Gas safety valve leaking!

[Shadrack]

Hi all,
I have just sorted out a refilled 907 bottle for the new ocean. Connected (for the first time) using the provided gold coloured safety valve. Tested out the cooker, all good. I was about to screw the lid onto the bottle container bin when I could hear the slightest sound of a hiss.. Even after turning the valve off under the burners. (So it was not caused by gas flowing to the rings)
With the help of a length of 1/4" inch tube, one end to my ear the other around the gas fittings and regulater I found the leak to come from the shaft of the gold coloured safety valve when it was open. Closed was no leak.
This has clearly a fault in the flange.
This will be a visit to a dealer to get it reported as I think these safety valves must be just put in the polly bag and chucked into the bin and are never gas tested on the vehicle during construction.

Possibly those who have posted a strong whiff etc from the bin area may have a similar issue.

 

[Shadrack]

 

[WelshGas]

Why should VW test them? They will have a contract with the Valve manufacturer with Conditions attached to supply a 100% perfect valve. VW will change it and return to Manufacturer. VW can be blamed for many things but ultimately items manufactured by 3d parties have to be the responsibility of that company supplying them.

 

[Shadrack]

Hi Welshgas,
A good point, but I was not wishing to get into the politics of who should or should not test. That's probably a subject for another thread.
But just trying to raise and help others be aware of a potential fault area.

Cheers

 

[WelshGas]

No problem.

 

[DM]

Thanks for the warning on this. I have wondered about a very slight gas smell around the locker on a couple of occasions. I shall check it out very carefully.

 

[bigmac77]

See the nut through which the spindle passes to the handle, trying tightening it a little and check for leaks again with soapy water.

 

[Loz]

The nut tightens up a packing gland that should stop the leak, is the nut unscrewing with the knob?

If you open the valve, wipe the shaft with some silicone grease and the then wind it back closed, then tighten the nut as much as you can whilst the valve still operates.

 

[Shadrack]

Thanks guys,
Lot of info here which helps and confirms my suspicions.
I did not want to touch it initially or try and fix as I had thought that the dealer should be made aware.
I have just checked again to make sure I have found the leak. The nut is tight I think as I can see that it has had a red pipe sealer on the thread which has glued the nut probably before the gland was sealed correctly, or it could be crossed.

But the points raised regarding the packing gland are borne out by the fact that the spindle of the valve wobbles a bit and this can clearly be heard to affect the amount of escaping gas.
The item itself is less than a tenner to buy.

I will pop into my local dealer to raise the potentially dangerousness issue and give him the opportunity to fix replace or whatever.

I do know that I will be keeping my length of 1/4" pipe in the bin as a precautionary measure just to check after a bottle change..

 

[Loz]

I hate the gland type valves. is there a lever option you could fit?

 

[Shadrack]

Update,

I have been to local VW van centre who basically don't want to know me as although a van centre don't service gas.

I have sent an email to supplying dealer to resolve for me...

I have dismantled and reassembled and there is nothing to tighten up, ie a packing gland etc... Just a not very good engineered centre spindle with a poor fitting seal.

I will update with solution....

 

[briwy]

I've mentioned this previously but this is what we have. Done this in all our campers for the past ten years.
Scrapped the VW tap, normal Camping Gaz type regulator type with a quick release in the tube. Now easy to get the bottle in/out without the faff.

 

[Shadrack]

Thanks for info Briwy. Whilst I agree it looks a good workaround.
I am dealing with a brand new ocean with guarantees etc. I don't think modifying original pipe work by myself would help my cause at this stage.. It could raise other implications...
But thank you for suggesting.

So when the faulty item is hopefully replaced.. I should be cooking.

 

[CYCLOPATH]

So what is this on the back of my vanI thaught that meant the gas had passed a test

 

[T6 CFO]

It means the man who stuck it on thought it had passed but we don't know if we can trust that man.



Mike

 

[Shadrack]

As I mentioned when I first posted cyclopath. I believe this is just added after tests etc have been completed.
The valves maybe are tested and I have got one that escaped for some reason.

But as I did mention this could open up a bag of worms and lose in the detail what I believe is more important and that's those that may have had the odd whiff and not been sure of its origin.
I am sure my supplying dealer will replace and all will be sorted...

 

[Shadrack]

Sorry I may have confused. When I said this is added after the tests etc, I meant the valve is added after and not tested with the safety valve attached to the regulator.

The valve may only be a requirement for certain markets. So added after the car has rolled off the production line when all testing has been completed.

 

[CYCLOPATH]

Sorry I may have confused. When I said this is added after the tests etc, I meant the valve is added after and not tested with the safety valve attached to the regulator.

The valve may only be a requirement for certain markets. So added after the car has rolled off the production line when all testing has been completed.

Yeah, I see what you mean.
They probably just pressure test the line....there was a long post on that

 

[Loz]

Thanks for info Briwy. Whilst I agree it looks a good workaround.
I am dealing with a brand new ocean with guarantees etc. I don't think modifying original pipe work by myself would help my cause at this stage.. It could raise other implications...
But thank you for suggesting.

So when the faulty item is hopefully replaced.. I should be cooking.

I understand where your coming from; but, with all the hassle of the trip to the dealer and potentially a similarly designed valve going back on, would you be able to trust it?
Personally I would just go to an approved gas supplier like a camping shop and ask them to fit a better quality valve.

 

[briwy]

I'd be interested to know what valve is fitted in countries where Camping Gaz is not available. Anyone know?
Has anyone found an alternative cylinder that fits in the hole?

 

[Loz]

907s are pretty much available everywhere we have been, we ran low on one of our trips to Morocco where most of the rural/mountain communities use them for all home cooking and lighting, we went to one of the local stores(hut at side of the road) to get refill(swap) and was given the oldest battered thing you have ever seen, after a short exchange of meaningless gestures he invited me to take my pick from his stock which consisted of a 3 tonne pickup piled up to the roof with similar tat.

Needless to say when I got back and needed another refill the supplier refused to take it in exchange and I had to buy another, so I always make sure I start my trips with a new refill...

 

[WelshGas]

I'd be interested to know what valve is fitted in countries where Camping Gaz is not available. Anyone know?
Has anyone found an alternative cylinder that fits in the hole?

Is the California actually sold in any country that does not have Camping suppliers/stockists?

 

[briwy]

I was thinking of Scandanavia. What do folks there do for gas as there CampingGaz appears to be unavailable there?
BTW. the VW valve screw on bit fits onto a Calor bottle. However as there is no rubber seal in it I don't know if it would work OK but just wondering if it is a standard fitting for some sort of German/continental bottle.
I'm aware the a Calor bottle won't fit but perhaps there is something else that does.
On our Norway this year and Iceland next year trips I'm taking a 2m length of hose and a spare snap fit connector so that we can fit a local bottle if we run out of CampingGaz

 

[Loz]

On our Norway this year and Iceland next year trips I'm taking a 2m length of hose and a spare snap fit connector so that we can fit a local bottle if we run out of CampingGaz

That is a top idea, a bit like taking adaptors for the EHU cable...

 

[bvddobb]

Has anyone found an alternative cylinder that fits in the hole?

It is difficult to find a gas bottle that fits in the Cali gas bun, but we have found this refillable aluminum bottle:

It can be ordered from one of their German dealers.

We have also found the standard valve that comes with the Cali is not so good a solution. We have had situations while on holiday where the valve completely blocked, wouldn't open anymore and had to be changed, where the black weel broke off, etc. We went to a gasfitters specialty shop, showed them our situation and they advised us on another type of valve that would fit on the bottle and in the bun:

Much sturdier design! And it happens to be the same valve that is delivered with the aluminum bottles mentioned above...

I was thinking of Scandanavia. What do folks there do for gas as there CampingGaz appears to be unavailable there?

We just bring an extra bottle with us...

But if you go there in winter you may want to use the aluminum bottle above and have it filled with propane. Campinggaz is mostly butane, and that doesn't evaporate below 4 degrees Celsius. That is why they sell propane in Scandinavia, not Campinggaz/butane...
Having said that, we have never had issues with the Campinggaz/butane in subzero Celsius temperatures ourselves yet. It seems the warmth in the vehicle and the insulation of the water tank around the gas allows for use in some not to deep below zero outside temperatures without issues.