Robinsons VW Van Centre Peterborough

[flying banana]

Sounds like a nightmare. Did you get anywhere with that air con fan led fault because mine does the same. I found a video also by cali Chris and when he turned the fan in the video that did the same too!!!

 

[Cloud Dodger]

The 64 million dollar question to any assessor “ would you be happy with that having paid x£s ?”
I suspect the answer will be no, based on the cost of the vehicle, a reasonable assessor would expect a reasonable finish commensurate with the value of the vehicle, I.e. if the vehicle was being sold as low end, low spec, low cost, they may look at it accordingly and agree the paint finish reflects the price paid,
in the instance of a Cali, it is marketed as a high end vehicle, (premium market) specially built, low production run vehicle / select factory base vehicle, therefore the finish in all respects should be above average?
Where are the QC checks allowing a vehicle to leave a special facility in this condition, let alone be sold via the dealer network?
Where where the QC checks?

Thanks Perfectos, you sound like you have an interest \ past experience in this field.

Your questions I sent in my last email to VW customer care and the dealer, basically I asked how did the customer manage to spot these issues but the dealer and the factory did not.

 

[Cloud Dodger]

Sounds like a nightmare. Did you get anywhere with that air con fan led fault because mine does the same. I found a video also by cali Chris and when he turned the fan in the video that did the same too!!!

Hi FB,

I did not get any further with the fan, to be honest I am more concerned with the paintwork. I do not know if the LEDs \ switch is faulty or if its meant to do it, as per my video.

I asked the delivery driver after he brought it back from the dealer and he seemed to think they all did it but he also said it did seem strange that only certain LED's light up intermittently. My initial thoughts is that the issue was to do with faulty or dirty contacts as you rotated the fan switch.

One thing the dealer said regarding paintwork (this is from memory so may not be 100% correct), one of the paint faults was to do with how the panels are joined \ crimped together and that sealant had leaked out of the joint but was then painted over. I assume he was talking about the tailgate defect and not the roof.

Compared to the paintwork, the fan issue is minor.

 

[flying banana]

I

Hi FB,

I did not get any further with the fan, to be honest I am more concerned with the paintwork. I do not know if the LEDs \ switch is faulty or if its meant to do it, as per my video.

I asked the delivery driver after he brought it back from the dealer and he seemed to think they all did it but he also said it did seem strange that only certain LED's light up intermittently. My initial thoughts is that the issue was to do with faulty or dirty contacts as you rotated the fan switch.

One thing the dealer said regarding paintwork (this is from memory so may not be 100% correct), one of the paint faults was to do with how the panels are joined \ crimped together and that sealant had leaked out of the joint but was then painted over. I assume he was talking about the tailgate defect and not the roof.

Compared to the paintwork, the fan issue is minor.

think the fan issue is normal. Good luck with the paint. Wait while you see how it feels when you put a couple of dings in it.!!!!

 

[Cloud Dodger]

Update.

On Tuesday, VW (not the dealer) sent a 3rd party paint inspection company PVWI to look at the vehicle. The chap took lots of photos (not just of the roof or tailgate), the chap unfortunately could not disclose his findings or views to me because VW where paying for the inspection and his report was for VW eyes only.

On Wednesday the dealer contacted me and said that VW had now confirmed the paint defects and asked for the current mileage on my Cali.

I am now waiting for the outcome, the dealer as intimated at a vehicle collection and a refund but the dealer is still communicating with VW, so this could change.

Will keep you updated....

 

[Perfectos]

Hi CD
Let’s hope for a perfect outcome for you, full refund or replacement vehicle of the same Spec or higher.
May I be so bold to suggest you start looking for a suitable replacement T6 or costing a factory order T6.1 so you know what your options are.
Incidentally if you decide to go the later route is their any possibility you keep your vehicle until the replacement arrives ?

 

[AlisonF]

Hi CD
Let’s hope for a perfect outcome for you, full refund or replacement vehicle of the same Spec or higher.
May I be so bold to suggest you start looking for a suitable replacement T6 or costing a factory order T6.1 so you know what your options are.
Incidentally if you decide to go the later route is their any possibility you keep your vehicle until the replacement arrives ?

T6.1 Beach not available in the UK I understand... so it becomes very complicated...

 

[Cloud Dodger]

I am assuming the only route may be a refund.

At the moment no options have been offered in writing, except an email alluding to refund and collection of Cali next week once the dealer has completed the rejection paperwork with VW.

As AlisonF states, the T6.1 Beach is not an option.

I have already been looking for a brand new high spec Beach's in our colour with our spec and there are none. If the collection and refund happens next week, there is a chance another Cali may not be a viable option.

Its my daily drive and I am not prepared to buy a *reliable* temporary vehicle to put me on whilst having to wait another 2-3 months for a T6.1 Coast to be built and we are not prepared to pay more for the Coast specification. We have also ruled out paying more for one of the last brand new T6 Oceans.

Also the whole rejection experience as been quite bruising, through no fault of ours.

I have already queried wether the refund will include the extended warranty, mats, mudflaps etc, the dealer says he needs to clarify this VW.

If anyone is looking for a 69 plate high spec Beach, then this one should be available soon on a VW forecourt, never slept in and we have not even had the roof up. I have not yet fitted the wind deflectors or bumper guard that I had bought for it and the external windscreen cover is still unopened.

It would have been interesting to see the paint inspectors report, he checked every panel on the Cali and not just the areas I found with defects.

Daz....

 

[AlisonF]

I am assuming the only route may be a refund.

At the moment no options have been offered in writing, except an email alluding to refund and collection of Cali next week once the dealer has completed the rejection paperwork with VW.

As AlisonF states, the T6.1 Beach is not an option.

I have already been looking for a brand new high spec Beach's in our colour with our spec and there are none. If the collection and refund happens next week, there is a chance another Cali may not be a viable option.

Its my daily drive and I am not prepared to buy a *reliable* temporary vehicle to put me on whilst having to wait another 2-3 months for a T6.1 Coast to be built and we are not prepared to pay more for the Coast specification. We have also ruled out paying more for one of the last brand new T6 Oceans.

Also the whole rejection experience as been quite bruising, through no fault of ours.

I have already queried wether the refund will include the extended warranty, mats, mudflaps etc, the dealer says he needs to clarify this VW.

If anyone is looking for a 69 plate high spec Beach, then this one should be available soon on a VW forecourt, never slept in and we have not even had the roof up. I have not yet fitted the wind deflectors or bumper guard that I had bought for it and the external windscreen cover is still unopened.

It would have been interesting to see the paint inspectors report, he checked every panel on the Cali and not just the areas I found with defects.

Daz....

This story is so heartbreaking to follow.
I’m sorry to hear you are having to go through this, and at the same time grateful you are sharing the experience with the forum.
Please keep us updated and keep asking for advice (I’ve had lots recently that have proved very helpful).
It is not acceptable to pay ca£60k for a top of the range vehicle and have it delivered with faults.

 

[Perfectos]

Not sure what spec your looking for but my comments regards pricing up a T6.1 was to use for your negotiations, which I have no doubt you will enter into if you are offered a refund.
Identifying the cost of an “available “ alternative replacement is important, this sorry process should not penalise you financially !
Understanding the cost of the possible options available to yourself will help highlight the potential issues you face and prepare you for the conversations with VWUK.
You may not want an Ocean or a coast, but you should make yourselves aware of the possible cost implications to yourself.
IMO VW should offer some good will and assistance particularly for the numerous issues that were allowed to leave the factory and pass through their process unchecked.
Let alone the lack of use you have had due to other issues with the quality of the premium product you purchased and the time taken to “investigate and rectify” Those issues!

As far as second hand there are plenty of vehicles still available, not sure if they would meet your spec requirements, my experience is that many are advertised incorrectly and don’t state all options, so it may be worth contacting some dealers to assess what is available close to your spec, again this should be related back to your particular circumstances and costs to date.if you can simply buy another vehicle at short notice there should not be too much issue, however if you can’t there has to be some sort of offset taken into account ?

Will VWUK help identifying possible vehicles “in UK stock” and assist with delivery of the available stock, should it be some physical distance away form you ?

I wonder if VW would be happy for this vehicle and the issues they allow to leave the factory to appear in the press or TV ? I suspect not and I suspect they will want that vehicle back ASAP so the problem which highlights serious quality issues goes away quietly and quickly. Don’t let the vehicle go out of your ownership until you have a written agreement from VW to your complete satisfaction. The fact that they have taken this serious enough to have the vehicle inspected by a third party rather than rely on the dealer network should speak volumes!
I would suspect the vehicle is beyond economical repair and will probably be disposed of through vehicle auction !

There are Lots of Cali B’s on autotrader
Ranging from basic to high spec.

https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/201905097768114?sort=year-desc&radius=1500&make=VOLKSWAGEN&advertising-location=at_cars&model=CALIFORNIA&year-from=2018&postcode=hp30nw&onesearchad=Used&onesearchad=Nearly%20New&onesearchad=New&page=1

I wish you the best of luck it must be a highly stressful time

 

[Cloud Dodger]

So......

The dealer (Robinsons VW Peterborough) has now come back and wants to collect the vehicle Monday and refund.

However, the refund is approx £2033 less than what we paid for the brand new, out of the factory vehicle collected November 2019.

This £2033 deduction is based on £1335 First reg and road tax, plus the dealer wants to charge 0.25 per mile for mileage (3012 miles) even though we reported paint problems and sent rejection at approx 900 miles.

Because the rejection process has taken so long, the mileage on the vehicle has gone up. The mileage also includes mileage to and from the dealer to look at the paint defects.

We can claim some of the road tax from DVLA, not sure how much.

I think they are basing their refund decision on my rejection being sent to the dealer outside the first 30 days.

If i understand the Consumer Rights Act 2015, a rejection after 30 days is shown below.
'=====================
After 30 days you lose the short-term right to reject the goods.
You’ll also have fewer rights, such as only being able to ask for a repair or replacement, or a partial refund.
'======================

In my rejection email, I asked for a replacement not refund BUT they had stopped making the Beach at this point and the dealer wanted to repair, i wanted to reject.

So there it is, through no fault of ours, VW factory paint defects *could* potentially cost us approx £2000.

 

[Perfectos]

I take it the dealer doesn’t want to sell another California to a users of this forum ?

You will have to argue your rights and importantly the morality of this with the Dealer. Do not accept or let the vehicle go out of your ownership until you have a full resolution.
Maybe some one like Watchdog etatal would like to take the case on ?

Why should this cost you a penny, you are the harmed party as a result of VW direct actions and failure to produce a product of acceptable standard, then by allowing the defective product to leave the factory, them by failing to inspect th3 v3hicle properly at the Dealer during their acceptance procedure, then failing to identify the numerous faults during preparation for sale.
Or did VW just ignore this fact knowing that some poor punter would have a load of grief, only to be told they now have to pay for VW issue of their own making.
I suggest a conversation with trading st@ndards and the ombudsman scheme that I have no doubt this dealer signs up to.
It disgusts me the contempt for th3 customers
Have VW offer any alternatives ?

Tell VW that you have a Holiday booked that you will be taking the vehicle, this tends to get their attention as they are liable for your loss.

I suggest to type up the whole sorry saga in one long long email, recording every fact and date, noting particularly the dates you reported items and the deals and prevarication on the part of VW include the dates you have not been able to “use and enjoy” the vehicle. State your legal rights and refuse to settle for anything less than a full refund and some good will on the part of VW.
I would let the dealer and VW know that you are an active member of this forum and you are aware of the full UK law relating to the sale of goods, the fact that The dealers prevarication resulted in you having no other option but to use the vehicle, their deliberate actions and failure to act in your best interest has caused this issue not you. (From factory to sale). Faulty goods are faulty goods and require a full refund. Full being the full cost you handed over to the dealer, the same dealer who failed to act reasonably by inspecting the vehicle appropriately before releasing the faulty goods to your ownership, despite advertising that they carry out a 140 point quality / safety check prior to hand over !

 

[Perfectos]

From the dealer website

“Our Approved Used Van Programme guarantees the incomparable driving experience that you expect from one of East Anglia's premier motor retailers. A used van has to pass rigorous checks to obtain our seal of approval. Mechanics, electrics, bodywork, interior, tyres, wheels, vehicle history and mileage - all are checked and double-checked before the car even gets close to the showroom. Style, safety and reliability all come as standard.”

Shame they only check the used vans over before punting them out !

The new van would have had to been subject to checks and ticks in box s at every stage, this is clearly a failure throughout the whole system, quality failure, check failure, customer support failure. Failure to act responsibly? Failure to accept responsibility? Failure to do the morally correct thing ?

 

[Cloud Dodger]

Have VW offer any alternatives ?

No alternatives from VW, they are leaving everything to the dealer. The contract is with dealer is the common theme. I know that VW and the dealer are or have been communicating regarding the rejection.

I have not yet accepted the terms, so it's not over yet.

The dealer claims, because the rejection process has started, it cannot be stopped and the rejection is going ahead whatever (which we are happy with).

However the rejection comes with the terms mentioned, which we were made aware of last night and at first glance appear a bit brutal.

What I am not sure of, if we say we won't accept the rejection terms, will they pull the rejection offer from the table and say "aah we now have the right to repair".

I wonder if VW (after their paint inspection) *have* put pressure on the dealer to accept the rejection and the dealers now kicking and screaming and wants their pound of flesh from the customer.

After collection Monday, no offer of a temp vehicle to keep us going till we find a replacement. Basically we've been thrown under a bus.

This whole experience is having a negative affect on my health and is now beginning to alter my view of owning any VW, of any make and model.

 

[subthree]

I am sorry to hear about all the hassle you have been through. However we have had an issue with our order (which I do not want to elaborate on at the moment) and, so far, VW UK have been superb. I haven't read all of your posts but I would urge you to contact VW UK directly if not already done so. They have genuinely surprised me with how good they have been. Unfortunately we all seem to have widely varying experiences with dealers and manufacturers.

 

[Perfectos]

Your contract is with the dealer, legally, let them know that. They will blame th3 factory, which is irrelevant, your contract is with the dealer.

Let them know why you consider that they are specifically at fault for allowing a vehicle to pass their multiple inspections and they are in breach of the contract you made with them to supply goods of a reasonable quality, a quality which has now been accepted to be substandard for a premium vehicle (costing £50k + ? )

Let the dealer sort out the costs they may have incurred with VWUk / GmbH.

What, how why you have ended up with faulty and substandard goods is not your concern.

You are the wounded party, through no fault of your own.

Express your dismay at the time this has taken from your initial report, and the prevarication on the part of the dealer and the fact that through no fault of your own you feel it unacceptable for a the dealer, backed by a huge worldwide organisation like VW that you as the paying customer are being left with “all cost” to be borne by yourself.

Escalate this within the dealer business as high as possible and let them know you will go legal if this is not sorted out to your satisfaction, I.e full refund or replacement vehicle to the same or higher specification.

The fact that this vehicle has been accepted by VWuk as faulty and beyond repair is your main point and should be the basis of your case.
VWuk will let the dealer try to close this case, the dealer has a case with VWuk, which is not your concern. Your contract is with the dealer it is the dealer who Must settle this with you, as far as I know the dealer cannot make you accept terms that are bias toward them, otherwise this is classed as unfair contract ! (Head you lose tails I win ! ) courts would look very dimly on this type of practice.

Is the dealer part of an ombudsman scheme, threaten that you will invoke this, which will cost the dealer, not you, and will add to the pressure on the dealer as they are bound by the ombudsman scheme they sign up to.

This may be being dealt with at a lowly position within the business to keep it hush hush ? The dealer will have been paid a commission to sell the van in the first place, there was profit associated with the sale for all concerned from the factory to the dealer the ticket price is not the cost to the manufacturer, VWuk and the dealer. Insist you personally speak to the management.


State that you are being left without a vehicle, not even a loan vehicle.

State that this is a high end vehicle with a cult following and the choice to buy one was an emotional process that has been totally sullied by the whole process and poor quality product received by yourself, let alone the stress this is and has caused you, now coupled with a financial penalty.

U.K. law is set to protect the consumer from these exact instances, get some of the free advice available.

You are going to have to battle this out, it is important to state all the facts In One clear and unequivocal communication, so as if this is presented to a third party, they can read one document and have a full understanding of the facts and that the costs for the failure of the various VW businesses, on multiple occasions are now being borne by you.

If all else fails, Present yourself at their show room on a Saturday, with the van an a sign inviting potential customers to discuss your experience with this dealer !

Do not be fobbed off easily, this is what the dealer wants and will use all twists and turns to get that vehicle back from you at no cost to themselves!

Remember you bought a bespoke high end vehicle in good faith on the express promise (contract) that the vehicle supplied to you would be “high quality, fit for purpose, reasonably free from manufacturing defects and of an acceptable quality commensurate with what you paid for a brand new vehicle and were expressly told you would receive”?
Has the dealer stuck to their “express” and “implied” contract ?
Has the dealer offered a “reasonable “ resolution so as to limit your loss and provide you with a replacement?
Has the dealer acted in your best interest at any stage ?

Mistakes happen it how they are dealt with that are a mark of a good company

 

[Perfectos]

Hi CD
A very very important part of this whole sorry saga is did you buy the van with any sort of finance or indeed use a credit card for any part of the order including the deposit?

This may be a an issue that works heavily in your favour if you did use either method to make any part of the payment ( even £100) ?

 

[flying banana]

I feel for you mate. I remember how excited you were when I met you at the VW show in Doncaster. I wouldn't let it put you off and would suggest the 2nd hand market. might not be the exact spec you want but there are some great beaches for sale at the moment with very little mileage on them. good luck

 

[Rich20]

There is no way you should be out of pocket for this fiasco. you must dig deep and stick by your request for a full refund. This dealer is doing themselves no favours amongst the good people in this club. Why would anyone want to buy from a dealership that only wants to look after its own pocket rather than provide its customers with world class service. I do hope you get an outcome in your favour.

 

[Cloud Dodger]

I feel for you mate. I remember how excited you were when I met you at the VW show in Doncaster. I wouldn't let it put you off and would suggest the 2nd hand market. might not be the exact spec you want but there are some great beaches for sale at the moment with very little mileage on them. good luck

Cheers, already keeping an eye out for a possible replacement. The rejection is happening it's just down to numbers now.

 

[Amarillo]

There is no way you should be out of pocket for this fiasco.

He has had 3 or 4 months use of a California and clocked up some 3000 miles, some of which would be going to and from the dealer, but it should not be an expectation that the dealer will pay the full cost of those 3 months and 3000 miles.

 

[Perfectos]

He has had 3 or 4 months use of a California and clocked up some 3000 miles, some of which would be going to and from the dealer, but it should not be an expectation that the dealer will pay the full cost of those 3 months and 3000 miles.

I disagree strongly, if you bought a TV, used it for three months, reported a problem soon after purchase, but it took the supplier 4 months to acknowledge the problem should you expect an exchange or full refund !
You wouldn’t expect the supplier to say, we’ll you've had the tv for 4 months let’s deduct £200 from what we owe you, despite us admitting the fault is not of your making ?
The dealer makes a profit from the sale, only if they keep to their side of the contract !

 

[Rich20]

He has had 3 or 4 months use of a California and clocked up some 3000 miles, some of which would be going to and from the dealer, but it should not be an expectation that the dealer will pay the full cost of those 3 months and 3000 miles.

I get that but had the dealer done their job in the first place and properly checked the vehicle at PDI then the problem would not have got this involved. It is their error and therefore they must carry the can. They in turn could have rejected the vehicle from VW.

 

[Rich20]

Taken from the Autotrader website:

The Pre-Delivery inspection (PDI) is the final check carried out by the dealer on a car before they hand it over to you. As part of the process, you should receive a certificate to guarantee that the inspection has been carried out and that there are no problems. If you don’t, then insist on receiving it before you take delivery of the car.

Exactly what’s included in the PDI will vary from make to make, but essentially it’s a complete and thorough examination of every aspect of the car, from the exterior panels to the interior, mechanical parts and electrics. A brief road test is also included, and if there are any minor problems, they will be fixed there and then. More major problems will be passed on to an appropriate specialist.

At the same time, the fluid levels will be checked and the car’s number plates put on. What it all means is that, when you take delivery of your car, it should be problem-free and in perfect working order.

 

[Cloud Dodger]

He has had 3 or 4 months use of a California and clocked up some 3000 miles, some of which would be going to and from the dealer, but it should not be an expectation that the dealer will pay the full cost of those 3 months and 3000 miles.

Hi Amarillo - Your comments sound reasonable, until you understand the sequence of events:

1st November (Official collection - abandoned due to seat fault)
5th November (Vehicle delivered to me seat fixed)
4th December (First paint defect reported + approx 900-975 miles)
6th January (Dealer eventually collected vehicle for inspection - 33 days after paint defect reported)
etc etc etc

The *only* reason the mileage increased, is we did *exactly* what the dealer asked us to do with regards to inspections etc. The dealer chose not to get the vehicle into their bodyshop for inspection for nearly a month after we reported the first paint defect.

The initial delay as now snowballed into the situation the dealer created. We did not frustrate or refuse to let them have the vehicle, they chose where, when and how events would progress. We did what the dealer requested of us.

I am not going to stop driving the vehicle because the dealer was dragging their feet and trying to frustrate the inspection and rejection process.

Hope this helps.