Alcohol and camping....

[Farley]

So, i’d Just like to point out I’m not an alcoholic but, like many here I guess, I like the thought of a glass of vino whilst watching the sun going down so, if I do not have the key in the ignition and the front seats are swivelled to face the rear, can you still be nicked for being drunk in charge?
I know all the stuff about alcohol and the next morning and alcohol is bad for you blah blah but, can you be nicked or, does it make a difference (and I guess it does) where you park?
Any thoughts?
Farl

 

[DavidofHook]

So, i’d Just like to point out I’m not an alcoholic but, like many here I guess, I like the thought of a glass of vino whilst watching the sun going down so, if I do not have the key in the ignition and the front seats are swivelled to face the rear, can you still be nicked for being drunk in charge?
I know all the stuff about alcohol and the next morning and alcohol is bad for you blah blah but, can you be nicked or, does it make a difference (and I guess it does) where you park?
Any thoughts?
Farl

Probably not on a campsite is my first thought.

 

[flying banana]

roadside yes, only if your over the limit though. campsite or private carparks no, as not public highways

 

[Velma's Dad]

This has been discussed before at some length on the forum. As far as I recall...

The offence is being drunk in charge of a motor vehicle( Road Traffic Act 1988 Section 5). So if a court decides you are 'in charge' you might in theory be convicted. But it's a defence if you can show that you weren't intending to drive (turning the seats round would presumably be an important part of such a defence). The onus is on you, as a defendant, to demonstrate that in court, the prosecution doesn't have to prove that you intended to drive.

You need to be careful about what is private versus public land. It's been established in case law that, for example, a pub car park is a public place.. Really, it's a place 'to which the public has access'.

In practice, whatever the letter of the law, no-one on this forum (so far) has pointed to an actual case where someone bedding down for the night in a camper has even been charged, let alone convicted.

 

[SusiBus]

We have quite a few forum experts on drinking wine in their California's, who no doubt will come to your rescue with their views, but if you search this subject it has been covered comprehensively in the past.

I myself only drink beer, not wine, so my situation is totaly different. Although I realise that there are some inherent risks, I have convinced myself that if the vehicle looks parked up for the night, i.e. the roofs up, seats swivelled around, a few things scattered around to make it look like eating is about to, or has taken place, I think it would be quite a mean PC who would take the situation further.
A must is to take the keys out of the ignition
If confronted, grovel, grovel, grovel, it always goes a long way with plod.
This is only a view.

 

[Ocean Spirit]

This had crossed my mind as well, and I assumed pretty much the answers above, along with a tinge of discretion from plod.
It ought to be reasonably clear if the driver has any intentions to get back behind the wheel or if they are settled down treating it as their lounge. In the latter case, whats the difference if the alcohol being consumed in your home with the car on the drive but keys in your pocket?
Now I know a law is a law, but I pray for some common sense.

 

[Farley]

I guess the odd beer or vino is commonplace. No one here convicted... I think a sensible approach i.e. the roof up is a grand hint you are not about to drive off. Thanks!
Farl

 

[GrannyJen]

Yes, it has been discussed, and it comes on every forum ad nauseous.

I repeat the advice I received from one of the country's leading motoring lawyers.

If you are on what can be deemed as a public highway, or a space to which the public have free access (such as a pub carpark) then yes you can be done.

The offense of drinking whilst in charge is a statutory offence, i.e. guilty, incumbent on you proving yourself innocent.

As long as you have the keys to the vehicle or they are in your charge, are in the vehicle and over the limit then you can be done.

However both the police and CPS are aware of the "spirit" of the offence, which is to prevent someone getting around a drink-driving charge by pretending to be "sleeping it off".

In applying the spirit the police initially and following that the CPS will look at the circumstances.

Are you stopping by pre-arranged invite? (Britstop for example).

Have you just recently stopped? (Engine warm, no witnesses to you parking up hours ago, etc)....

Is the vehicle capable of being just started up and driven off? (Seats turned round, bed made up etc all suggest no)....

Are you so inebriated that you are likely to still be over the limit at a reasonable time tomorrow morning?

It is up to the individual to consider their vulnerability and act accordingly. There is no golden answer.

From my position if I have turned up, made arrangements with the pub licensee / farmer / cafe owner / etc to stop overnight, have made my bed, have put the keys out of reach but in a safe place, then I feel quite safe to have a drink responsibly, not so inebriated that I cannot hold a reasonable conversation with a police officer, then I would feel quite confident having my day in court should the need arise.

Should I be wild camping, on a public highway or on private land when I could be asked to move on, don't drink.

 

[Meoncoast]

I think you have think if not on a "campsite" parked up in a layby for the night and have a few drinks what happens if a local yobs turn up and have a mini rave in the layby who would get nicked if you need to move on.

 

[Borris]

So, i’d Just like to point out I’m not an alcoholic but, like many here I guess, I like the thought of a glass of vino whilst watching the sun going down so, if I do not have the key in the ignition and the front seats are swivelled to face the rear, can you still be nicked for being drunk in charge?
I know all the stuff about alcohol and the next morning and alcohol is bad for you blah blah but, can you be nicked or, does it make a difference (and I guess it does) where you park?
Any thoughts?
Farl

If you've drunk enough that your eyes "are swivelled to face the rear" you'll definately have your collar felt.

 

[Farley]

If you've drunk enough that your eyes "are swivelled to face the rear" you'll definately have your collar felt.

Yep! Ha!



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[Amarillo]

Slightly off topic, but if you are driving outside the UK you need to know the local limits. England, Wales, N. Ireland and Malta have the highest blood-alcohol tolerances in the EU plus Norway and Switzerland at 0.8 g/L; most countries are 0.5 and a few, including here in Romania, zero. No drink for me the evening before a day when I'll be driving!

https://etsc.eu/blood-alcohol-content-bac-drink-driving-limits-across-europe/


Follow my blog: www.au-revoir.eu

 

[Farley]

Slightly off topic, but if you are driving outside the UK you need to know the local limits. England, Wales, N. Ireland and Malta have the highest blood-alcohol tolerances in the EU plus Norway and Switzerland at 0.8 g/L; most countries are 0.5 and a few, including here in Romania, zero. No drink for me the evening before a day when I'll be driving!

https://etsc.eu/blood-alcohol-content-bac-drink-driving-limits-across-europe/


Follow my blog: www.au-revoir.eu

Good point well made. UK only for me at present but who knows what the future has in store!
Farl


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[Farley]

Yes, it has been discussed, and it comes on every forum ad nauseous.

I repeat the advice I received from one of the country's leading motoring lawyers.

If you are on what can be deemed as a public highway, or a space to which the public have free access (such as a pub carpark) then yes you can be done.

The offense of drinking whilst in charge is a statutory offence, i.e. guilty, incumbent on you proving yourself innocent.

As long as you have the keys to the vehicle or they are in your charge, are in the vehicle and over the limit then you can be done.

However both the police and CPS are aware of the "spirit" of the offence, which is to prevent someone getting around a drink-driving charge by pretending to be "sleeping it off".

In applying the spirit the police initially and following that the CPS will look at the circumstances.

Are you stopping by pre-arranged invite? (Britstop for example).

Have you just recently stopped? (Engine warm, no witnesses to you parking up hours ago, etc)....

Is the vehicle capable of being just started up and driven off? (Seats turned round, bed made up etc all suggest no)....

Are you so inebriated that you are likely to still be over the limit at a reasonable time tomorrow morning?

It is up to the individual to consider their vulnerability and act accordingly. There is no golden answer.

From my position if I have turned up, made arrangements with the pub licensee / farmer / cafe owner / etc to stop overnight, have made my bed, have put the keys out of reach but in a safe place, then I feel quite safe to have a drink responsibly, not so inebriated that I cannot hold a reasonable conversation with a police officer, then I would feel quite confident having my day in court should the need arise.

Should I be wild camping, on a public highway or on private land when I could be asked to move on, don't drink.

Ad nauseous? (Or ad nauseam....)
Oh dear, so often you are bored of it?
Well... apologies I am new to your forum and, rather than trawl through pages I thought I would ask. Thought that is what forums are for?
Long reply though, very helpful...
Farl


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[motacyclist]

When you get to my age you can talk about the same things for the first time every day!

 

[GrannyJen]

Ad nauseous? (Or ad nauseam....)
Oh dear, so often you are bored of it?
Well... apologies I am new to your forum and, rather than trawl through pages I thought I would ask. Thought that is what forums are for?
Long reply though, very helpful...
Carl


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no, definitely not bored, my apologies if it came over as such and my remarks were in no way intended to be derogatory towards yourself or any member.

It is a perennial though, like many others such as "gassing", often arising due to someone mentioning "a friend of a friend" .... or "what happened to a friend" ...., hence my "ad nauseam" comment and hence my long reply to explain the situation as I know it. I would rather give someone a proper answer than just reference other threads and allow the rumours and unsubstantiated anecdotes fly.

It is also a minefield as there is no golden answer of what you can definitely do or not do. I can only cite my own experiences and advice that I have been given by a very experienced lawyer specialising in motoring law.

In giving any advice I would also repeat what Andy (Meoncoast) mentioned: always evaluate and take into consideration the possibility of needing to move on: a serious consideration when wild camping. As repeated elsewhere, for myself I impose a no-alcohol rule in those circumstances.

Again my apologies if my comments offended.

 

[Farley]

no, definitely not bored, my apologies if it came over as such and my remarks were in no way intended to be derogatory towards yourself or any member.

It is a perennial though, like many others such as "gassing", often arising due to someone mentioning "a friend of a friend" .... or "what happened to a friend" ...., hence my "ad nauseam" comment and hence my long reply to explain the situation as I know it. I would rather give someone a proper answer than just reference other threads and allow the rumours and unsubstantiated anecdotes fly.

It is also a minefield as there is no golden answer of what you can definitely do or not do. I can only cite my own experiences and advice that I have been given by a very experienced lawyer specialising in motoring law.

In giving any advice I would also repeat what Andy (Meoncoast) mentioned: always evaluate and take into consideration the possibility of needing to move on: a serious consideration when wild camping. As repeated elsewhere, for myself I impose a no-alcohol rule in those circumstances.

Again my apologies if my comments offended.

Ah, OK, no offence taken.
Many thanks.
Farl


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[Digger]

no, definitely not bored, my apologies if it came over as such and my remarks were in no way intended to be derogatory towards yourself or any member.

It is a perennial though, like many others such as "gassing", often arising due to someone mentioning "a friend of a friend" .... or "what happened to a friend" ...., hence my "ad nauseam" comment and hence my long reply to explain the situation as I know it. I would rather give someone a proper answer than just reference other threads and allow the rumours and unsubstantiated anecdotes fly.

It is also a minefield as there is no golden answer of what you can definitely do or not do. I can only cite my own experiences and advice that I have been given by a very experienced lawyer specialising in motoring law.

In giving any advice I would also repeat what Andy (Meoncoast) mentioned: always evaluate and take into consideration the possibility of needing to move on: a serious consideration when wild camping. As repeated elsewhere, for myself I impose a no-alcohol rule in those circumstances.

Again my apologies if my comments offended.

There was no need to apologise!

 

[Farley]

There was no need to apologise!

Ha!

 

[Ciki62]

So, i’d Just like to point out I’m not an alcoholic but, like many here I guess, I like the thought of a glass of vino whilst watching the sun going down so, if I do not have the key in the ignition and the front seats are swivelled to face the rear, can you still be nicked for being drunk in charge?
I know all the stuff about alcohol and the next morning and alcohol is bad for you blah blah but, can you be nicked or, does it make a difference (and I guess it does) where you park?
Any thoughts?
Farl

Hi. My English is poor but ,don’t drink and drive’ is not same as drinking wine, beer... in car while not driving. Drinking in car, bus, California is not prohibited.



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[WelshGas]

Hi. My English is poor but ,don’t drink and drive’ is not same as drinking wine, beer... in car while not driving. Drinking in car, bus, California is not prohibited.



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Unfortunately in the U.K. it is the same if you are in possession of the vehicle keys on a public road/space, unless you can prove there is no intention of driving and unfortunately just saying you are not going to drive is not enough if the Authorities want to be awkward.

 

[flying banana]

so if you park your car outside your house in the road. then go to the pub. then walk home with your keys in your pocket like alot of people do as it has house key on too. then you can get arrested? for being drunk in charge? ridiculous . now can you ride a bike drunk? that's a question. well I will be riding mine soon and I've had a few

 

[Amarillo]

now can you ride a bike drunk? that's a question. well I will be riding mine soon and I've had a few

My greatest claim to fame is having twice been charged with drunk cycling, twice prosecuted for drunk cycling, and twice found innocent of drunk cycling.



Follow my blog: www.au-revoir.eu

 

[motacyclist]

Split personality?

I can just see those words on your epitaph!

 

[flying banana]

My greatest claim to fame is having twice been charged with drunk cycling, twice prosecuted for drunk cycling, and twice found innocent of drunk cycling.



Follow my blog: www.au-revoir.eu

how'd you get caught and did they threaten your license? bit unfair if they did as you don't need a license to ride a bike. get a tandem and let some one else steer it