Which electric car to buy?

[clarinetbcn]

A little simplistic.

Why this compulsion to be insulting? @GrannyJen I hope WG's mansplaining has helped you see the light.

 

[Wildcamper]

You might find it interesting to read the article, as a large part of it talks about the second and third uses of these batteries being developed by GM and Tesla, once they outlast the original vehicle. The second and third uses are included in the original design.

Repurposing is already happening with today's EV batteries.

Second Life: Carmakers and Storage Startups Get Serious About Reusing Batteries

Batteries still have a lot of life in them after being swapped out of EVs. Why not use them on the grid?

www.greentechmedia.com

Repurposing current batteries will not go very far due to the degradation of the chemicals used and battery amnesia. Future solid state batteries may, or may not, be better. There some fantastic ideas coming out regarding battery construction and materials. But beware of getting too excited. Why? Because the likely hood of any great idea making it to market is tiny, about 1%. But we do need as many ideas as possible to make that 1% really count.

I find the position you appear to take interesting, being the owner of a 3 tonne diesel vehicle that seems to be loaded up with goodies. It must have an interesting carbon footprint which would seem to be at odds with the position you appear to take. Just an observation from your public profile.

 

[Amarillo]

A little simplistic. Battersea was replaced by power stations outside London and 100's of miles of power cables strung across the countryside to serve London.

When was the last time Gas and Coal supplies were cut off due to storm damage?

I think those who have had no electricity for the past 8 days following Storm Arwen would have a few things to say about our dash for green electricity.

Those people without gas and electricity would have been a whole lot better off if they had a heat pump installed and solar panels on their roof.

 

[andyinluton]

Those people without gas and electricity would have been a whole lot better off if they had a heat pump installed and solar panels on their roof.

Solar in winter in Scotland = naff all output
Heatpump with no electric = no heat

I don't understand how they would be better off?

Add in an electric car & they would be totally stuffed.

 

[Wildcamper]

Those people without gas and electricity would have been a whole lot better off if they had a heat pump installed and solar panels on their roof.

Heat pumps do not work without an electrical input to drive the fans and the pumps and during those cold nights the solar panels will supply zero electricity.

 

[soulstyledevon]

Solar in winter in Scotland = naff all output
Heatpump with no electric = no heat

I don't understand how they would be better off?

Add in an electric car & they would be totally stuffed.

Add in an electric car and they can’t even evacuate…

 

[ArunAlec]

Add in an electric car and they can’t even evacuate…

Cordless phone, and they can’t report the fault!

 

[WelshGas]

Those people without gas and electricity would have been a whole lot better off if they had a heat pump installed and solar panels on their roof.

Go and tell them that. I dare you.

 

[WelshGas]

Why this compulsion to be insulting? @GrannyJen I hope WG's mansplaining has helped you see the light.

Expected response .
Closing down Battersea just moved the problem elsewhere and created another problem, cross country overland power transmission which are susceptible to storm damage.

 

[WelshGas]

It's not a dash for green electricity, it's an attempt to correct the selfish path of trashing the future of today's children by not being willing to put up with some transitional discomfort now. What will they say about us when they are adults? Right now it seems likely to be, "How could they?" and "What were they thinking?" In fact, some of them are saying it right now, and get abuse heaped on them by the "adults" who are in charge.

Quit rightly. As they pose with their mobile phones and listen to their streaming services over the mobile network, play their computer games and chatting on social media.
All they do is complain but do they actually do anything, do they actually have any “ Ideas” to put forward.
If we are going to go forward it will be with the help of science and engineering not some 17 yr old Swedish girl who hasn’t even finished her education.

People are not going to reduce their standard of living and the 3rd world want what we have and will not compromise.

What have you actually done , personally , to reduce your carbon footprint, and please don’t bang on about all the solar energy your solar panels, subsidised by the government etc, produce. What have you done personally? Sold your California, foregone your trips to the mountains etc. According to your posts - not a lot. In fact have you reduced your resource consumption at all?

 

[Ozzy Pete]

If you were all so concerned with the environment you wouldn’t be driving diesel campervans doing 30mpg. You will have the right to spout when you drive only non fossil fuel vehicles.Riding a bike doesn’t count unless it’s your ONLY transport. If it is then you should be applauded. If you live in a city you will have your choice of ways to heat your house. However in the Welsh countryside you have less choices. Gas No. Electricity Yes but very expensive. Oil yes but a fossil fuel. Anthracite and wood plentiful and only wood renewable..All other form of heating ie heat pumps very very expensive..The chance of having a tidal lagoon in Swansea was withdrawn because of the cost. Now electricity has more than doubled in price ... Now it looks like it’s back on the cards again without any government backing. HS2 = £100 billion to save half an hour. Tidal lagoon £1 billion. Wales shafted again.

 

[clarinetbcn]

Quit rightly. As they pose with their mobile phones and listen to their streaming services over the mobile network, play their computer games and chatting on social media.
All they do is complain but do they actually do anything, do they actually have any “ Ideas” to put forward.
If we are going to go forward it will be with the help of science and engineering not some 17 yr old Swedish girl who hasn’t even finished her education.

People are not going to reduce their standard of living and the 3rd world want what we have and will not compromise.

What have you actually done , personally , to reduce your carbon footprint, and please don’t bang on about all the solar energy your solar panels, subsidised by the government etc, produce. What have you done personally? Sold your California, foregone your trips to the mountains etc. According to your posts - not a lot. In fact have you reduced your resource consumption at all?

Yes, as you mentioned, my home is net zero consumption. I haven’t used a vehicle daily for 20 years, because in 2002 I took the decision to move from outside Barcelona to 15 min. walking to my work at the opera house. I don’t even use the elevator to get to my 6th floor flat, unless I’m loaded down with groceries (which is one of the reasons that at 66 I’m still climbing peaks!) I move around Barcelona by bike, or excellent public transportation if the weather is bad. And when I do go to the mountains, about 50% of the time it’s with 7, which makes it one of the cleanest vehicles per person/trip on the road. That’s why I bought a Beach.

You, apparently, have done nothing. You live in a fictional world where children are at fault. Do you find that comforting?

 

[WelshGas]

Yes, as you mentioned, my home is net zero consumption. I haven’t used a vehicle daily for 20 years, because in 2002 I took the decision to move from outside Barcelona to 15 min. walking to my work at the opera house. I don’t even use the elevator to get to my 6th floor flat, unless I’m loaded down with groceries (which is one of the reasons that at 66 I’m still climbing peaks!) I move around Barcelona by bike, or excellent public transportation if the weather is bad. And when I do go to the mountains, about 50% of the time it’s with 7, which makes it one of the cleanest vehicles per person/trip on the road. That’s why I bought a Beach.

You, apparently, have done nothing. You live in a fictional world where children are at fault. Do you find that comforting?

You are beyond it. Have fun being so righteous in your indignation of others.

It suits you.

 

[clarinetbcn]

What have you actually done , personally , to reduce your carbon footprint, and please don’t bang on about all the solar energy your solar panels, subsidised by the government etc, produce. What have you done personally?

Well you did ask…I’m always happy to answer polite questions.

 

[GrannyJen]

A little simplistic. Battersea was replaced by power stations outside London and 100's of miles of power cables strung across the countryside to serve London.

When was the last time Gas and Coal supplies were cut off due to storm damage?

I think those who have had no electricity for the past 8 days following Storm Arwen would have a few things to say about our dash for green electricity.

As most of the problem is supply of generated electricity rather than how it was generated I would think it doesn't really matter ......

 

[Velma's Dad]

As most of the problem is supply of generated electricity rather than how it was generated I would think it doesn't really matter ......

If we're talking about generation... it's all a Swedish teenager's fault apparently.

 

[GrannyJen]

A little simplistic. Battersea was replaced by power stations outside London and 100's of miles of power cables strung across the countryside to serve London.

When was the last time Gas and Coal supplies were cut off due to storm damage?

I think those who have had no electricity for the past 8 days following Storm Arwen would have a few things to say about our dash for green electricity.

Actually, no.

From the introduction of the 1956 clean air act to 1980 the reduction in coal consumption, accounting for the majority of "dark smoke emissions" declined by around 60%. As I also said earlier, nothing to do with getting power to the people, however it is generated, so your last paragraph is also meaningless.

 

[WelshGas]

Actually, no.

From the introduction of the 1956 clean air act to 1980 the reduction in coal consumption, accounting for the majority of "dark smoke emissions" declined by around 60%. As I also said earlier, nothing to do with getting power to the people, however it is generated, so your last paragraph is also meaningless.

You obviously don’t get it, I’m afraid.
I’m not concerned how the electricity is generated, whether it be by solar, wind, nuclear or whatever, maybe hot air , the fact of the matter is by going ALL electric which was the main thrust of COP26 then the resilience of the Power Distribution Network becomes very, very important. Storms are supposed to become more frequent and more severe.
One storm, last week, and power has not been restored to everyone after 8 days.
Those who had heating systems that did not depend on electricity had some heating ability, others did not.
Maybe people will take notice if a similarly devastating storm hits the Midlands, London or the South East and large numbers of consumers have no electricity for a week or more.
In the future we are promised electric boilers, heat pumps and electric vehicles powered by electricity from nuclear, solar and wind. All completely useless if the Distribution grid is severely damaged. How are the electrically powered emergency vehicles going to get around if they cannot be charged. How are hospitals going to cope without diesel generators etc.
The Law of Unintended Consequences raises its head. Put all your eggs in one basket - an electrically powered economy/world - and Power Distribution assumes massive importance.

 

[WelshGas]

Actually, no.

From the introduction of the 1956 clean air act to 1980 the reduction in coal consumption, accounting for the majority of "dark smoke emissions" declined by around 60%. As I also said earlier, nothing to do with getting power to the people, however it is generated, so your last paragraph is also meaningless.

Sorry I disagree. You are confusing Climate Change and Enviromental Damage, as many do.
The Coal Laws of the 50’s were designed to deal with smoke particles producing an environmentally damaging smog. Nothing to do with the Climate Changing properties of excessive production of CO2 and other climate warming gases.
Diesel vehicles are less damaging to the Climate than Petrol vehicles, but more damaging to the Enviroment due to NO and particular emmisions.

 

[Amarillo]

Quit rightly. As they pose with their mobile phones and listen to their streaming services over the mobile network, play their computer games and chatting on social media.
All they do is complain but do they actually do anything, do they actually have any “ Ideas” to put forward.

Reading this rant reminded me of much earlier rant:

====

The children now love luxury; they have bad manners, contempt for authority; they show disrespect for elders and love chatter in place of exercise. Children are now tyrants, not the servants of their households. They no longer rise when elders enter the room. They contradict their parents, chatter before company, gobble up dainties at the table, cross their legs, and tyrannize their teachers.

====

Socrates c. 470-399 BC

I wonder if you are related?

 

[WelshGas]

Reading this rant reminded me of much earlier rant:

====

The children now love luxury; they have bad manners, contempt for authority; they show disrespect for elders and love chatter in place of exercise. Children are now tyrants, not the servants of their households. They no longer rise when elders enter the room. They contradict their parents, chatter before company, gobble up dainties at the table, cross their legs, and tyrannize their teachers.

====

Socrates c. 470-399 BC

I wonder if you are related?

You could be right. I'll have to look into it.

I would work on the premise " Don't complain about a problem unless you have a sensible suggestion on how to rectify it ". They don't. They just have that immortalised comment " Blah, Blah, Blah ". Somehow that doesn't seem like a sensible suggestion.

 

[Amarillo]

You could be right. I'll have to look into it.

I would work on the premise " Don't complain about a problem unless you have a sensible suggestion on how to rectify it ". They don't. They just have that immortalised comment " Blah, Blah, Blah ". Somehow that doesn't seem like a sensible suggestion.

I think the solutions for decarbonisation of economies is clear. It is the rate of change which frustrates many. All talk and little action.

Groups like Insulate Britain focus on one very specific solution.

 

[WelshGas]

I think the solutions for decarbonisation of economies is clear. It is the rate of change which frustrates many. All talk and little action.

Groups like Insulate Britain focus on one very specific solution.

And are extremely hypocritical. Do what I say not what I do.
Governments, in the majority, represent the people and so carry out the wishes of the people , or have I got that wrong?

 

[Bellcrew]

And are extremely hypocritical. Do what I say not what I do.
Governments, in the majority, represent the people and so carry out the wishes of the people , or have I got that wrong?

That is why governments are setting up committees and supra-national bodies to make these decisions, "nothing to do with us" will be the mantra.
All the parties will agree on number of similar policies that they will promise they will not diverge from.
All media will be on the same page with zero scepticism or contrary arguments allowed.
Almost certainly a Populist party will rise from these machinations, it won't be pretty.

 

[WelshGas]

" Turkeys don't vote for Christmas ", so the saying goes. No Government will vote for a decrease in living standards to combat Climate Change until they have the backing of the general population, not if they want to stay in power.