T7 - All electric?

Been posted before....
 
Hotel, thanks for reminding me. Shoulda, coulda, woulda searched better but obviously missed it/forgot it.

For those interested Herbert Diess who interestingly is Chairman of VW Passenger Cars will be speaking at 8.30 pm on Tuesday, so half past midnight Wednesday morning for us, half past one for you Hotel. I'm sure you'll stay up for this one!

Will be interesting to see if anything is announced, although from the autocar article if they do production in Mexico it could make for an interesting time for the trusty salesmen here in the Europe communicating with the factory about orders!

Hotel, given how imminent this is I thought it a good idea to post, should have added it to the previous posts to remind folks.........
 
My money is on hydrogen
 
Maybe we should have a poll?

I didn't think VW were researching hydrogen that actively. Thought Honda and to some degree Toyota were the leading lights there.
 
As an addendum, here's an interesting tweet from someone making the trip from Wales to NE Scotland. I'm sure there are many similar stories.

Look at the cost!

https://mobile.twitter.com/TrystanLea/status/683349371988107264

Mmmm impressive.
But need to keep in mind that nearly all of this journey is on motorway and fairly serious main/trunk roads where charge points are plentiful(ish).
And many of the charge points are free (at the moment).
... but impressive nevertheless.
 
As an addendum, here's an interesting tweet from someone making the trip from Wales to NE Scotland. I'm sure there are many similar stories.

Look at the cost!

https://mobile.twitter.com/TrystanLea/status/683349371988107264

Yes but that's a small/medium car, not a 3t van. Until they get batteries sorted I can't see that a vehicle like the Cali wold be a practical solution. More weight, more power required, more bigger batteries = vicious circle.
Anyway, where's all this electricity coming from? We can barely keep the lights on now.
 
It's all a big con foisted on the public. Whether an electric vehicle using rechargeable batteries or a fuel cell using hydrogen then someone somewhere is producing the electricity to charge the batteries or produce the hydrogen. Also the chemicals and exotic metals etc: used to produce the batteries and fuel cells have to be made and disposed of eventually.
All you are doing is moving the environmental impact from A to B with very little reduction overall.
An ALL electric California is a non-starter. A Diesel Electric Hybrid is a possibility.
 
Never say never is my motto. Next technological breakthrough I reckon is on batteries. I don't know what route but when it comes it will be the game changer.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
Currently have a petrol electric Outlander. 95% of the journeys are on electric. The fuel use at the moment is 320mpg for the 750miles covered.

Electric average is 3.2miles per KW. At 15p per KW, a cost comparison against petrol, at £1 a litre (cheap at the moment), equates to 96mpg. Our X5 averaged 28mpg for the same journey.

We also have PVs.
 
Currently have a petrol electric Outlander. 95% of the journeys are on electric. The fuel use at the moment is 320mpg for the 750miles covered.

Electric average is 3.2miles per KW. At 15p per KW, a cost comparison against petrol, at £1 a litre (cheap at the moment), equates to 96mpg. Our X5 averaged 28mpg for the same journey.

We also have PVs.

Yes but your electricity is subsidised by the tax payer so it's not a true cost. As WG points out the cost and environmental consequences of producing batteries are huge.
I agree the Outlander is probably the way to go though, we have a cousin who has one and loves it.
 
Electric powered vans may be useful for a business where they work within a small radius and return to the depot regularly where they can be recharged.

In the case of the Cali which will be covering long distances the batteries will become exhausted and the vehicle will then have to switch over to an alternative source of power or stop to recharge; the latter option being impractical with the present number of recharging points. My wife has a hybrid Golf and we already have been unable to recharge due to the growing number of PHEV's queuing to use the plug ins.

Our journeys in the Golf are generally short, and for our use it works very well. When the batteries are fully charged the indicated range is (optimistically) shown as 31 miles, so on shopping trips and visiting local relatives it is very cheap to run (and pleasant to drive).

Now, the weather is not too warm at present so let's put the heater on. Guess where does the heat comes from? Yes, the batteries. Switch the heater on and 6 miles disappear off the range straight away! You can warm the car up prior to setting off while it's still plugged in, but that doesn't last long and the windows soon start to mist up. So you can open them and freeze, or just let the ICE (internal combustion engine) come on a bit earlier. Once the engine comes on petrol consumption is no better than conventional vehicles so journeys beyond 25 - 30 miles will cost the same as now.

So by the time the T7 appears maybe there will be a full electric version (like Nissan etc have already) but it will only be suitable for a local delivery van. For longer journeys it would need to be a hybrid, so there will be the weight of the batteries and electric motor, plus the weight of the ICE and gearbox etc. The Cali already has a slim payload so unless some major slimming of the caravan components takes place we'll only be able to carry a couple of cans of beans with us!

Also, the current Cali is pushing £60k with a few options, so by the time the T7 appears we could be looking around £80 - 100k with the extra cost of the hybrid gear. And it will be unlikely you will be able to recharge on the camp site as the current draw from the charge will likely trip the supply!

I'm not anti electric cars, I think they are great, but I just can't see the Cali being suitable. I don't see the current incentives for going electric being sustained either.
 
Hmmm... I was under the impression it was this below (copied and pasted from DOECC website)

"Renewable energy subsidies are paid for via energy bills through a number of schemes including the Feed-in Tariff scheme and Renewable Obligation scheme"

The scheme is a PFI, where "we" finance the renewable energy, the supplier meets his targets for renewables and then charges and makes a profit for administrating the scheme.

Old article but interesting. If I had an opinion I would provide it but I don't have sufficient facts to hand...

http://www.theguardian.com/environment/blog/2012/oct/05/electric-cars-emissions-bad-environment

To date we have produced 14.120 MW
 
agree, agree, agree.

In my old job we knew for a long time that most daily travel for a motor vehicle is less than say 100 miles and only very occasional is it more, so for most people an electric car is the optimum solution, especially if you have a way of generating electricity (PV etc.). The issue is to get people to change the way they perceive vehicle ownership. If people chose rationally they would have a small electric vehicle for daily use and hire a specific larger vehicle for those long journeys, visiting Auntie Mabel, holidays etc. One of my colleagues always used to say that any vehicle you own is suboptimal. He had 4 kids from 2 marriages, so was either child free (cabriolet for the weekend) or needed a minibus etc. etc.

Let's hope VW don't get this completely wrong (if they do anything at all) and offer a fully electric option which would be useless for those long touring holidays but great for round town. As WG said (I think) a hybrid would be the obvious solution. Or maybe we'll all have to have towbars fitted to tow a generator on a trailer :headbang

And of course as pointed out you need to take into account the full energy cost of any solution, i.e. manufacturing, cost of energy production and delivery to point of use etc.

Still if they do put in an electric drivetrain then DSG lag will be a thing of the past. You'll see Calis nipping into spaces in the traffic they could never reach before. :)

PS @pjm-84 we also have PV, not sure what our total production is but now we have a low wattage camping kettle you can boil it for nothing for 9 months of the year as well as not blowing the fuses in camp sites.
 
Acceleration will be awesome. Think milk float. Zero-30mph in about 0.001mS. The rest may be an issue as will distance :bananadance
 
I am not sure if it still the case but BMW used the system mentioned above of having the right vehicle for the right journey. We looked at buying the i3, which was electric but had a small 2 stroke motor on board (which didn't drive any of the wheels but served as a generator when needed to support the low battery), and BMW offered a loan 3 or 5 series for longer journeys. I think you subscribed to the service, giving you a fixed number of days use of the bigger vehicles per year.
Clever system - both the loan car and the onboard generator - but there's no denying the inevitable weight of the Cali when using battery power.

In saying that, the Tesla Model S, the ultimate electric car at the moment, I would suggest, weighs in at over 2 tonnes, can do 0-60 in less than 3 seconds (if you tick the right options) and is good for over 200 miles on a charge so there is hope!!
 
Hi Rhyddin, I think there are a few OEMs that have that idea. The economics for them must make sense. There's thousands of used vehicles in stock and it also gets folks trying out other types to the one they own. So win-win. Not sure how many other OEMs do that in the UK though.
 
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