T6.1 quality drop?

[Borris]

No reason why it should, Transit build quality (or was it just an improved model?) seemed to go up when that went to Turkey.
Wolfsburg is moving to solely electric production, mistakenly in my view as Fuel Cell or Methane is the real answer.

I'd be more concerned about Ford's involvement than future VWs being built in Turkey. I'm sure that VW will be maintaining a very close eye on quality control. However, Ford virtually invented the art of paring back manufacturing costs so I expect the product to be effected by this partnership. Some aspects of this arrangement will be good others less so. However the bean counters at Ford have considerable experience at knowing where to save money. That may translate into a changed perception of the quality of the product.

I remember buying a six month old Mercedes E class estate in 2005. I knew about their partnership with Chrysler but didn't realise what an effect it had made on the brand. The bean counters had bean at work and the product had suffered. The Mercs of this era didn't have the legendary MB bomb proof build quality of their predecessors. These days they sell nice cars but I wouldn't say that they are that much better than other brands. Just my opinion.

 

[SusiBus]

@SusiBus
Still not seen a single fault reported on the California digital dash...........

So up yours!

"Put it in your pipe and smoke it" was meant as a light-hearted jokey comment.
The response, "So up yours!" with an explanation mark, seems a little aggressive. Perhaps that's because your a Luton FC supporter, who thought Watford FC would be keeping them company next year in the lower Championship. Perhaps if Luton try harder next year, they can come and join us with the elite in the Premiership. Come on you horns.

 

[Elmo3]

I'd be more concerned about Ford's involvement than future VWs being built in Turkey. I'm sure that VW will be maintaining a very close eye on quality control. However, Ford virtually invented the art of paring back manufacturing costs so I expect the product to be effected by this partnership. Some aspects of this arrangement will be good others less so. However the bean counters at Ford have considerable experience at knowing where to save money. That may translate into a changed perception of the quality of the product.

I remember buying a six month old Mercedes E class estate in 2005. I knew about their partnership with Chrysler but didn't realise what an effect it had made on the brand. The bean counters had bean at work and the product had suffered. The Mercs of this era didn't have the legendary MB bomb proof build quality of their predecessors. These days they sell nice cars but I wouldn't say that they are that much better than other brands. Just my opinion.

We’ll never see build quality the likes of the W124 ever again. The reduction in quality over time is directly linked to shorter ownership cycles driven by manufacturers to sell more units more often, all enabled by the explosion in financial services. If it’s in warranty, the customer doesn’t really care if quality isn’t what it used to be, they’ll have another new one in 2 or 3 years. As we know, there are a lot of older vans giving great service today, which are pretty simple for anyone to work on. Will this be the case in 10 - 20 years time with the new vans today? I doubt it. They’re just too complicated and will cost a bomb to fix outside warranty. Not really progress is it.

 

[Calimili]

We’ll never see build quality the likes of the W124 ever again. The reduction in quality over time is directly linked to shorter ownership cycles driven by manufacturers to sell more units more often, all enabled by the explosion in financial services. If it’s in warranty, the customer doesn’t really care if quality isn’t what it used to be, they’ll have another new one in 2 or 3 years. As we know, there are a lot of older vans giving great service today, which are pretty simple for anyone to work on. Will this be the case in 10 - 20 years time with the new vans today? I doubt it. They’re just too complicated and will cost a bomb to fix outside warranty. Not really progress is it

absolutely not. we are trying to save the last gramm of Nox/Co2 to save the planet, but then forced to scrap vehicles (lots of plastic/metal, pleanty of electronic components) much quicker than before...

 

[andyinluton]

"Put it in your pipe and smoke it" was meant as a light-hearted jokey comment.
The response, "So up yours!" with an explanation mark, seems a little aggressive. Perhaps that's because your a Luton FC supporter, who thought Watford FC would be keeping them company next year in the lower Championship. Perhaps if Luton try harder next year, they can come and join us with the elite in the Premiership. Come on you horns.

"Up yours" was intended as a light hearted response to your original unwarranted insult.

Try & keep football off this forum, you will only loose.

Please remind me what silverware there is in the Watford cabinet? apart from the one for the biggest embarrassment at a cup final.

Head-to-head record
Match result
Luton Town win 32
draw 19
Watford win 26

Last Match
Luton Town 1 - 0 Watford
Date: 12:30 17/04/2021

Nothing else to add.

 

[SusiBus]

Mines got a glovebox, it fits the handbook, has a lock on it. who said there isn't one?

Sorry your right Andy, the T6.1 does have a glove box. What l meant to say was, l tried to the put a handbook in the glove box, but without success. Must have been being stupid. As we are without Cali at the moment, l can't try to re-educate myself.
I still think the T6.1 dash is in many aspects a retrograde step.

 

[wilburthewombat]

Sorry your right Andy, the T6.1 does have a glove box. What l meant to say was, l tried to the put a handbook in the glove box, but without success. Must have been being stupid. As we are without Cali at the moment, l can't try to re-educate myself.
I still think the T6.1 dash is in many aspects a retrograde step.

My handbook does not fit in the glove box. It really is just big enough for gloves ...

 

[Calimili]

I keep the manual under the seat in a bag with other docs that I am unlikely to ever need, so quick access is not important. Then i have the glove box for other stuff that I may need more frequently

 

[California4x4]

Is the VW Amarok and the Ford Ranger not already a successful joint venture? If so, I haven’t heard of any quality issues with either of the vehicles, but admit I haven’t looked very hard. That bodes well / less bad for the proposed T8 and Ford joint venture in Turkey.

 

[Borris]

We’ll never see build quality the likes of the W124 ever again. The reduction in quality over time is directly linked to shorter ownership cycles driven by manufacturers to sell more units more often, all enabled by the explosion in financial services. If it’s in warranty, the customer doesn’t really care if quality isn’t what it used to be, they’ll have another new one in 2 or 3 years. As we know, there are a lot of older vans giving great service today, which are pretty simple for anyone to work on. Will this be the case in 10 - 20 years time with the new vans today? I doubt it. They’re just too complicated and will cost a bomb to fix outside warranty. Not really progress is it.

Unfortunately, I have to agree with you.

There are a few us still around though that would love to buy something of quality that will last. Much better for the environment me thinks. That was my game plan with that E class. I'd probably still have it if problems with the gearbox had effectively written it off. It was a nice car but not in the same league as it's predessesors.

I've been flirting on and off with the idea of selling my three current hobby cars and Mrs B's Skoda and looking around for an MB W113. Like the one in that Helen Mirren/ Bob Hoskins film. Was it "The Long good Friday" ? Red with red Pagoda hard top and steels with matching red factory wheel trims. I'm 67 so it's now or never!

Not so basic but well engineered quality that is designed to last. Surely it has to be much better for the planet than all these short lived "environmentally friendly" pcp motors?

 

[blondebier]

Cost cutting to the point where it shows in the quality of the product is never a good idea.

Mercedes taught the manufacturing world a painful lesson. Too much cost cutting will eventually cost you your hard won reputation. Anyone remember these?



The most successful organisations are the ones that think differently, innovate and bring efficiencies so that the product and quality improve.

I don't think VW got it quite right with some of the choices they made on the T6.1.

 

[andyinluton]

I've been flirting on and off with the idea of selling my three current hobby cars and Mrs B's Skoda and looking around for a MB W113. Like the one in that Helen Mirren/ Bob Hoskins film. Was it the Long good Friday ? Red with red Pagoda hard top and steels with matching red factory wheel trims. I'm 67 so it's now or never!

Have you driven one? I had one about 30 years ago, it drove like a large saloon with steering not unlike that of a super tanker, turn the wheel 5 minutes before you get to a corner.

Lovely to look at but not so good to drive.

If you could fit the later R129 mechanicals into a W113 body shell I think you would get close to perfection.

 

[Corradobrit]

I'd be more concerned about Ford's involvement than future VWs being built in Turkey. I'm sure that VW will be maintaining a very close eye on quality control. However, Ford virtually invented the art of paring back manufacturing costs so I expect the product to be effected by this partnership. Some aspects of this arrangement will be good others less so. However the bean counters at Ford have considerable experience at knowing where to save money. That may translate into a changed perception of the quality of the product.

I remember buying a six month old Mercedes E class estate in 2005. I knew about their partnership with Chrysler but didn't realise what an effect it had made on the brand. The bean counters had bean at work and the product had suffered. The Mercs of this era didn't have the legendary MB bomb proof build quality of their predecessors. These days they sell nice cars but I wouldn't say that they are that much better than other brands. Just my opinion.

Didn't work out well for Aston Martin (Ford had 75% ownership from 1987 to 2007), what with dubious design decisions, Ford parts bin components etc etc. Ultimately it will come down to who has majority stake.

 

[Borris]

Have you driven one? I had one about 30 years ago, it drove like a large saloon with steering not unlike that of a super tanker, turn the wheel 5 minutes before you get to a corner.

Lovely to look at but not so good to drive.

If you could fit the later R129 mechanicals into a W113 body shell I think you would get close to perfection.

Well the W113 is nearly sixty years old now and was never really a sports car but more of a grand tourer so that's about what I'd expect. Having had a succession of much older cars I'm no stranger to the quirks of older vehicles. That's part of their charm for me. Whilst these things can be improved I've always preferred to keep them as original as possible. Anyway it'll probably never happen as I'd have to sell my current cars first and they are in a niche market so might not be that easy.

 

[AlisonF]

I have some issues with my T6.1, I had some with my T6. However, I still love(d) both vehicles.
My T6.1 was away today to have the missing BEACH logo put on, and wind deflectors. I was called to say it was on its way and waited patiently for half an hour outside… I gave up and started walking to the local shop. En route, this shining silver dream machine was turning out of a junction (driver had gone the wrong way). I have not seen my Beach on the road. Wow, I was so proud. It looked stunning. I have to admit to standing in the road and grinning ear to ear as the driver drove it back to my house.
That is what a Cali does to you. Even with the ‘issues’.

 

[Wongo]

I'd be more concerned about Ford's involvement than future VWs being built in Turkey. I'm sure that VW will be maintaining a very close eye on quality control. However, Ford virtually invented the art of paring back manufacturing costs so I expect the product to be effected by this partnership. Some aspects of this arrangement will be good others less so. However the bean counters at Ford have considerable experience at knowing where to save money. That may translate into a changed perception of the quality of the product.

I remember buying a six month old Mercedes E class estate in 2005. I knew about their partnership with Chrysler but didn't realise what an effect it had made on the brand. The bean counters had bean at work and the product had suffered. The Mercs of this era didn't have the legendary MB bomb proof build quality of their predecessors. These days they sell nice cars but I wouldn't say that they are that much better than other brands. Just my opinion.

Henry Ford used to send engineers into scrapyards to look at rusted out Model T’s if there was a component that had lasted longer than tbe rest, he ordered it to be made cheaper!

 

[clarinetbcn]

I have some issues with my T6.1, I had some with my T6. However, I still love(d) both vehicles.
My T6.1 was away today to have the missing BEACH logo put on, and wind deflectors. I was called to say it was on its way and waited patiently for half an hour outside… I gave up and started walking to the local shop. En route, this shining silver dream machine was turning out of a junction (driver had gone the wrong way). I have not seen my Beach on the road. Wow, I was so proud. It looked stunning. I have to admit to standing in the road and grinning ear to ear as the driver drove it back to my house.
That is what a Cali does to you. Even with the ‘issues’.

I smile every time I walk up to my Cali, whether it's in the middle of the mountains or in its Barcelona parking spot. However, my very optimistic plan is that it will be my last car. When I turn 70 it will be over 10 years old, and the last thing I will want to be doing is crawling under it or tearing my (still full head of) hair out over electrical gremlins and hard to reach cheap plastic interior parts that snap off. I very much hope it sees me through, but even though the design works perfectly for me, it's ruggedness is not reassuring. Frankly I'm counting on an aftermarket industry developing to provide quality repair parts at a reasonable price to keep these vans running in better shape than when they left the factory in their currently unimpressive state of finish. If I'm still kicking after that, I'm counting on an electric transplant being available 10 years from now to get it (and maybe even me!) to 1,000,000kms!

Those who change vehicles while still under warranty won't be concerned about these issues, but I have always taken a different approach. I drove my 1978 323i until 2002, and then sold it to a friend who still races it in classic rallies.

 

[vananarama]

I've been trying to get details on a lid for the tray... Is it possible do you think? Can't bear the reflection... Anyone looked in to this please?

Van-X were promising something for the T6. Randomly, I checked tonight and a year on they’ve not brought it out. Perhaps they’ve opted to do one for the T6.1 instead (I didn’t check). They do a stereo cover for it. Doesn’t look great though.


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[vananarama]

Is the T6.1 production moving to Turkey? If so, would one expect this to have a negative impact on quality?

No.


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[vananarama]

Other than the front door trims which I've commented on above, I really am struggling to see where the internal finish isn't as good.

The low level parts of the dash and the top part are exactly the same plastic as all previous versions. The central part of the dash with the piano black and grey textured trim are fine.

The plastic to all the seat bases, window surrounds etc are exactly as before.

So perhaps you could tell us where the internal finish isn't as good?

I've attached a couple of photos to assist.

View attachment 80085

View attachment 80086

View attachment 80087

Looks great. Every bit as good/bad as T5 and T6 in my view (better actually). Would kill for that colour dash display. Really should have had those in the T6 by 2018…


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[ArunAlec]

I smile every time I walk up to my Cali, whether it's in the middle of the mountains or in its Barcelona parking spot. However, my very optimistic plan is that it will be my last car. When I turn 70 it will be over 10 years old, and the last thing I will want to be doing is crawling under it or tearing my (still full head of) hair out over electrical gremlins and hard to reach cheap plastic interior parts that snap off. I very much hope it sees me through, but even though the design works perfectly for me, it's ruggedness is not reassuring. Frankly I'm counting on an aftermarket industry developing to provide quality repair parts at a reasonable price to keep these vans running in better shape than when they left the factory in their currently unimpressive state of finish. If I'm still kicking after that, I'm counting on an electric transplant being available 10 years from now to get it (and maybe even me!) to 1,000,000kms!

Those who change vehicles while still under warranty won't be concerned about these issues, but I have always taken a different approach. I drove my 1978 323i until 2002, and then sold it to a friend who still races it in classic rallies.

I fear it will be the lack of software support that will be the nail in the coffin! At what point will VW (or any other manufacturer) stop supporting older vehicles in the same way as computer/IT companies cease support for old equipment and software.

 

[Perfectos]

Looks great. Every bit as good/bad as T5 and T6 in my view (better actually). Would kill for that colour dash display. Really should have had those in the T6 by 2018…


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It’s possible

T6.1 Virtual Cockpit Upgrade

We are pleased to offer the genuine Volkswagen virtual cockpit as a retrofit for your T6.1 2020 onwards Volkswagen transporters. It s suitable for

www.hazzydayz.com

 

[clarinetbcn]

I fear it will be the lack of software support that will be the nail in the coffin! At what point will VW (or any other manufacturer) stop supporting older vehicles in the same way as computer/IT companies cease support for old equipment and software.

That's the concern, but I'm hoping a group of IT electronics nerds/Cali fanatics will emerge to save us, along the lines of this classic:

https://www.amazon.com/dp/1566913101/

 

[soulstyledevon]

I have some issues with my T6.1, I had some with my T6. However, I still love(d) both vehicles.
My T6.1 was away today to have the missing BEACH logo put on, and wind deflectors. I was called to say it was on its way and waited patiently for half an hour outside… I gave up and started walking to the local shop. En route, this shining silver dream machine was turning out of a junction (driver had gone the wrong way). I have not seen my Beach on the road. Wow, I was so proud. It looked stunning. I have to admit to standing in the road and grinning ear to ear as the driver drove it back to my house.
That is what a Cali does to you. Even with the ‘issues’.

Imagine the grin on owners faces with the Ocean badge…

 

[Elmo3]

Unfortunately, I have to agree with you.

There are a few us still around though that would love to buy something of quality that will last. Much better for the environment me thinks. That was my game plan with that E class. I'd probably still have it if problems with the gearbox had effectively written it off. It was a nice car but not in the same league as it's predessesors.

I've been flirting on and off with the idea of selling my three current hobby cars and Mrs B's Skoda and looking around for an MB W113. Like the one in that Helen Mirren/ Bob Hoskins film. Was it "The Long good Friday" ? Red with red Pagoda hard top and steels with matching red factory wheel trims. I'm 67 so it's now or never!

Not so basic but well engineered quality that is designed to last. Surely it has to be much better for the planet than all these short lived "environmentally friendly" pcp motors?

Consumerism is better for the govt than things being built to last. Keeps people working away on the treadmill to buy new stuff they don’t need. Disastrous for the environment of course.