Leaking pop tops on 2023 California Oceans

[SusiBus]

One hour report.
Nicely beading on the outside.
Totally dry on the inside.
Think I might have to sleep in the van tonight so as to get hourly observations. Didn't think to remove the mattress, but it's still in the plastic bag. Not really a full test because its only vertical rain, not horizontal, but it is the wet type!!
Isn't life exciting owning a Cali?!

 

[OxonCalifornia]

Ok , so it’s been torrential constantly for the last hour and the results are in!
Front canvass is very wet and the splashing at the rear have caused that area to be soaked too. Gentle breeze with rain at an angle onto the front bellows.

As before EVERY AREA is DRY except the drivers, offside vertical corner seam which had a shy, timid drip before but now has breached with steady dripping and kitchen towel wet.

Ironically the front corner getting most exposure is the passenger near side yet this is dry. Rear corners dry too.

I have included photo of offside and near side inner canvass vertical corner seam. Plus short video. You can see the difference between the wet and dry kitchen towel .

I’m suspecting that some treatment is possibly being sprayed on the corner seams now at manufacture stage or factory but perhaps my front offside didn’t get the attention it needed?

Anyway , although not a complete success the situated is vastly improved to what some Cali owners on here have endured so I think we can partly say that’s a success as we all know what will put this right, don’t we costing £10?

I will contact dealer / VWEO tomorrow to register it as there’s nothing wrong to be on the O6S waiting list but I really don’t think there’s much work to do now with these Bellows?

Overall I’m happy how it stood up to the test that’s been ongoing since 1pm today and I have to say the visual quality of the bellows are very good.

Right I think that’s enough for one day…hope it was useful?

 

[OxonCalifornia]

Unfortunately the video will not upload but just was of one slow drip

 

[OxonCalifornia]

So just been out there again as there has been a rest bite and the good news in there were only sufficient drips to make one end of the paper towel damp..the other end is dry so there hasn’t been that much to absorb …I like to end in a positive note as we all have to make this work for us.

 

[flying banana]

So just been out there again as there has been a rest bite and the good news in there were only sufficient drips to make one end of the paper towel damp..the other end is dry so there hasn’t been that much to absorb …I like to end in a positive note as we all have to make this work for us.

View attachment 126385

so it leaks then

 

[OxonCalifornia]

so it leaks then

Well if you call about 10 drips from just one stitch hole within the whole of the canvas roof over 8 hrs of rain with the last hour an absolute torrent, with just the end of a single piece of kitchen paper becoming damp, then yes a leak ….but bearing in mind where we have come from I would say that was a result and an improvement from poor Mark Browns situation. I get far more than that in the bilge of my boat and I consider her to be seaworthy and functional. It would only take a 2sec burst of a can to sort that spot out to be water tight, but will speak with dealer first. I think there needs to be some credit for the progress made? Yes I totally agree it shouldn’t have happened in the first place..believe me I would be the first to rage PX’ing my 2022 van with O2S bellows only a week ago but you have to think beyond these challenges and be positive…VW clearly have by just about solving the issue that’s been haunting them and new Cali customers for the last 2 years.

 

[myvanrodney]

So just been out there again as there has been a rest bite and the good news in there were only sufficient drips to make one end of the paper towel damp..the other end is dry so there hasn’t been that much to absorb …I like to end in a positive note as we all have to make this work for us.

View attachment 126385

Those four corner vertical seams are the only ones left that are not taped….

 

[VanBlancLives]

@OxonCalifornia I don’t think the odd drip is a bad result for a new canvas especially given the deluges. I am getting an 05S fitted in a few weeks and plan to treat it at least annually.

Probably the best guide is to do what Isabella recommended for their tents and awnings which I believe is to clean and treat twice a year before and after use.

 

[SusiBus]

Bad news. It's leaking quite considerably. Can't bear talking about this at the moment. Full story and pics tomorrow.

 

[Corradobrit]

So 05S is still a crap shoot. Nice one VW.

 

[RockinNRollin]

I think that's pretty positive; in such humid conditions you'll normally get at least that much condensation. I also wonder if the test is repeated after the canvas has had chance to dry out if it'll perform better as there is some evidence to suggest the canvas can benefit from a full wetting to help it seal up.

 

[OxonCalifornia]

I'm registering with dealer today and also have a video to see if they will accept as evidence so dont have to return for their hosepipe test and then can aquatex afterwards whilst waiting for O6S if ever i wanted / needed to go down that route - or if ever their will be an O6S?.VW may just as well give those horizontal corner seams a waterproofing spray and job done.
Does anyone have the VWEO email for Rhiannon as Id like to log this with her today too.?
The more that is flagged the greater the need for VW to progress.

 

[VanBlancLives]

I think that's pretty positive; in such humid conditions you'll normally get at least that much condensation. I also wonder if the test is repeated after the canvas has had chance to dry out if it'll perform better as there is some evidence to suggest the canvas can benefit from a full wetting to help it seal up.

100%, folk need to take a look at how and what the big tent / awning manufacturers do achieve ongoing water proof.

Quality

www.isabella.net

In particular this advice about proofing and new canvases.

Hvordan pakker jeg mit fortelt rigtig sammen?

www.isabella.net

 

[myvanrodney]

I'm registering with dealer today and also have a video to see if they will accept as evidence so dont have to return for their hosepipe test and then can aquatex afterwards whilst waiting for O6S if ever i wanted / needed to go down that route - or if ever their will be an O6S?.VW may just as well give those horizontal corner seams a waterproofing spray and job done.
Does anyone have the VWEO email for Rhiannon as Id like to log this with her today too.?
The more that is flagged the greater the need for VW to progress.

executive.office@vwcv.co.uk

 

[Andy C Berks.]

I'm registering with dealer today and also have a video to see if they will accept as evidence so dont have to return for their hosepipe test and then can aquatex afterwards whilst waiting for O6S if ever i wanted / needed to go down that route - or if ever their will be an O6S?.VW may just as well give those horizontal corner seams a waterproofing spray and job done.
Does anyone have the VWEO email for Rhiannon as Id like to log this with her today too.?
The more that is flagged the greater the need for VW to progress.

Not sure which dealer you use, but I am with Marshalls in Reading (may not be that far from you) and both times they replaced my bellows they accepted my own photos rather than having me in separately for the hose test. Just mentioning in case that’s more convenient for you. I didn’t purchase via them.

 

[OxonCalifornia]

Updated via email dealer & VWEO today about last nights little drips so that max info is provided to technical. Uploaded photos and the video ( that I can’t upload on this site) and await response? I’m after it just to be registered and fault accepted so that if a O6S bellows version comes in due course I’ve got the option to upgrade. I’m not that interested in a replacement. I stressed that I believed the current fault to be the four vertical corner seams. In the meantime I’d be happy to use Aquatex if authorised or if not for VW to supply / refund cost of a topper. I’ve headed it up FAO Rhiannon so let’s see what happens so I can continue to plan my summer adventures with confidence & positive enjoyment with a gorgeous camper-van we all know as our Cali’s..

 

[SusiBus]

Spent some considerable time roof testing during last night's downpour, and the findings on the O5S material is that not only does it look good but it was pretty well waterproof, beading nicely on the outside while remaining touch dry on the inside. All the zips and their stitching remained perfectly dry. Yes there were a few water beads on the lower corner seams coming though a few stitching holes I had noticed before the rain test, but not enough to write home about, or should I say to write to VW about. I intend to get our VW Dealer to spay it with Aquatex, which he said he had done for another customer. Hopefully this will absolve us of any future warranty problems.

BUT, water penetrated in from under the lower edge of the rubber seal between the fabric and the bodywork. Pooling in the front corners, also coming in from around the hinges then running down to under the front headlining.
What I think was happening was that water was gathering in the channels around the roof rubber seal because the drain holes couldn't cope with the quantity of water, then leaking UNDER the rubber seal that is being pulled upwards because the fabric is very taut in the corners.
VW are aware of this type of problem because it affected their EOS previously.
What's the cure?
1.Not put the roof up during heavy rain, no.
2. Aquatex the outer corners, yes.
3. Mastic under or around the rubber seal?
4. Reduce the tension on the bellows to stop the seal lifting?
5. Fit a better rubber seal to the bellows. Can't see that happening at this late stage.
6. Kick it around hoping it will go away, probably.
Over to you VW!

 

[WelshGas]

Spent some considerable time roof testing during last night's downpour, and the findings on the O5S material is that not only does it look good but it was pretty well waterproof, beading nicely on the outside while remaining touch dry on the inside. All the zips and their stitching remained perfectly dry. Yes there were a few water beads on the lower corner seams coming though a few stitching holes I had noticed before the rain test, but not enough to write home about, or should I say to write to VW about. I intend to get our VW Dealer to spay it with Aquatex, which he said he had done for another customer. Hopefully this will absolve us of any future warranty problems.

BUT, water penetrated in from under the lower edge of the rubber seal between the fabric and the bodywork. Pooling in the front corners, also coming in from around the hinges then running down to under the front headlining.
What I think was happening was that water was gathering in the channels around the roof rubber seal because the drain holes couldn't cope with the quantity of water, then leaking UNDER the rubber seal that is being pulled upwards because the fabric is very taut in the corners.
VW are aware of this type of problem because it affected their EOS previously.
What's the cure?
1.Not put the roof up during heavy rain, no.
2. Aquatex the outer corners, yes.
3. Mastic under or around the rubber seal?
4. Reduce the tension on the bellows to stop the seal lifting?
5. Fit a better rubber seal to the bellows. Can't see that happening at this late stage.
6. Kick it around hoping it will go away, probably.
Over to you VW!

Don’t worry they’ll have it all sorted on the New California.

 

[OxonCalifornia]

Spent some considerable time roof testing during last night's downpour, and the findings on the O5S material is that not only does it look good but it was pretty well waterproof, beading nicely on the outside while remaining touch dry on the inside. All the zips and their stitching remained perfectly dry. Yes there were a few water beads on the lower corner seams coming though a few stitching holes I had noticed before the rain test, but not enough to write home about, or should I say to write to VW about. I intend to get our VW Dealer to spay it with Aquatex, which he said he had done for another customer. Hopefully this will absolve us of any future warranty problems.

BUT, water penetrated in from under the lower edge of the rubber seal between the fabric and the bodywork. Pooling in the front corners, also coming in from around the hinges then running down to under the front headlining.
What I think was happening was that water was gathering in the channels around the roof rubber seal because the drain holes couldn't cope with the quantity of water, then leaking UNDER the rubber seal that is being pulled upwards because the fabric is very taut in the corners.
VW are aware of this type of problem because it affected their EOS previously.
What's the cure?
1.Not put the roof up during heavy rain, no.
2. Aquatex the outer corners, yes.
3. Mastic under or around the rubber seal?
4. Reduce the tension on the bellows to stop the seal lifting?
5. Fit a better rubber seal to the bellows. Can't see that happening at this late stage.
6. Kick it around hoping it will go away, probably.
Over to you VW!

I should think we experienced the same amount of rain last night? My Cali was on level ground, was yours or pointing down at the front allowing more water to collect and required to get away?
My observation last night is that the material doesn’t look overstretched or appear to pull significantly at the rubber base and no water ingress was in that area for me..just from one of the corner vertical seams where it flares out. Perhaps your hydraulics are applying too much tension and need adjustment?

 

[SusiBus]

I should think we experienced the same amount of rain last night? My Cali was on level ground, was yours or pointing down at the front allowing more water to collect and required to get away?
My observation last night is that the material doesn’t look overstretched or appear to pull significantly at the rubber base and no water ingress was in that area for me..just from one of the corner vertical seams where it flares out. Perhaps your hydraulics are applying too much tension and need adjustment?

Yes it was pointing down hill, but that is the way I would choose to park if on a slope. I think you may be right in that the pump is over tensioning the bellows, but is the pump adjustable. I put that on the list when l contact the VW dealer, thanks for your input.

 

[OxonCalifornia]

Well this is the new tag from our bellows and i have just seen my area has a yellow rain warning from 3pm today for 4 hours, so it will be roof up and lets see how we get on.View attachment 126310

How did your new Bellows get on with all the rain?

 

[SusiBus]

Those four corner vertical seams are the only ones left that are not taped….

Where did you get the information that these seems are not taped. It seems strange that they wouldn't be, when they are so vulnerable?

 

[myvanrodney]

Where did you get the information that these seems are not taped. It seems strange that they wouldn't be, when they are so vulnerable?

I looked at them ;-)

All the other seams have a black tape sandwiched into the stitching. As the new bellows versions have been released (I can only speak for 03, 04 and 05) so more seams were being taped. It seems these were either left deliberately (not targeted as a known failing joint) or considered unnecessary. Im not sure why....

 

[myvanrodney]

I looked at them ;-)

All the other seams have a black tape sandwiched into the stitching. As the new bellows versions have been released (I can only speak for 03, 04 and 05) so more seams were being taped. It seems these were either left deliberately (not targeted as a known failing joint) or considered unnecessary. Im not sure why....

Id like to add, for my bellows at least, that the water tightness is massively improved over our 03S. The leak was small beads of water being drawn through the seam, with just a couple of drops sitting on the roof deck. Im sure temperature and humidity differences between inside and outside would contribute to the extent of this capillary effect.

We are so close!

 

[P600BOO]

I looked at them ;-)

All the other seams have a black tape sandwiched into the stitching. As the new bellows versions have been released (I can only speak for 03, 04 and 05) so more seams were being taped. It seems these were either left deliberately (not targeted as a known failing joint) or considered unnecessary. Im not sure why....

I think you might be confusing the black mosquito netting that is stitch into all the window seams but not into the vertical side seams. My side seams look like they have got a clear film on the back of them.