Hard suspension

[Gasf]

I have had a '61 Cali 4motion for about 9 months now. Really good and have and many trips. However I do think the suspension is hard - great on a smooth road but it seems that even the slightest bump is jarring and bigger bumps seem to crash through vehicle and are uncomfortable.

Is this normal? Is there anything I can do about it? Am I overly sensitive?

Thanks

 

[barry]

I have had a '61 Cali 4motion for about 9 months now. Really good and have and many trips. However I do think the suspension is hard - great on a smooth road but it seems that even the slightest bump is jarring and bigger bumps seem to crash through vehicle and are uncomfortable.

Is this normal? Is there anything I can do about it? Am I overly sensitive?

Thanks

I think the habitation stuff in the Cali tends to exaggerate the noise that normally derives from the operation of the suspension. I guess it's less rigid than the T5 van bits. That would be my guess anyway...

 

[Custardtart]

I agree that the ride isn't as forgiving as I'd expected.

I was intending to put 18" wheels on but for that reason have stuck with the 17".

 

[James]

I agree that the ride isn't as forgiving as I'd expected.

I was intending to put 18" wheels on but for that reason have stuck with the 17".

I found the full Cali much harsher than the Beach, although the Cali was a better cruiser than my Beach, the full Cali does seem to have what I call kickback from the weight in the back. I wouldn't say the suspension was hard it does feel like everything is crashing about a bit in the back. I can understand why people lower them. If I had a full Cali, it would be the first thing I'd do.

Have you already had it lowered?

James

 

[calikev]

It's not the size of the wheel it's more to do with the profile of the tyre But you find the larger the wheel the less choice there is in tyre's and they all tend to be low profile

 

[briwy]

I'm not sure that lowering it will make the suspension softer. If anything it will make it worse as due to the shorter suspension travel the springs need to be harder to prevent it bottoming out.
Softer springs and uprated shockers would probably do it.
Might be an idea to speak to some suspension specialists who can advise the correct spring rates etc.
I found ours bouncy rather than hard, depends how much weight is on board as well.

 

[Mike Maguire]

My newly acquired 08 174 Tip (only 60k miles) has a problem with rear end suspension. The fixed towbar bottoms slightly on drops in road level (we live on an unfinished Redrow estate) or more severe road humps. Seems this is a common problem for T5 based campers, the rear suspension can't fully handle all the weight on "dynamic" road sections and needs more performance than its specced to provide!

Am about to experiment with a low cost "solution"
1. Rubber coil spring assisters http://www.springassisters.co.uk/menu.htm
2. And relatively low cost uprated rear shocks. (Monroe Magnums.)

Have used these Grayston assisters on 3 different model VW Passats (B4, B5, B6) with great success and they're an easy diy job, as are the rear shocks. Might then consider uprating the front shocks.

 

[sidepod]

As you stated it’s not bad on smooth roads. Drive it around Europe and you’ll probably think it’s actually quite a nice ride.

It’s just a case of the appalling excuse for roads we put up with in the UK.

 

[WelshGas]

My newly acquired 08 174 Tip (only 60k miles) has a problem with rear end suspension. The fixed towbar bottoms slightly on drops in road level (we live on an unfinished Redrow estate) or more severe road humps. Seems this is a common problem for T5 based campers, the rear suspension can't fully handle all the weight on "dynamic" road sections and needs more performance than its specced to provide!

Am about to experiment with a low cost "solution"
1. Rubber coil spring assisters http://www.springassisters.co.uk/menu.htm
2. And relatively low cost uprated rear shocks. (Monroe Magnums.)

Have used these Grayston assisters on 3 different model VW Passats (B4, B5, B6) with great success and they're an easy diy job, as are the rear shocks. Might then consider uprating the front shocks.

That’s a new one. If you are referring to posts here and elsewhere that the T5 Backend “ sags “ compared to the Front end because of the differing Wheel to Wheel Arch distances. This is by design as detailed in the VW Technical Drawings here.

https://www.bb-database.com/jctumbau/transporter-technische-zeichnungen

 

[Mike Maguire]

That’s a new one. If you are referring to posts here and elsewhere that the T5 Backend “ sags “ compared to the Front end because of the differing Wheel to Wheel Arch distances. This is by design as detailed in the VW Technical Drawings here.

https://www.bb-database.com/jctumbau/transporter-technische-zeichnungen

Er no, not referring to that at all, simply that the rear end needs a little beefing up to stop bottoming on the fixed towbar. Certainly no harm in slightly uprated fresh shock absorbers, and if the spring assisters prove too harsh, they'll have to come out. If they work here as they have done on three estates, that'll be a great low cost improvement for under £50. Happy to put up with a slight increase in firmness. At present, with the fixed towbar in place, & which I need, this is a problem even when lightly loaded, water tanks empty, no luggage & just one or two of us onboard.
Should add that the Cali came shod with brand new Vreidestein Comtrac Winter van tyres on alloy 16" wheels and I'm happy that the 215/65 profile is relatively compliant in minimizing harshness.

But only doing this will tell if an acceptable solution!

 

[sidepod]

I can’t quite get my head around how a tow car can hit the deck? It must be lowered to a daft ride height?

 

[Skewif]

I can’t quite get my head around how a tow car can hit the deck? It must be lowered to a daft ride height?

Prior to raising mine up from std height I have many times dragged my tow bar on people’s steep driveways. Without mud flaps it’s the departure angle greatest limiter.

 

[Mike Maguire]

Prior to raising mine up from std height I have many times dragged my tow bar on people’s steep driveways. Without mud flaps it’s the departure angle greatest limiter.

Yes, I can see that happening as well. In my experience so far, if I were to slow down considerably for every substantial speed bump and either slow right down or speed up considerably for sharp drops in road level I could avoid this tow bar issue, but fully loaded will always be all too aware of the possibility. If what I propose works, then the rear will retain ride height better under full load as well.

How did you go about increasing ride height?

 

[Skewif]

Yes, I can see that happening as well. In my experience so far, if I were to slow down considerably for every substantial speed bump and either slow right down or speed up considerably for sharp drops in road level I could avoid this tow bar issue, but fully loaded will always be all too aware of the possibility. If what I propose works, then the rear will retain ride height better under full load as well.

How did you go about increasing ride height?

I fitted some extra HD aftermarket spring (Pedders) and some HD Shocks. This is not really a viable option for most people as it lifted the rear around 55mm but as I was raising the front also for off road driving it worked for me. I changed the shocks on the rear before fitting the springs and this alone made a huge difference in reducing bottoming out the suspension / tow bar when coming off a speed ramp / entering dips etc. I have no doubt you will find the same when you swap yours.
I've never used spring assisters but as an alternate option you could look into is replacing your tired old springs with some T32 ones. You can pick delivery milage ones of these up for pennies at almost any van styler / converter / eBay as often removed when people lower their new vans. Will rase the rear about 20mm and combined with new HD shocks will substantially improve the ride quality, stability, bounciness and body roll. Worth a thought as know many who have done this and all (so far) have been very happy.

 

[2into1]

It's not the size of the wheel it's more to do with the profile of the tyre

I used to agree with this 100% but I'm now thinking the different specified tyre pressures play a role too. My 215/60/17s need to be at 54psi according to the sticker. Had it come with the 235/55s that my old T5 had, it would have been between 41 and 45psi depending on load.

So plus at least 10psi won't be helping with my ride that does feel harsh (although better insulated in the T6 vs the 5).

 

[briwy]

You can also look at fitting air bags inside the coil springs. Cheap fix around £100 before going mad with new springs and dampers.

 

[Skewif]

You can also look at fitting air bags inside the coil springs. Cheap fix around £100 before going mad with new springs and dampers.

For £100 one can buy a new pair of shocks and a pair of near new HD springs. Decent / HD rear shocks are best / easiest bang for buck ride improvement IMO.

 

[Mike Maguire]

Er no, not referring to that at all, simply that the rear end needs a little beefing up to stop bottoming on the fixed towbar. Certainly no harm in slightly uprated fresh shock absorbers, and if the spring assisters prove too harsh, they'll have to come out. If they work here as they have done on three estates, that'll be a great low cost improvement for under £50. Happy to put up with a slight increase in firmness. At present, with the fixed towbar in place, & which I need, this is a problem even when lightly loaded, water tanks empty, no luggage & just one or two of us onboard.
Should add that the Cali came shod with brand new Vreidestein Comtrac Winter van tyres on alloy 16" wheels and I'm happy that the 215/65 profile is relatively compliant in minimizing harshness.

But only doing this will tell if an acceptable solution!

UPDATE
So I went the whole hog and had fitted both rubber spring assisters and Bilstein B6 rear shocks. This has transformed the rear suspension from overly bouncy to very firm & controlled when pretty well "empty" (no water , little "luggage & 2 persons onboard". Have tested on severe humps to the extent that the front suspension has hit the bump stops & yet the rear is entirely firmly damped & composed. Very slightly raised rear ride height and a much more upright stance cornering posture! I am so delighted!

Anyone contemplating a similar uprating to the rear suspension might also consider, as suggested by Skewif, replacing the rear springs with those from the T32 version instead of spring assisters. This would probably result in a little more travel in the rear suspension.

And just to advise, the correct size spring assisters are a pretty tight fit in the springs and required 2 people on removal from the Cali. As it turned out I was so delighted with the way all the work was undertaken by Performance Driven + Taunton. Their attention to detail was impressive, including cleaning up the wheel hub faces & lightly applying "coppaslip" to prevent future issues with removing the alloy wheels. This was extended to all 4 wheels and included a verbal report on the wear of the brake pads all round. If you're local and looking for mechanical work of any sort on the base vehicle, you can find them here … https://www.performancedriven.co.uk/ .