Hookup power relay cuts off

[Sp0_0k]

Got a slight emergency here.
Hookup power relay cuts off.
After several attempts rearming it, it shuts off right after hookup power cable connected.
- Which obviously means a short/very high load.
- Disconnected everything from inside the 220v, leaving the socket empty, same deal.

I see only 3 possibilities
1. fictional impossible: some critter got inside and ate the main power cables and managed to short them.
2. Hookup battery charger died, though why would it overload or short the mains power?
3. Power relay faulty.

It is pretty cold outside -10 at night.
We use leisere battery power regularly which makes mains charger to kick in frequently, topping them up.
Not sure where the charger is in T6 Beach, but I suspect, rear left close to the relay itself.

Any experience with such mains power fault?

 

[WelshGas]

Got a slight emergency here.
Hookup power relay cuts off.
After several attempts rearming it, it shuts off right after hookup power cable connected.
- Which obviously means a short/very high load.
- Disconnected everything from inside the 220v, leaving the socket empty, same deal.

I see only 3 possibilities
1. fictional impossible: some critter got inside and ate the main power cables and managed to short them.
2. Hookup battery charger died, though why would it overload or short the mains power?
3. Power relay faulty.

It is pretty cold outside -10 at night.
We use leisere battery power regularly which makes mains charger to kick in frequently, topping them up.
Not sure where the charger is in T6 Beach, but I suspect, rear left close to the relay itself.

Any experience with such mains power fault?

Correct, behind the trim near the RCD switch.
If the Charger has failed then this can trigger the RCD in certain circumstances.

 

[larrylamb]

Sounds charger related, could this be anything to do with the mod you posted last week??

 

[MattBW]

It's not your cable is it? Charger is behind the left hand side panel in the centre or used to be.

There are some instructions somewhere on here on how to remove said panel.

 

[MartG]

I've just spotted this thread after replying to the 'other one'...

Charger is below sliding window on LHS, accessed by removing the side panel trim!

Can only be RCD, charger, socket or wiring, within the van. Charger most likely, but could be RCD or loose connections. Damp or condensation with cold temps?

 

[Sp0_0k]

Sounds charger related, could this be anything to do with the mod you posted last week??

No, and not a hookup cable issue based on physics basics.
My mod actually saves me atm, allowing to charge the batteries without starting the motor.
220 circuit is independent.

 

[Sp0_0k]

I've just spotted this thread after replying to the 'other one'...

Charger is below sliding window on LHS, accessed by removing the side panel trim!

Can only be RCD, charger, socket or wiring, within the van. Charger most likely, but could be RCD or loose connections. Damp or condensation with cold temps?

yea cold could be the most probable cause frying charger. Will try to disconnect from RCD to isolate test it. Not sure how to do that in Beach, when it is hiddon out of sight

 

[kp64zl]

Had same issue -- for me it was a fault in the ac-dc charger -- there was a window leak that dripped into the charger.....VW fixed it under warranty but took a few days

Electric Hookup (EHU) not working

Have just realised that the electric hook up on my 2019 Beach isn't working. I've checked the input cables to the van with my multimeter and they are reading correctly (~240v) but no output at the 3-pin socket. Haven't noticed this all year as have been running on solar . Please could someone...

vwcaliforniaclub.com

 

[WelshGas]

yea cold could be the most probable cause frying charger. Will try to disconnect from RCD to isolate test it. Not sure how to do that in Beach, when it is hiddon out of sight

If the Charger is at fault, as there is, I believe, no Control Panel monitoring of the Beach Leisure Electrics then you could replace it with a better Smart Charger more suited to your needs?

 

[MartG]

Don't write-off your charger if it is dampness. A good dry out may stop any earth leakage and get it back going again but may take a while, a heater / de-humidifier in the van or better, take the charger into your house and use a hairdryer, may do the trick.

edit - check with the charger disconnected first to prove it's the fault!

 

[Sp0_0k]

Considering I am couple months more under warranty I'd definitely want it replaced. Otherwise I would of course throw that crap out and build it better way.
I am already not hurting that much, just rewired couple things in the field and my litium charger makes the cjarging job for leads and powers 12v appliances from 220v.

Just weird why would charger short the hookup. I totally get it when it was dump in water for Kp64zl.
But in most cases the charger should just blow own fuse or die leaving 220v circuit alone.

 

[WelshGas]

Considering I am couple months more under warranty I'd definitely want it replaced. Otherwise I would of course throw that crap out and build it better way.
I am already not hurting that much, just rewired couple things in the field and my litium charger makes the cjarging job for leads and powers 12v appliances from 220v.

Just weird why would charger short the hookup. I totally get it when it was dump in water for Kp64zl.
But in most cases the charger should just blow own fuse or die leaving 220v circuit alone.

Until you disconnect it you won’t be able to disregard it as a possible cause. No possibility of a water leak from the window as @kp64zl had?

 

[MartG]

Considering I am couple months more under warranty I'd definitely want it replaced. Otherwise I would of course throw that crap out and build it better way.
I am already not hurting that much, just rewired couple things in the field and my litium charger makes the cjarging job for leads and powers 12v appliances from 220v.

If it's still under warranty, I wouldn't touch it unless you're confident that VW will repair / replace the charger after you've taken it to bits or modified the wiring elsewhere...

Just weird why would charger short the hookup. I totally get it when it was dump in water for Kp64zl.
But in most cases the charger should just blow own fuse or die leaving 220v circuit alone.

It may not be a short (overcurrent) as the charger has a built in fuse (I think) to protect itself, but earth leakage, which damp will allow a small current (>10mA) to track across any surface / wire / component, which will trip the RCD. The RCD is very sensitive to this and it could be anywhere downstream of the breaker.

 

[MartG]

I'm curious that you mention you have a lithium charger... Are you using lithium batteries in addition to the lead acid leisure cells?

edit - just found your other thread with DC-DC topic...

I've done a lot of playing with lithium cells since the early 2000's, models, torch conversions and ebikes mainly - they're great for light weight, high current applications but maybe not so good for long term storage at 100% charge? And a lot more expensive / sensitive to abuse!

 

[Sp0_0k]

So there is RCD that reacts just to current leak, with no breaker function, right? I didn't measure a short in hookup socket anyway.
Yes I love lithium.
Right now my system is fully independent and I can remove everything in half an hour giving a clean stock van to a dealer for repair
I played with batteries since old Nimh due to RC hobby with planes and drones so know the batteries very well and how to treat them. I would stay away even from classic 18650 cells in the van but Lifepo4 is completely different thing.
The most reliable and safe from lithium family.
They are heavier than classic litium but can handle insane abuse. Just 2-3 times lighter than lead ones. Can charge/discharge 2C. Over 2-4k cycles and over 10 years life.
They cost roughly just double (cells) if you consider quality lead with equivalent capacity. But considering life time they are cheaper than lead.
And if my 160AH nominal cells deliver measured 210 Ah, you know that lead will hardly ever deliver 70-80% from rated.
Actually the biggest lithium cells supplier in Europe is in Czech, if you want some advice on where to get them and how to build.

 

[Sp0_0k]

Notice the cables they use for shorting test Thinner ones just melt in seconds.
Those yellow winston cell are very widely used in RVs and offgrid systems. Some even converted old VW busses to run on them.

 

[MartG]

So there is RCD that reacts just to current leak, with no breaker function, right? I didn't measure a short in hookup socket anyway.

The breaker in your Cali is a combined overcurrent (13A I think) and 10mA Residual Current, commonly called an RCBO. It is basically a 13A MCB (switch) and a current sensing transformer pair, wired in opposition, so that the current going in (L) balances and cancels out the current returning out (N). Any leakage to earth causes an imbalance and resulting voltage which the breaker trips, if above 10mA difference.
Your meter may not measure a short to earth as the measuring voltage is low, a megger type >500V tester may show up damp tracking.

That's a lot of cycles for a Lipo battery!