

The SSGB and Bristol Packet have regular deliveries every day by vans and lorries as do all the rest of the businesses around the harbour. Can't see the suppliers changing their vehicles just for Bristol.

There appears to be no concession for people who live or companies who exist in the area. I can see the issue and the problem, but not this solution.

Alan

 

[Loz]

Dig an underground network of tunnels under the city and collect the gasses and filter them out.

 

[WelshGas]

We have moved now but until August this year we lived in the Harbourside which is bang in the middle of the 'No diesel vehicle zone'. so getting to and from our flat and parking space in the Cali would have become very expensive unless we came and went after 3pm and before 7am.

The SSGB and Bristol Packet have regular deliveries every day by vans and lorries as do all the rest of the businesses around the harbour. Can't see the suppliers changing their vehicles just for Bristol.

There appears to be no concession for people who live or companies who exist in the area. I can see the issue and the problem, but not this solution.

Alan

And a significant impact on Tourists.

 

[calicasas]

Taken from a story in the Telegraph
News

Bristol will ban all diesel vehicles from city under new proposal

Bristol could become the UK's first city to introduce a ban on diesel vehicles to boost air quality.

The vehicles will be prohibited from entering a central area of the city between 7am and 3pm every day under proposals by Bristol City Council.

A wider charging zone for commercial vehicles such as buses, taxis, vans and lorries which do not meet certain emissions standards is part of the measures which could be implemented by March 2021.

There is also a plan to launch a car scrappage scheme to help diesel car owners buy an alternative vehicle.

Concerns over emissions of nitrogen dioxide (NO2) have grown since Volkswagen was found in September 2015 to have cheated air pollution tests for 11 million diesel vehicles worldwide, including 1.2 million in the UK.

Bristol City Council said in 2017 it was one of 24 local authorities ordered by the Government to submit a plan for how it will comply with legal limits on NO2 by March 2021.

The Government has urged councils to exhaust other options before opting to impose charging zones.

Mayor of Bristol Marvin Rees said: "These ambitious plans demonstrate our commitment to tackling air pollution so we meet legal limits within the shortest time, without disproportionally affecting citizens on lower incomes which would happen with a blanket approach to charging vehicles.

"Protecting the most vulnerable people from pollution is central to these plans and we have ensured that all impacts have been carefully considered.

"If approved, mitigation measures will support those most affected, especially those living in the most deprived communities."

The council's cabinet is being asked to approve the Clean Air Zone proposal at a meeting on November 5.

If the plan is passed, the council would then work on developing the scheme with the Joint Air Quality Unit established by the Department for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs and the Department for Transport.

RAC head of roads policy Nicholas Lyes said: "We recognise that efforts must be made to clean up the city's air but as things stand, the impact of the proposals published today on people who currently drive diesel vehicles would be unprecedented.

"Major routes into, out of, and even around the city - like Temple Way and Brunel Way - would become out of bounds, with diesel vehicles forced on to other roads, which risks causing congestion problems where they don't exist at the moment."

Lawyer Katie Nield, of green legal group ClientEarth, said: "Bristol City Council is finally responding to residents' pollution worries and looking to strengthen its proposals, but while these new plans represent a step in the right direction, they once again stop short of ridding the city of its illegally toxic air with the necessary urgency."

Data published by the Society of Motor Manufacturers and Traders shows that during the first nine months of the year diesels held just 25.8% of the new car market, compared with 31.7% during the same period in 2018.

This is due to increases in the proportion of motorists buying petrol and alternatively-fuelled vehicles such as hybrids and battery electrics.

Will dent tourism, move congestion and emissions to other areas and form the base to generate further tax (from you and me) and place further burdens on business..
Here’s a crazy idea - why didnt this government stop recommending diesels in the first place.. what next “buy a hybrid” only to be told in six years time you aren’t green enough and you should be taxed to enter city centres?

 

[Louis II]

Be interesting to see what the final scheme looks like. Bath's LEZ ended up quite different to the original proposal following a backlash from residents and businesses.

 

[Wild Bob]

Will dent tourism, move congestion and emissions to other areas and form the base to generate further tax (from you and me) and place further burdens on business..
Here’s a crazy idea - why didnt this government stop recommending diesels in the first place.. what next “buy a hybrid” only to be told in six years time you aren’t green enough and you should be taxed to enter city centres?

This was the biggest issue I had before buying my New Cali in August of this year. I am worried that a once solid investment has now come to an end. We are in our late 60's and did not have the option to sit and wait for the Electric Cali coming out ( IF EVER) so we bit the bullet and bought one. It's ironic that VW caused the bad diesel hysteria in the first place. My wife keeps telling me not to worry it will be years before they stop us driving anywhere, but disappointing it has come to this. Love to hear your views !!

 

[5i1ver8ack]

The law of unintended consequences will have it's revenge before this story ends.

 

[GrannyJen]

If it is matched with a good public transport system then as a visitor it does not bother me,

I would much prefer someone else to do the driving through congested city streets and leave me to park my Cali in peace and quiet just outside where I can bus, cab, train, tube or horse and cart in.

AS someone very involved in providing Bristol with it's public transport network back in the days of the mid-80's to early 90's, I 0nly hope that councillors of that beautiful city are a bit more switched on than they were then. Half the time I was of the opinion that most of them couldn't fit together a Hornby train set, let alone understand a public transport network.

 

[Wild Bob]

If it is matched with a good public transport system then as a visitor it does not bother me,

I would much prefer someone else to do the driving through congested city streets and leave me to park my Cali in peace and quiet just outside where I can bus, cab, train, tube or horse and cart in.

AS someone very involved in providing Bristol with it's public transport network back in the days of the mid-80's to early 90's, I 0nly hope that councillors of that beautiful city are a bit more switched on than they were then. Half the time I was of the opinion that most of them couldn't fit together a Hornby train set, let alone understand a public transport network.

Yes I agree we always use public transport when we are going to our city centre.

 

[Digger]

This was the biggest issue I had before buying my New Cali in August of this year. I am worried that a once solid investment has now come to an end. We are in our late 60's and did not have the option to sit and wait for the Electric Cali coming out ( IF EVER) so we bit the bullet and bought one. It's ironic that VW caused the bad diesel hysteria in the first place. My wife keeps telling me not to worry it will be years before they stop us driving anywhere, but disappointing it has come to this. Love to hear your views !!

I would not worry. No matter what politicians say diesel will be here long after they are gone. There is no way we can produce the electricity to replace internal combustion engines without nuclear power and battery end of life cycles will result in even more pollution.
The pity is politicians at every level think they can improve the situation but it is engineers and scientists who will improve matters. Politicians will just use any excuse to tax us to death - blind to their bad judgement and ruination of their town centres.

 

[Amarillo]

There is no way we can produce the electricity to replace internal combustion engines without nuclear power and battery end of life cycles will result in even more pollution.

Of course we can. British electricity consumption has been dropping for a decade and a half. And we have a largely untapped and totally reliable source of an abundant renewable electricity source sloshing up and down the English Channel twice daily, as well as numerous other places all around the British Isles.

The bigger issue is with the source materials for batteries. It may be that in the medium to long term, fuel cells are a better option for motor vehicles.

 

[MarkVw2017]

Good!! Bristol should ban all cars. It's a horrid city to drive through!!! Bristol City itself though is amazing ;-D

It's been proven diesel is really harmful, so suppose it should be banned. Eg People dropping kids off at school, while parents and there diesel 4 litre V6 engines engines are left on idle whilst they jusy wait, is just so wrong these days!!!. Problem is, pollution has no boundaries, so diesel as a whole, including petrol, should now be phased out completely everywhere. It's defo the beginning of the end!

 

[MarkVw2017]

I would not worry. No matter what politicians say diesel will be here long after they are gone. There is no way we can produce the electricity to replace internal combustion engines without nuclear power and battery end of life cycles will result in even more pollution.
The pity is politicians at every level think they can improve the situation but it is engineers and scientists who will improve matters. Politicians will just use any excuse to tax us to death - blind to their bad judgement and ruination of their town centres.

True, but just because it cannot be replaced doesn't justify or mean we should keep using fuel that is bad for the environment and harm the health of others. Lack of option should not justify or be an excuse to carry on using a toxic substance!

 

[Wild Bob]

I would not worry. No matter what politicians say diesel will be here long after they are gone. There is no way we can produce the electricity to replace internal combustion engines without nuclear power and battery end of life cycles will result in even more pollution.
The pity is politicians at every level think they can improve the situation but it is engineers and scientists who will improve matters. Politicians will just use any excuse to tax us to death - blind to their bad judgement and ruination of their town centres.

Yes I think your right, as the impact of charging overnight and the change needed to the infrastructure could not support the demand.

 

[Loz]

Home batteries (Sodium-Iron) solar charging all grid-tied on a large scale will bridge the gap.
Solar and other renewables charge up your home battery packs
You come home and plug in your car and it charges from the batteries like you use a charging pack for your phone.
The car is also part of the nationwide grid scheme so when all the Kettles go on after Coronation street the surge is provided by the batteries(and cars) that are on the grid at that moment, instead of starting up a power station.
Then when the peak drops away the power is put back into your car ready for the morning.
Do this on a large enough scale and you could be totally renewable.

 

[WelshGas]

True, but just because it cannot be replaced doesn't justify or mean we should keep using fuel that is bad for the environment and harm the health of others. Lack of option should not justify or be an excuse to carry on using a toxic substance!

Yes, Greta.

You must feel very smug driving around in your electric California. Oh, they haven't built one yet! You've got a Diesel one.

 

[Velma's Dad]

In our adult lives we're seen huge technological change but most of that has been in IT and to some extent health and biotech. We've actually seen only very incremental developments in transportation and energy generation and distribution since the War.

(Unlike the Victorians, who drove forward massive and very rapid changes in transport - the railways, in just a couple of decades - metalled roads, several shifts in energy sources and transformations: coal, oil, gas and then electricity. They also invested massively, and effectively, in public health infrastructure such as public sewage systems.)

Consequently I think a lot of us have very constrained mindsets about the changes that will be needed, and I believe can be achieved, to massively reduce carbon and also deal with lethal levels of local air pollution in cities. We seem in some ways to be the 'can't do' generation.

 

[Amarillo]

Yes, Greta.

You must feel very smug driving around in your electric California. Oh, they haven't built one yet! You've got a Diesel one.

I think you miss the point.

There are two issues, CO2 and diesel particulates. While not mutually exclusive, they are very different in their consequence. CO2 is a universal issue: it affects all regions of our planet more or less equally. Particulates (from NOx, NH3 and SO2) are a particular problem where there is a high concentration of motor vehicles, especially diesel vehicles. Banning diesel engined vehicles from city centres by providing electric busses and electric cars for hire, and by transferring deliveries to electric vans is a very good short to medium term solution to the particular particulate problem in large cities. It won't solve the CO2 issue, but it is unlikely to make it any worse.

Ideally we would use a bicycle for short journeys, an electric car for medium journeys and our California for long distances. Unfortunately, an electric car was prohibitively expensive for us so we have compromised with a small petrol car for medium journeys. We are not perfect, but the will to change our habits is there.

In the future I look forward to driving into a car park on the outskirts of Bristol, hiring a self driving electric car and visiting the city in that. A sort of utopia perhaps, but what's the point in mocking the dream of a cleaner future? Greta Thunberg has done much to raise public awareness of the issues. She does not deserve to have her name used as a petty insult.