6.1 2 day hire - initially disappointed, but now ordered!

[TripleBee]

Full spec below as requested.

Base vehicle from new
LWB, T30, DSG 150 engine TDI Highline Panel van
Acapulco Blue
All weather tyres - 215-65-R16 C 106-104T
Front and rear parking sensors.
Heated rear window with wiper and wash
Swivel seat for driver and passenger with armrest and lumber support
Wing mirrors - Heater - power adjustable and power folding
Heated front windscreen
Single passenger seat
Without bulkhead
Declined the Discovery Media - later added Pioneer AVIC - Z820DAC-C. Camper version to avoid low bridges etc. Cheaper and better than VW option. LED lights added later at lower cost than VW option.

Conversion Spec.
View attachment 65157
Van as received on complete conversion.

High top. No messing with roof up roof down no problems with hydraulics - there are none. Height barriers only been an issue once. Top fully insulated, warm winter camping with high roof.
2x Leather captin seats, fully adjustable (including lumbar) in cream and blue leather.
Twin hob, oven, 50l refrigerator.
Built in Thetford cassette toilet with modesty screen.
Hot water, heated via electric on hook up or gas when off grid. This has been one of the best options!!
Shower point - this is at the rear of the van, also hooked up to hot water. One has to shower outside with the tail gate open - great for off grid with no one about. Can shower in swim suit if public or can construct curtain from sheets and strong fridge magnets.
BBQ point.
Full blackout curtains.
Opening windows for both passengers.
Opening roof vent.
Twin individual beds, rear seats fold down to form bed in combination with front seats. The individual beds can be slid together to form a double.
Internal LED lighting, dimmable. Reading lights by each rear seat.
More USB ports than one can ever want ~10 !
Two double 13 amp sockets.
2x 12V sockets
Full in cabin WiFi with aerial so can pick up long distance signals. The longest was from 12 miles away - across water and in line of sight.
Central heating from gas, not a diesel heater.
LPG gas tank underslung, no CampinGaz issues. Refill tank from any LPG station.The gas tank can contain about 12 kilos of gas so even with heavy use it lasts well. Sensor tells you when to refill. Expensive option but very useful.
120Ah leisure battery.
150W solar panel
Side awning.
Full washable carpets.
No holes in the side of the vehicle. Hookup plug under rear bumper, water refill at rear of vehicle.
Reversing camera.
View attachment 65158
Rear view. Toilet on right. water filler, water level, gas on/off and water heater control and shower point.can just see LPG filler point (red spot under bumper). Hook up connection under bumper on left side.
We wanted a bright clean interior. At first the converters were not keen, when they saw the finished product there were impressed.
View attachment 65159,
View down cabin, fridge in cupboard on right. Cabin electrics in cupboard under fridge - full fuse plan.
View attachment 65160
View towards the back. Full black out curtains. Hob and oven, emergency exit button on tailgate. Part of cabin control panel, next to that is the gas central heating control panel. Can also heat electrically on hook up. The two little cupboards underneath the oven are where the gas bottles would normally be. These are empty as the fixed gas cylinder is underneath the van just behind the spare wheel. A master switch isolates the gas supply so ferries and the Channel tunnel are not a problem.
View attachment 65162
Rear seating. Front seats match. Seats fully crash tested and approved. Can now see central heating control. Have been out when the outside temperature is -5C, inside toasty warm. No need to have "roof down" to stay warm. High roof means one can move about without any issues and layout allows one to move the full length of the van.
View attachment 65163
View attachment 65164
Rear seats converted to bed.
View attachment 65165
Cooking and hot water. You will notice all the cupboard space, we have yet to fill it all, only 2 of us.
Not visible, have added extra door and cabin sound proofing. Fire extinguisher and fire blanket, smoke and CO detector. Magnetic fly screens for windows.
Conversion was done by Autohaus in Minehead. No issues with DVLA vehicle tax, all sorted by the converter. If you want to look we are in Gloucestershire.
I hope you start to get the idea. It is not a California but it is exactly what we requested and we love it. Don't know about resale value but on our second trip out I was asked if I would sell it at cost + £1500. Declined.

Not my cup of tea.
The versatility of the boot is gone. The van is over 2 meters high. Unuseable as daily driver.

This shows the VW California is not for everyone.
Or you like it (like most of us), or you don't like it.
No one forces anyone to buy a California. We can only give our own impressions about it.

 

[Wildcamper]

Not my cup of tea.
The versatility of the boot is gone. The van is over 2 meters high. Unuseable as daily driver.

This shows the VW California is not for everyone.
Or you like it (like most of us), or you don't like it.
No one forces anyone to buy a California. We can only give our own impressions about it.

Correct, it will not please 100% of folk. My wife and I liked the Cali but it fell short, in our opinion, in a number of areas which at £60+k in 2018 was too much to spend on a just ok compromise. There are still compromises in this vehicle but we are happy with them. Never found the height a driving issue, just one barrier 18 months ago. All part of the compromise.

 

[rod_vw]

@Wildcamper I like it, both you and I are interlopers here but it would seem are of like mind.

My T6 is not as elaborate as your but was built to provide a service for us and that it has done. Anyone interested in my recent builds can see what I did seven years back here, that one is sold but T6 is similar but has a Reimo high roof.

@PhilR, as Wildcamper has said if you wish to look at our current T6 you are most welcome, we are in Telford, Shropshire.

 

[GSX1300R]

We all have that right to spend our own money the way we want....That’s why things have moved on from “ Any colour as long as it’s Black”.

 

[wilburthewombat]

I don't expect my Cali to be the same quality as a Japanese car. It's a VW, and VW are just 'average' for build quality and reliability. I am buying my Cali with eyes wide open. A major factor for me is that wherever I go in Europe or further abroad there will be a VW commercial garage somewhere (relatively) nearby. I looked at Bilbo's conversions amongst others and though the quality is fine, maybe better than VW because they actually care about their customers, getting a non-base-VW part would be quite entertaining in Turkey, for example.

 

[Scrumpypops]

Great thread thanks Philr and others, I'm looking at full time van living and will be looking closely at the MP, ocean & coast but I'm going to take my time. Possibly we'll into 2021 so I can check out as many of the above and conversions from the best rated companies, plus the NEC & any meets that may happen.
Everyone has the right to spend their money as they see fit, interesting to see other cars are BMWs, Q7, lotus etc, mines a Peugeot!! So a Vw or other, will seem like a roller!
The thing that amazes me is how many don't even boil a kettle in theirs, let alone a bacon sarnie. Maybe their the ones who advertise a reluctant sale after a year of ownership, some folk seem to get carried away with the buzz of owning one but in reality, it's not for them. Personally I'm slumming it in the car with all my gear and if winter hits me, I'll have a few nights every so often in a Premier Inn etc. I know this isn't for most but I've always been a bit of live off the land / sea, so to me it's an adventure.
Each to their own but cracking reading
Thanks all
Lee

 

[PhilR]

Full spec below as requested.

Base vehicle from new
LWB, T30, DSG 150 engine TDI Highline Panel van
Acapulco Blue
All weather tyres - 215-65-R16 C 106-104T
Front and rear parking sensors.
Heated rear window with wiper and wash
Swivel seat for driver and passenger with armrest and lumber support
Wing mirrors - Heater - power adjustable and power folding
Heated front windscreen
Single passenger seat
Without bulkhead
Declined the Discovery Media - later added Pioneer AVIC - Z820DAC-C. Camper version to avoid low bridges etc. Cheaper and better than VW option. LED lights added later at lower cost than VW option.

Conversion Spec.
View attachment 65157
Van as received on complete conversion.

High top. No messing with roof up roof down no problems with hydraulics - there are none. Height barriers only been an issue once. Top fully insulated, warm winter camping with high roof.
2x Leather captin seats, fully adjustable (including lumbar) in cream and blue leather.
Twin hob, oven, 50l refrigerator.
Built in Thetford cassette toilet with modesty screen.
Hot water, heated via electric on hook up or gas when off grid. This has been one of the best options!!
Shower point - this is at the rear of the van, also hooked up to hot water. One has to shower outside with the tail gate open - great for off grid with no one about. Can shower in swim suit if public or can construct curtain from sheets and strong fridge magnets.
BBQ point.
Full blackout curtains.
Opening windows for both passengers.
Opening roof vent.
Twin individual beds, rear seats fold down to form bed in combination with front seats. The individual beds can be slid together to form a double.
Internal LED lighting, dimmable. Reading lights by each rear seat.
More USB ports than one can ever want ~10 !
Two double 13 amp sockets.
2x 12V sockets
Full in cabin WiFi with aerial so can pick up long distance signals. The longest was from 12 miles away - across water and in line of sight.
Central heating from gas, not a diesel heater.
LPG gas tank underslung, no CampinGaz issues. Refill tank from any LPG station.The gas tank can contain about 12 kilos of gas so even with heavy use it lasts well. Sensor tells you when to refill. Expensive option but very useful.
120Ah leisure battery.
150W solar panel
Side awning.
Full washable carpets.
No holes in the side of the vehicle. Hookup plug under rear bumper, water refill at rear of vehicle.
Reversing camera.
View attachment 65158
Rear view. Toilet on right. water filler, water level, gas on/off and water heater control and shower point.can just see LPG filler point (red spot under bumper). Hook up connection under bumper on left side.
We wanted a bright clean interior. At first the converters were not keen, when they saw the finished product there were impressed.
View attachment 65159,
View down cabin, fridge in cupboard on right. Cabin electrics in cupboard under fridge - full fuse plan.
View attachment 65160
View towards the back. Full black out curtains. Hob and oven, emergency exit button on tailgate. Part of cabin control panel, next to that is the gas central heating control panel. Can also heat electrically on hook up. The two little cupboards underneath the oven are where the gas bottles would normally be. These are empty as the fixed gas cylinder is underneath the van just behind the spare wheel. A master switch isolates the gas supply so ferries and the Channel tunnel are not a problem.
View attachment 65162
Rear seating. Front seats match. Seats fully crash tested and approved. Can now see central heating control. Have been out when the outside temperature is -5C, inside toasty warm. No need to have "roof down" to stay warm. High roof means one can move about without any issues and layout allows one to move the full length of the van.
View attachment 65163
View attachment 65164
Rear seats converted to bed.
View attachment 65165
Cooking and hot water. You will notice all the cupboard space, we have yet to fill it all, only 2 of us.
Not visible, have added extra door and cabin sound proofing. Fire extinguisher and fire blanket, smoke and CO detector. Magnetic fly screens for windows.
Conversion was done by Autohaus in Minehead. No issues with DVLA vehicle tax, all sorted by the converter. If you want to look we are in Gloucestershire.
I hope you start to get the idea. It is not a California but it is exactly what we requested and we love it. Don't know about resale value but on our second trip out I was asked if I would sell it at cost + £1500. Declined.

Wow, that is impressive, cheers for posting!

 

[PhilR]

@PhilR, as Wildcamper has said if you wish to look at our current T6 you are most welcome, we are in Telford, Shropshire.

Thanks. I may take you up on that kind offer sometime, I pass Telford regularly going to Wales.

 

[PhilR]

You can order a new Coast for around £50K at current discount levels, could that work? Certainly much better value than used stuff at the moment. There’s a big difference between £50K and £70K (40% more expensive!).

Spent all evening looking at all the options....again, but this keeps catching my attention. As you say, with around 10% discount, even after adding a few extras it comes out at around £52k, which puts it in a very strong position compared to used Calis or conversions. I would have to look at making a few changes but wouldn't feel so bad having to do that at that price - I'd keep the 16" wheels for a start, that may solve the crashing over rough surfaces, or at least improve it. The seat is more tricky, but I'd think of something (I'd still want decent seat covers due to the light fabric, so maybe I could modify them with a bit of padding at the front). Anyway, if it means it's an option vs not getting a campervan at all, I'll go with it! I know if I don't come up with a decent option my wife is going to want to pull the plug on the whole thing, and I don't want that!
Added bonus is the manual roof, for long term reliability. Just need to figure out what are essential options on the Coast....Heater, heated seats, panoramic window in roof, digital cockpit, parking sensors, rear view camera, privacy glass, metallic paint???
Negatives are long lead time, although that doesn't really affect us, and the uncertainty regarding the possible import tax - that does bother us....
But, to me this seems a really good option. I now know the Cali a lot better including it's faults, but I can live with those at this price point.....or am I just trying to convince myself too much . Told you I was confused....

 

[Stuart]

It’s not often mentioned but there is one quite large difference between a California and a conversion. The Cali is based on the Caravelle which is quite a sophisticated vehicle with independent suspension. I think conversions will based on a Transporter van with van suspension. If you’re not happy with the quality or ride in a Cali I can’t see you being happy in a conversion.

I think it's not mentioned much because it's not true Cali / Caravelle suspension is no more sophisticated than that on a Transporter van. You can spec DCC (Dynamic Chassis Control) but it doesn't come as standard, and only adds adjustable shock absorbers.

 

[PhilR]

I think it's not mentioned much because it's not true Cali / Caravelle suspension is no more sophisticated than that on a Transporter van. You can spec DCC (Dynamic Chassis Control) but it doesn't come as standard, and only adds adjustable shock absorbers.

Interesting, thanks. I looked for the DCC option on the confuserator but I think that's been dropped for MY21 along with the "S" mode on the DSG.

 

[PhilR]

So my wife is asleep and I'm still on here. I need a "latest plan" for the morning. I'm trying to convince myself that a new Coast will be a great option. It certainly looks decent even after all I've said on here. I just need a strong case to convince her! So if we pay around £52k for a new Coast, to be delivered early next year or Spring time, roughly what would it be worth 12 or 24 months down the line? I'm guessing we'd do a max of 10,000 miles per year. I'm only trying to have a rough idea so I can say to her that it's a no, or low risk option if we ended up not loving it.
If I can't get her onboard with this, the most likely outcome will be replacing the company car, which goes back in April with another estate car, probably a 3 Series or Audi A4, nearly new for around £30-35k. The company car scheme is being pulled from her company so we need to buy something, and with 2 dogs and regular trips back and forth to Wales we need at least an estate.

 

[rod_vw]

I think it's not mentioned much because it's not true Cali / Caravelle suspension is no more sophisticated than that on a Transporter van. You can spec DCC (Dynamic Chassis Control) but it doesn't come as standard, and only adds adjustable shock absorbers.

Absolutely, all VW T5s & T6s have totally independent suspension (as have all VW vans since inception in 1950) regardless of whether they were intended to be a builders van or a top line Caravelle the only differences are variations of anti-roll bars, springs and shock absorbers.

DCC comes at a cost as above.

 

[AlisonF]

So my wife is asleep and I'm still on here. I need a "latest plan" for the morning. I'm trying to convince myself that a new Coast will be a great option. It certainly looks decent even after all I've said on here. I just need a strong case to convince her! So if we pay around £52k for a new Coast, to be delivered early next year or Spring time, roughly what would it be worth 12 or 24 months down the line? I'm guessing we'd do a max of 10,000 miles per year. I'm only trying to have a rough idea so I can say to her that it's a no, or low risk option if we ended up not loving it.
If I can't get her onboard with this, the most likely outcome will be replacing the company car, which goes back in April with another estate car, probably a 3 Series or Audi A4, nearly new for around £30-35k. The company car scheme is being pulled from her company so we need to buy something, and with 2 dogs and regular trips back and forth to Wales we need at least an estate.

Pause, breathe.
No need to rush.
Weigh up the Coast vs Ocean vs other options for a day or two, or even a month or two.
I appreciate there is some urgency to order. But a good dealer will also offer you a loan vehicle if yours doesn’t arrive in time...

 

[rod_vw]

Don't forget the pending price rise of new vehicles from Europe when we exit the EU completely. Somewhere between 10% & 15% as far as I can ascertain!
And who knows what the situation will be re Covid-19 in 2021 and how it will be affecting prices and resale values etc.
We are in the same dilemma, do we keep the T6, do we convert a new T6.1, do we convert a Crafter or do we buy a ready converted of either model?
SWB T6.1 is a definite NO as it doesn't have enough space, elevating roof is also a NO, been there and don't like them.

 

[Scrumpypops]

Buy a coast, keep for a year then sell to me.

 

[Wogga]

So my wife is asleep and I'm still on here. I need a "latest plan" for the morning. I'm trying to convince myself that a new Coast will be a great option. It certainly looks decent even after all I've said on here. I just need a strong case to convince her! So if we pay around £52k for a new Coast, to be delivered early next year or Spring time, roughly what would it be worth 12 or 24 months down the line? I'm guessing we'd do a max of 10,000 miles per year. I'm only trying to have a rough idea so I can say to her that it's a no, or low risk option if we ended up not loving it.
If I can't get her onboard with this, the most likely outcome will be replacing the company car, which goes back in April with another estate car, probably a 3 Series or Audi A4, nearly new for around £30-35k. The company car scheme is being pulled from her company so we need to buy something, and with 2 dogs and regular trips back and forth to Wales we need at least an estate.

Total quote Phil I got for the Coast with some expensive options added, £54,954, the parking heater is standard in the Coast.

Paint - Metallic - Starlight Blue : Starlight Blue - GBP 762.00
Upholstery - Cloth - Titanium Black - GBP 0.00
Climatronic 3-Zone A-C with 2nd Evaporator - Auxiliary Heater - Air Conditioned Headliner and Additional Passenger Control - GBP 990.00
Digital Cockpit and Driver Alert System - GBP 468.00
Navigation System Discover Media including Streaming and Internet - GBP 1338.00
Park Assist and Park Distance Control in Front and Rear and Sensor-Based Side Protection - GBP 342.00
Rear View Camera System - Static Lines - GBP 294.00
Bellow Colour of Pop-Up Roof - Basalt Grey - GBP 270.00
Power Sliding Door on the Right in Load-Passenger Compartment - GBP 378.00
Interior Lighting System Camper with Lighting in Pop-up Roof - Tailgate and in Kitchen Cupboards - GBP 726.00

As a side note Phil I idley priced up a Kombi Transporter, adding all the options you get as standard on the Ocean, got to£51k without the kitchen, pop up roof, beds, chairs in the tailgate etc
As another note, I was on a fairly generous company car allowance for years so got into the habit of PCP. Currently paying £336 pm for a Merc, for an extra £160 pm I am flitting to an Ocean and I am retiring.
 

 

[kave]

If you think the California is poorly built try any normal camper and you will change opinion. A normal camper rattles and makes so much noise it drives med crazy.
To me the seats are the best I have tried among Range Rovers.
The California is not for everyone. Look at a VW Transporter or Caravelle and they are similarly priced euiped the same. Obviously a normal camper is more stuff for the money, but you surely must have known that before?

 

[Sunstoner]

Hey Phil

You definitely lucked out with your hire vehicle. We bought our high spec'd T6 Cali off the back of hiring 2 conversions and then 2 Cali's.

The Cali's were a cut above the conversions we had and felt a much higher quality with better fit and finish, which ultimately helped with our decision. We certainly didn't experience loose fittings or anything coming away inside the cabin and everything worked just fine.

In fact the last Cali we hired, we hired for a month last year. It had been hired out only twice before us and we hired it with only 1200 miles on the clock. It was a high spec 4motion 199 Cali registered in June last year with part leather and alacantara interior which seemed to up the feeling of comfort in the cabin. We were so impressed that we bought it off the hire company after hiring it again longer term and haven't regretted it one bit.

I was quite alarmed at hearing your experience with a new T6.1.As plenty have mentioned above there must have been something not right with that particular vehicle.

The T6.1 Cali with its various tweaks ought to be at least on a par with a T6 for quality if not an improvement you would think. So it's baffling and disappointing to me to hear this.

If it's still an itch (a big one at that!) I'd whole heartedly recommend visiting one of the countless caravan and motorhome shows when next they're on. We did and again, it helped us no end. I know you could be waiting a while but it might be a good thing to take some more time to consider your options.

Despite your disappointment, keeping looking and keep us informed. Good luck!

 

[Borris]

"The dash is not great on the 6.1, that is certain. It looks flash but practicality isn't it's forte. Is the T6 dash much better then? You mentioned two different T6 dashboards - what is the difference? Is the glovebox bigger in the T6 too?"

Hello Phil,
There are two versions of the T6 dash:

The Comfort dash

And the standard "uncomfortable" dash:

This latter version was only available as standard on the UK Beach.

Both versions have asthetically pleasing symmetrical designs that offer both style and a high level of practicality. By contrast the T6-1 dash is a complete dogs breakfast.

 

[thehorse]

I agree with your points Phil.

Did you get ACC on you hire van? It makes a lot of difference to the seat comfort as you don’t need your feet on the pedals so it is much easier to get comfortable with the limited legroom. Also the point on the 215 tyres is correct, we tested one with 215’s which run at high pressure and they felt harsh so ordered 235 all season tyres on our 150.

We bought new but if I had my time again I’d be tempted to by a much older van. Reason being I found myself worrying/stressing about it too much, where I park it, kids spilling stuff on the seats etc. Also slightly shonky build, crude ride Etc., might be annoying if you are spending 70k, but actually becomes part of the charm of an older vehicle.

 

[Rowls1958]

Am I the only one that thinks the seats are brilliant? Did 14 hours in the drivers seat two weeks ago & could easily have sat there for another couple. In contrast I could never get fully comfortable in my Discoveries with however many way electric adjustments & ditto the last 911 I had, also with multiple buttons & features both had me aching after a couple of hours.

If you think the drive of a California is bad, I hope you are not expecting much when you try a full size motorhome.

Agree, I find the drivers seat superb on my T6.1 Ocean, drove 7 hours to Switzerland last week and could have kept on going.....

 

[Mr T]

The harsh ride can be easily improved by replacing the standard shocks and springs, going down the comfort route this would cost around £800 fitted.
It makes a big difference.

 

[Elmo3]

I agree with your points Phil.

Did you get ACC on you hire van? It makes a lot of difference to the seat comfort as you don’t need your feet on the pedals so it is much easier to get comfortable with the limited legroom. Also the point on the 215 tyres is correct, we tested one with 215’s which run at high pressure and they felt harsh so ordered 235 all season tyres on our 150.

We bought new but if I had my time again I’d be tempted to by a much older van. Reason being I found myself worrying/stressing about it too much, where I park it, kids spilling stuff on the seats etc. Also slightly shonky build, crude ride Etc., might be annoying if you are spending 70k, but actually becomes part of the charm of an older vehicle.

You are absolutely right about the tyres. We’ve had 2 Oceans. He first had 215’s and the second had 235’s, both on Davenports. The ride quality on the 235’s is so superior you wouldn’t think it was the same vehicle. If PhilR is considering a Coast with 16’s, it should be even better!

Totally agree about an older van. We accidentally stumbled across our 2009 Beach. Needs a little TLC but both enjoying tinkering to make ‘Elmo3’ our own. I was always paranoid about using / parking / leaving / muddy dog etc in the new Calis. We’re using Elmo3 more than the previous vans!

PhilR could get a Cali like ours and a lovely Merc or similar for mile munching and still have change from £25K!

 

[Azteccamper]

You are absolutely right about the tyres. We’ve had 2 Oceans. He first had 215’s and the second had 235’s, both on Davenports. The ride quality on the 235’s is so superior you wouldn’t think it was the same vehicle. If PhilR is considering a Coast with 16’s, it should be even better!

Totally agree about an older van. We accidentally stumbled across our 2009 Beach. Needs a little TLC but both enjoying tinkering to make ‘Elmo3’ our own. I was always paranoid about using / parking / leaving / muddy dog etc in the new Calis. We’re using Elmo3 more than the previous vans!

PhilR could get a Cali like ours and a lovely Merc or similar for mile munching and still have change from £25K!

Spot on Elmo3. I bought a 4yr old Cali (from this site) 4yrs ago - so I’ve got an 8yr old Cali that is serves us brilliantly and I know it inside out and we love it. The habitation part of the van has changed little over the years. Only issue is I’m not sure if there are many 2nd hand bargains out there at present - bonkers prices.