Cali vs Conversion - another slant

[NOD]

I was told that because the Cali starts life as a Caravelle it has better sound insulation and suspension. I could be wrong but it certainly doesn’t feel like your driving your driving a van.

The other thing is the depreciation, look at the ads for a 5 y/o conversion verses a Cali.

 

[westfalia]

it certainly doesn’t feel like your driving your driving a van.

Driving a van doesn´t feel like driving a van these days.

 

[Jay586]

I'm not sure I agree about the depreciation, I think it must depend on spec but one of the reasons,I did convert my van was that old ones were still ridiculously expensive.

 

[Quentin SF]

Yes, the Cali has fared very well on the depreciation front recently, partly because the new prices have continued to rise and pulled the second-hand prices up with them, so if you bought a few years ago, you can sell now without much loss. I do wonder about likely depreciation of a diesel-engined one bought now, though. Of course, low depreciation is a two-edged sword if you're not buying a new one and need to raise the money

Depreciation of third-party conversions, from my research, seems to depend to a fair degree on whether the conversion was done by a well-known name. Someone like Bilbos, Murvi, Westfalia will hold their value reasonably well, and either they or their dealers will generally be happy to buy them back from you too.

 

[andrew bazeley]

I believe the Cali is the best layout and bed width compromise in a SWB van. I had a Reimo City once with very slim units (wider bed) but it was hopelessly impractical for storing cooking pans, dinner plates.....in fact anything other than tin cans.

I like the idea of the twin rear seat models but as stated above, they are not long enough (I’m 6’4). Also, the kitchen is in the boot and offers very little cupboard space, and no real boot for all the stuff (diy projects etc) that you need for (in my case) an every day vehicle.

I hate some of the fiddly build quality of the camping parts in the Cali, and detest the over complication of the electric roof, but have now owned 3 in a row as they are simply a better package than the SWB conversions, particularly if it’s cab ambiance you are after.

To me the bed solution is using the sprung-pine upstairs one. It's wide, long, comfortable, and you can lie in bed and zip open the windows to look at the stars. Oh - and you can push the bed up during the day with the bedding still in place (not the pillows). That all means that the living area downstairs is always intact and vacant (if you can't sleep). Yes - as a "man of a certain age" I know the disadvantages of having to get up two or three times during the night. But with a decent two-piece Fiamma ladder and a partner who doesn't mind getting a foot in her face when you have to turn around to get out, you just learn to live with it. Do conversions have a similar upstairs bed?

 

[Geoff York]

Hi,

I’m a newbie, we’ve decided we want a Cali or equivalent conversion and are trying to learn the ropes. I know there are plenty of debates around the relative merits of the Cali compared with a conversion but I’ve got a more specific question on that subject. For me, the quality of the cab and whole driving experience is relatively important. We’ve looked at a new Cali and were really impressed by it, I thought the cab was excellent. However lots of conversions I see online look like they are based on a pretty basic Transporter, so you end up with a utilitarian cab which I’m not keen on at all. My question is, will most decent conversion companies allow you to precisely choose the spec of your donor van, and is it possible to spec a T6 Transporter Kombi so that from the drivers seat it is just as good as a Cali, e.g. when it comes to the cab ambience, driving, options, noise suppression, etc? I imagine the opinions of most of you might lean towards a standard Cali being better but thought I’d ask anyway

Thanks

 

[Quentin SF]

Geoff - yes, I think many of them will do this. We nearly bought a van from Bilbo's which was exactly that: based on a very nice almost-new red Kombi. Someone had brought it in for conversion and then changed their plans, so it was up for sale.

In the end, though, it was a bit pricey for us and we ended up getting a three-year old one built on one of their more standard vans. I gather from this forum that Bilbo's is one of a small number of converters (four?) who are able to get slightly different specs from VW for their standard vans, but I think they and others will allow you to specify (or provide) pretty much whatever you like.

 

[Bellcrew]

Geoff - yes, I think many of them will do this. We nearly bought a van from Bilbo's which was exactly that: based on a very nice almost-new red Kombi. Someone had brought it in for conversion and then changed their plans, so it was up for sale.

In the end, though, it was a bit pricey for us and we ended up getting a three-year old one built on one of their more standard vans. I gather from this forum that Bilbo's is one of a small number of converters (four?) who are able to get slightly different specs from VW for their standard vans, but I think they and others will allow you to specify (or provide) pretty much whatever you like.

They have stopped quoting VW prices for the upgrades on their site, arithmetic is not on their side, ask for the equivalent price to the standard Ocean spec and their conversions end up as a very expensive alternative.

 

[Ey-Up]

Long time reader but this thread has prompted my first post.
We have had a conversion for 18 months now. We bought an 8 month (5,000 miles) old T6 direct from a VW dealer who had California’s in the showroom. He advised us on the spec to go for based on our need to convert (Trendline T30 with A/C and a comfort/audio pack upgrade) and would have supplied brand new or a demonstrator.
We went round several shows, read reviews and visited a couple of converters before going with a company called 8 Ball Camper Conversions who were quite local to us. We had a 3/4 month wait but we could not be more happy. We have everything where we want it, a top quality RIB bed and Austops pop up top. We got a service agreement with the van and when we went back they were keen to see the conversion, which I compared to the California in the showroom. Ours (at 8 months old) and not quite as good a cab was over £30K cheaper than the one in the showroom.
Now, I love reading on this forum and I don’t want to upset folks and most will think I am mad but without a doubt if I won the lottery I would buy a top spec Cali and take it to 8 Ball for a conversion from the cab back.
Our experience does not mirror many on here but I would suggest that anybody wanting a campervan hired both a Cali and a conversion.

 

[westfalia]

Long time reader but this thread has prompted my first post.
We have had a conversion for 18 months now. We bought an 8 month (5,000 miles) old T6 direct from a VW dealer who had California’s in the showroom. He advised us on the spec to go for based on our need to convert (Trendline T30 with A/C and a comfort/audio pack upgrade) and would have supplied brand new or a demonstrator.
We went round several shows, read reviews and visited a couple of converters before going with a company called 8 Ball Camper Conversions who were quite local to us. We had a 3/4 month wait but we could not be more happy. We have everything where we want it, a top quality RIB bed and Austops pop up top. We got a service agreement with the van and when we went back they were keen to see the conversion, which I compared to the California in the showroom. Ours (at 8 months old) and not quite as good a cab was over £30K cheaper than the one in the showroom.
Now, I love reading on this forum and I don’t want to upset folks and most will think I am mad but without a doubt if I won the lottery I would buy a top spec Cali and take it to 8 Ball for a conversion from the cab back.
Our experience does not mirror many on here but I would suggest that anybody wanting a campervan hired both a Cali and a conversion.

Any pictures ?

 

[Ey-Up]

No interior pic on my phone but I took this after a storm in the Alps this summer.
I will take some interior pics when it’s light tomorrow.

 

[Volkywagen]

Driving a van doesn´t feel like driving a van these days.

Mk1 transit, all the way

 

[westfalia]

Mk1 transit, all the way

Thats the one

 

[rod_vw]

I've built five conversions on LWB T4s, T5s and now a T6, all have been high roof models and new or pre-reg dealers stock. One high roof was a factory one all the others have been Reimo. Each has been fitted with Reimo Variotech sliding seats / bed, swivel front seats and since the T4 a Waeco compressor fridge, all with Eberspacher blown air heating, SMEV Grill, SMEV two burner hob and sink and 100W solar panel. Recent ones have all had a 3 metre awning.
The Eberspacher is fitted with ane 801 controller and uses the external temperature monitor so it works just like a domestic central heating system switching on when the internal temperature drops below the set figure.
The extra 14" length of the LWB model gives adequate room for two to move about even with the bed made up. All have been only two berth as that's our preference but the roof lockers provide more than enough storage space.
The current vehicle is built on a Highline T6 with satnav and LED headlights.

Our last T5 can be seen at www.1946vw.co.uk/sales just to give you an idea how it all goes together.

 

[Quentin SF]

No interior pic on my phone but I took this after a storm in the Alps this summer.View attachment 39058

That looks like a great view! Could you tell us the name of the site?

 

[Ey-Up]

The site was called Camping Roustou. It was about 10K from Embrun on Lac Poncon. A large terraced site near the lake with a variety of priced pitches. Some high up, some at lakeside. Pool and bar, plenty of toilets (own paper needed) and some great views. Interestingly, no pre booking and you had to walk round to find a pitch then go back and say which one you wanted hoping someone didn’t get there before you.
Very friendly though, I would recommend it.

 

[David Bailey]

I wouldn’t discount the California based on the downstairs bed. If there are only two of you will quickly realise the benefit of leaving the downstairs as your living area and sleeping in the much more comfortable upstairs bed. We dream of being able to do that but our kids wisely insist on going upstairs ‘coz it’s much more comfortable’ Mrs B and I go top to tail downstairs...we are such pushovers!

 

[Ey-Up]

Interior photo of our conversion van takes on site this morning. As a person who did an apprenticeship in the early 80s as a cabinet maker, I really appreciate the build quality of the lightweight furniture. The gain matching up was another big plus.

 

[2into1]

Ours (at 8 months old) and not quite as good a cab was over £30K cheaper than the one in the showroom.

That info doesn't tally with the commonly held view on the forum. It would be useful if Ey-Up could provide some detail on the price and specs he is comparing in his post (as his conversion in a later post looks very nice)

 

[Ey-Up]

Happy to help.
I can’t recall the exact spec. of the one in the showroom when we went for our service but it was £68K.
Our van cost us about £25K and the conversion was £12.5K.
The prices at 8 Ball have gone up since we bought but as the link below shows £15K (with extras) plus a nearly new van is still much, much cheaper. The van may not be brand new but the interior is and in my opinion it’s better quality. (Just my opinion of course)
I accept that this is not like for like but I did not suggest it was (as the 2into1 quote above shows ours was 8 months old when we bought it)
Please don’t think I am anti- Cali, I am really not at all. I just felt that when I got the email link this week with popular threads I should post our story.

https://www.8ballcamperconversions.co.uk/pricelist/

 

[2into1]

Interesting. What spec was your van for your £25k? Tailgate?, engine power?, Air con / climate?

For comparison (in advance of your answers) I bought a 6 month old Ocean from VW with 7k miles, 150 DSG, Alcantara, mettalic, posh sat nav etc for just under £49k. I wonder if this gap (my 49 and the showroom 68) is where the difference lies?

 

[Bellcrew]

Happy to help.
I can’t recall the exact spec. of the one in the showroom when we went for our service but it was £68K.
Our van cost us about £25K and the conversion was £12.5K.
The prices at 8 Ball have gone up since we bought but as the link below shows £15K (with extras) plus a nearly new van is still much, much cheaper. The van may not be brand new but the interior is and in my opinion it’s better quality. (Just my opinion of course)
I accept that this is not like for like but I did not suggest it was (as the 2into1 quote above shows ours was 8 months old when we bought it)
Please don’t think I am anti- Cali, I am really not at all. I just felt that when I got the email link this week with popular threads I should post our story.

https://www.8ballcamperconversions.co.uk/pricelist/

Many people are happy with a basic van and a mattress in the back, we had a T2 Holdsworth conversion, bought outside Australia House in the 70s for not a lot of money, lived in it for six months.
You pays your money etc.

 

[Auberg-ine]

View attachment 39091

Interior photo of our conversion van takes on site this morning. As a person who did an apprenticeship in the early 80s as a cabinet maker, I really appreciate the build quality of the lightweight furniture. The gain matching up was another big plus.

Hi Ey, I understand the rail beside the bench under the sink is to hang the dining table on, no? But how do you approach than the two front chairs when you're four dining? And where is that table then stored? Or is it the sliding door one?

 

[Ocean Spirit]

At the end of the day, when you weigh it all up for the umpteenth time hopefully you buy the camper that you comfortably enjoy without dwelling on the decision.
For many people budget plays the biggest part in that and there are many nice conversions out there.
For me, I wanted the Cali over a conversion for single every reason I could think of except one. I like the LWB idea.
So went new considering that strong residuals of the Cali would put me in a place closest to where I started if things went sour.
Happy Camping!!!

 

[Phase one]

2020 Freedom and Wesfalia are right - you buy the camper that you can enjoy. All options have differing advantages and disadvantages. We had great times in a T25 Holdsworth Variety many moons ago and after a succession of VW high tops we now enjoy the current VW 4motion Wingamm Micros.

Just remember your priorities will undoubtedly change over time - the main thing is to get out and enjoy what you have!