Electric shock from van

[RichardSweeney]

Hi I am wondering if anyone knows what I am doing wrong I am in Denmark at the moment
I plugged in the main socket to an electric main connector which I have always done before
I received a small shock from my van after touching the door , nothing tripped but decided to unplug the socket
Everything is ok but is this a underlying issue or is it me. Everyone else in the camp is using the mains and all seems ok
Plse help
Rich

 

[flying banana]

static. Nothing to do with hook up. cars do it too. if it happens regular it can be building on you or the drivers seat. get out the van and earth yourself . then touch the van . should be fine. remember those trailing static things on cars?

 

[sidepod]

static. Nothing to do with hook up. cars do it too. if it happens regular it can be building on you or the drivers seat. get out the van and earth yourself . then touch the van . should be fine. remember those trailing static things on cars?

Whoa there tiger!!! How on earth can you say it's static?

Richard, get the van checked by a qualified electrician.

 

[RichardSweeney]

Thanks I was touching the van when I was standing on the ground so was my daughter it stopped happening when I unplugged the mains will try again tomorrow thank you for your prompt reply

 

[flying banana]

it can't be mains can it. he said he unplugged it and then touched the door. it's static. it can't be 12v either as that's negative earth. it's static . 240 Would be a proper belt

 

[Max-Felix]

Did it happen once or repeatedly? Can you explain more the full sequence of events?

 

[RichardSweeney]

Did it happen once or repeatedly? Can you explain more the full sequence of events?

It happened repeatedly when plugged in So when touching metal part I could feel an electrical flow so did my dauther so immediately unplugged and all is ok
First time it happened to us

 

[sidepod]

it can't be mains can it. he said he unplugged it and then touched the door. it's static. it can't be 12v either as that's negative earth. it's static . 240 Would be a proper belt

No. if you understand Ohns law then you'll know that the 30mA RCD in the van and hook up point is sized to keep the touch voltage to max 50v, above that it will trip, so you won't get a belt as you state but you may feel a tingle.

 

[Max-Felix]

It happened repeatedly when plugged in So when touching metal part I could feel an electrical flow so did my dauther so immediately unplugged and all is ok
First time it happened to us

I think you need to get it checked out!

 

[JohnGuppy]

Get it checked out any good sparkle will do it and have the lead and any appliances you may used tested as well that's important
Best way is to buy a plug in socket tester from screw fix and carry it with you test every time you plug in to an unknown source

 

[GrannyJen]

Surely there is no argument, and I am a techie dope, but:

Plugged in, get a shock, unplugged, don't get a shock = get it checked by someone competent?

 

[Seaview]

We are in Denmark too at the moment and haven't experienced any shocks when plugging in to electricity bollards on sites so hope you manage to find the cause.

 

[Loz]

Have you tried a different post?

 

[hirsty]

Good idea, check both ends - it could be a post problem as much as a van problem. Is there someone you can talk to at the site?, ideally a warden who'll say "oh yeah, bit temperamental these ..."

I'd be freaked out & have it unplugged personally, so kudos for keeping it together

 

[AlanC]

Better still, if you can check the site hook-up before you plug up the van. There may have been some earth leakage on that circuit.

I suggest you buy a circuit checker from the local hardware store and plug that into the socket on the kitchen to test the system when on hook up. There will be a series of LED on the checker and a notation of what you should see lit if all is good, and what you will see if there is a fault on the system. This can be an issue if you are colourblind as I am, but there is usually a buzzer signal as well.

As an example of this issue, I checked one communal box of 14 x 16amp mains outlets, one of which I was using, on a site in Spain last year. 7 were wired correctly and 7 had wiring faults.

Alan

 

[hirsty]

Won't help OP today, but thanks @AlanC - for £7 seems a good idea:

sourcingmap® DM6860E Mains Socket Outlet Tester Polarity Check Meter 220V-250V UK

https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B01D2SGG90/?tag=eliteelect-21

 

[mccp]

If at all worried, get an electrician in. If you are confident that the electrical system is essentially safe, but uncomfortable, read on:

Some devices, particularly those which only have a two-pin mains plug (i.e. no earth connection) are allowed to 'float' at anything up to 50 volts. Because the neutral wire and the earth wire are connected at some point - depending on how the earthing arrangements are made, this is usually in the supply - then the 50 volt potential can appear on earthed metal parts, like the van bodywork.

It is most likely that what you are feeling is a 50 volt leakage, because your RCD in the vans hookup would most likely trip in case of a wiring fault. Of course, you can press the 'test' button on the RCD to double check that it is operational.

The problem then, is where is the voltage coming from?

Either you have an appliance plugged in that floats - commonly TVs, laptop power supplies, etc. Unplug everything and try again.

Or the voltage exists on the earth of the incoming power connection. You could try connecting an earthed appliance direct to the external supply. If you can detect the voltage on any earthed metal on this appliance, then the incoming supply is at fault.

Anyone with an aluminium body Apple Macbook Pro may be able to detect this effect for themselves - the power supply is only earthed if you have the Apple mains flex connected to the power supply. If you replace the mains flex with the plug that connects directly to the power supply, it isn't earthed and the Macbook's casing will have a parasite voltage on it. If you lightly rub your finger across the aluminium surface it feels oddly 'floaty' and you will feel a little tingle if you touch the mac while you are also touching something that has a good earth. I occasionally have to use two Macbooks at the same time, and I often get zapped.

 

[bvddobb]

Some devices, particularly those which only have a two-pin mains plug (i.e. no earth connection) are allowed to 'float' at anything up to 50 volts. Because the neutral wire and the earth wire are connected at some point - depending on how the earthing arrangements are made, this is usually in the supply - then the 50 volt potential can appear on earthed metal parts, like the van bodywork.
[...]
The problem then, is where is the voltage coming from?
[...]
Either you have an appliance plugged in that floats - commonly TVs, laptop power supplies, etc. Unplug everything and try again.
[...]
Or the voltage exists on the earth of the incoming power connection. You could try connecting an earthed appliance direct to the external supply. If you can detect the voltage on any earthed metal on this appliance, then the incoming supply is at fault.

Very good explanation! It is quite often the case that camp site hookup's earth connections are not completely kosher... Indeed choosing another hookup point can make a big difference here!

Whether it is leakage voltage or real static electricity: when you make it a habit to touch the van bodywork with a flat hand when getting out or in, you may not feel anything at all.

 

[Dave650]

It is better to touch the metal of the vehicle with the back of a flat hand prior to entering the vehicle. If the vehicle is live the shock will cause the muscles to contract and close the hand, if around a handle etc you would then be left unable to release yourself. Using the back of the hand will cause your hand to move away from the live metal. At least I remember something slightly useful from too many years working on military communications vehicles...

 

[sidepod]

If at all worried, get an electrician in. If you are confident that the electrical system is essentially safe, but uncomfortable, read on:

Some devices, particularly those which only have a two-pin mains plug (i.e. no earth connection) are allowed to 'float' at anything up to 50 volts. Because the neutral wire and the earth wire are connected at some point - depending on how the earthing arrangements are made, this is usually in the supply - then the 50 volt potential can appear on earthed metal parts, like the van bodywork.

It is most likely that what you are feeling is a 50 volt leakage, because your RCD in the vans hookup would most likely trip in case of a wiring fault. Of course, you can press the 'test' button on the RCD to double check that it is operational.

The problem then, is where is the voltage coming from?

Either you have an appliance plugged in that floats - commonly TVs, laptop power supplies, etc. Unplug everything and try again.

Or the voltage exists on the earth of the incoming power connection. You could try connecting an earthed appliance direct to the external supply. If you can detect the voltage on any earthed metal on this appliance, then the incoming supply is at fault.

Anyone with an aluminium body Apple Macbook Pro may be able to detect this effect for themselves - the power supply is only earthed if you have the Apple mains flex connected to the power supply. If you replace the mains flex with the plug that connects directly to the power supply, it isn't earthed and the Macbook's casing will have a parasite voltage on it. If you lightly rub your finger across the aluminium surface it feels oddly 'floaty' and you will feel a little tingle if you touch the mac while you are also touching something that has a good earth. I occasionally have to use two Macbooks at the same time, and I often get zapped.

Essentially misleading

This mentiones earth and neutral connection (TNC-S) which is against wiring regs for caravan sites. All hook up points should be on dedicated earth rods. (TT). You should see an earth connection box in the ground nearby.

Anyway, get it checked by a pro.

 

[mccp]

Essentially misleading

Well, maybe.

The problem is still caused by something plugged in to the van, the supply where the van is plugged in, or the van itself. The first issue is easy to test - just unplug everything and try again. The second is less easy to test, but you could at least try a hook-up supply that has been good in the past. If the first two tests don't diagnose the source of the unwanted buzz then the van may be at fault.

Or, as sidepod suggests, get a competent person to test the van.

 

[andyinluton]

Essentially misleading

This mentiones earth and neutral connection (TNC-S) which is against wiring regs for caravan sites. All hook up points should be on dedicated earth rods. (TT). You should see an earth connection box in the ground nearby.

Anyway, get it checked by a pro.

Are the regs the same in Denmark?

 

[Loz]

I suspect the charger will be the culprit as its a switch mode unit with earth connection. I suppose you could always carry your own earth spike and attach it when necessary..

 

[Joker 1299]

All this electrickery stuff is like witchcraft isn't it!

 

[larrylamb]

Report it to the site, get them to check the mains supply you are plugging in.